Bhai Shaitaan, Sometimes you have to leave these Chaps to shoot themselves in the foot.  THey love doing that or maybe their lack of intelligence does not enable them to do differently.

who the hell is saying that there did not exist in Burnham time a nexus between corrupt police and criminals?

this condition exists under PPP rule in 2015 . . . ask the people on the Corentyne

wha . . . u got a straw man factory business going?

There is irrefutable evidence that the police and military are involved in many crimes taking place in Guyana, and that they are being funded by the PPP. As a matter of fact, more police and army personal are in the pockets of the PPP than there ever was under the PNC. Just look at the murders that the PPP ordered on protesters in Linden not so long ago.

I clearly do not trust you to report honestly. I have seen the dishonesty with which you campaigned and you even informed me you pattern your methodology along the lines of Rowe and his mentor Lee Atwater. I take you at your word. I do not know the speech. I have not heard it and I therefore demand more of it than you recounting a snippet since you would have been 10 when it was delivered.

Why is it that Father Morrison not mention this evil speech in his book? Why  in the annals of Ramharack et al who live on this bilge and created a website for the purpose of illustrating Burhnam's evil and his intent to transfer wealth from Indians to blacks via theft not mentioned? Get me the damn speech in its entirety. It is not that I think it could not have happened. I do not want dubious claims made to refute real and present Indian fear mongering by real and present crooks.

Dude, I am the one who posted the complete X 13 transcripts here almost a decade ago. Why would I care if his mention of a speech which is innocuous compared to that?

I simply will not allow anecdotes displace what is real and present race baiting by a horrible regime that we are trying mightily to unseat. You might not care of it and it may work to your advantage but the preoccupation with past injustices to allay present evil is vile. It is not honest so him calling me dishonest is a laugh.

Might have said that in the 60s. 

Not in the 70s.  Why?  Because having nationalised the entire economy he didnt have to convince blacks of anything.  Saul ran the Guyana Rice Board and Guysuco was as dominated by Africans at its management levels as it is today by Indians.  BTW those Africans were Bookers hold overs, some having even retired to the UK to enjoy their Booker's pensions.

This might hurt your feelings, but by the 70s Indians were no longer a factor once they were assured that Cheddi was being kept in a poodle like state.

If he directed any racial invective at any group it was the Portuguese.  This to justify his split from the UF and to foster the anti colonial sympathies of his audience so that he could fool them into thinking that nationalization was good for them.

And I know that you are lying because Afro Guyanese are notorious for wearing gold (this is how they are spotted in the black islands like Barbados and St Vincent, to quote a Vincentian..."when a Guyanese smiles you have to cover your eyes from the gold shining back into your face").  In most instances the jewelry makers were INDIANS.

Next time try to lie better, or telling those who told you this that their creativity in lies is farcical.

Jagdeo has built a powerful cabal of paramilitias, most with GDF or GPF training. The puny salaries that they earn as cops and soldiers encourages these guys to "freelance" with their training, and eventually resign from the army and the police.  Henry Greene as banned from the USA for very specific reasons.

Now what should bother Shaitaan is that those guys know that they have the full protection of the PPP and so do "extra duties" harrassing small business people.  Obviously this will impact Indians disproportionately as they dominate the small business sector. 

The PPP is happy as it is with clear irony that these business people will vote PPP as the attacks justofy their ethnic insecurity.  It keeps their militias happy as well as they will make fewer demands for cashy on the power structure and are guaranteed ample access to guns as the PPP clique are also involved in gun smuggling.

Pity the poor fools who vote PPP out of fear!

Shaitaan you do know that Jagdeo smirks at the foolishness of Indians who he molds like putty.

straight up nonsense and ignar race propaganda, baseman style

nothing more needs to be said . . .

Look chap. My grandfather has zero reason to lie about Burnham.....a man he admired and respected. Also, this was a private conversation between him and I.

And it may very well have been the 60s, I don't remember. This was a minor conversation over the thousands I've had with him. This was the same man who recounts Wismar as not only a story of Blacks being violent to Indians but also of Blacks heroically saving Indians. So he is like the last dude I know who is into making stuff up to make anyone "look bad." As a matter of fact he does the very opposite, as in being vigorously introspective. He looks not for the seeds of Indian problems outside of Indian people but within.

And why would it "hurt my feelings"? Do I strike you as a Jaganite or even a PPPite? I actually agree with you and have said worse many times. Jagan was abbe antiman.

So dont you think that a more appropriate response would have been to tell Shaitaan that yes there WAS a nexus between teh criminals and thje cops in the Burnham era BUT THAT IT IS WORSE NOW under the PPP?

Your response to him suggests that to say what he said was some act of bigotry.

I honestly don't know any Blacks, Guyanese Blacks especially, that wear gold. I just don't know. The Black people I know don't wear gold like abbe Indo peasants do.

This wasn't some racial slight against Black people that they can't afford gold. I just don't recall seeing Black people we know with gold chains etc.

Maybe I just wasn't looking. I'll take your word for it that Guyanese Blacks are as into gold blinging as much as Indo peasants.

so, where and when did an ignar like u purchase the cheap cojones 'privileging' you to tell me how i should or should not respond to ANYONE!?

are u dumb, deluded or simply high? . . . take your pick

Your feelings are hurt because you love to think that Burnham spent all day scheming about how to "beat and kill nuff collie".  He spent little time doing that. His attention was more directed to starving Buxton and Linden for DARING to oppose HIM! And using the West as a scape goat for his failures, much as the Castros do.

Your grandfather mixed up decades or you just mixed them up yourself.  Maybe in in 1962-64, when there was a straight out civil war between blacks and Indians, and Burnham was playing nice to the Portuguese.

NOT in the 70s.  By then Indians were a non factor. the butt of jokes, and seen as only slightly less pathetic than Amerindians.

FACT.  In the 70s Burnham had the PPP under as tight control as Jagdeo had the PNC under Corbin. The forces which threatened Burnham came from WITHIN the Afro Guyanese community, and that is who he channeled his invective towards. 

To a power drunk Burnham Indians were like the mouse which a well fed cat plays with scares, and then walks away from once bored.  He loved nothing more than to laugh at illiterates like Nehru when they pestered him with their protests in London, Toronto and NYC.

FACT.  Most blacks thought Cheddi to be a weak and pathetic man, who couldnt even satiate his wife's legendary sexual appetite. 

Indeed the biggest joke in G/town was the fact that Janet and Forbes were allegedly caught in full sexual coitus at the sea wall. 

A lie no doubt as  Forbes would have gone to the Jagan house, "stroked" Janet in full view of Cheddi, and then smirked and said "comrade that is how you do it!"  There was a whole "No Big Ting" joke about Janet complaining of Cheddi's modest endowments, and his lack of virility!  THAT was how the PPP was viewed in the 70s by Burnham and his gang.

Blacks in the pre WPA pre shortages period felt confident that Burnham would protect them against Indians through rigging.  He didnt need their votes as he not onloy voted for them, but also for many others as well.

So why would Burnham waste time screaming about Indians when he was more upset that the ABC nations were angry with him for his betrayal of them, as he took Guyana into the arms of Cuba, North Korea, China and Eastern Europe?  This when they spent millions in the 60s to prevent exactly that. And especially after Burnham let some Cuban planes land enroute to Angola!

Are redux lost again in his rage and once again having completely forgotten what the argument was about.

We BOTH agree that there was criminal connections within the police force and the GDF under PNC rule, partially mitigated when Hoyte began hanging people.  We BOTH agree that it is WORSE now under the PPP.

So what is your issue, REALLY!

post the full exchange nah . . . u lil coward

Forbes said it in the 60's.

Shaitaan as a Yankee boy you really need to stop talking about an era that you know nothing about.

GUYANESE are notorious for GOLD TEETH.  Not just indians.  GUYANESE.  Guyanese women are notorious for their gold jewelry.  Not just Indians.  GUYANESE.  The only difference is that Indians also use jewelry as a store of wealth, where as blacks see it as mere decoration.

 But Guyanese women love their big gold bangles. GUYANESE women, not just the Indian ones.

Indeed the biggest joke in the Islands are the Guyanese and their love of gold.  ONLY Bajans have as deep a love for gold as Guyanese do, and we do know that Bajans are people who went to Guyana and returned to Barbados.

Now you might know less of this, as with increased crime people wear less gold, but in the 60s and up to the 80s gold was a Guyanese badge of honor.

You are missing the point this is is a distraction wedge issue to avoid us speaking on what are real problems; the cooked PPP. The nexus between the security forces and the police has not abated but is still a chronic disease.

I am sure the PPP would like it to go away but their failure here is a generalized failure. In the dictatorship, it may be tacit control though I have no evidence o fit. In this era it is failure to address criminality in general.

Note these people cannot take care of the little thing as noise pollution, unprincipled cab and mini bus drivers etc how in the world would they be able to address the large one as the drug culture, the junkie epidemic etc? It is completely disingenuous to be complaining about GDF robbing people when every other crime of a heinous nature involves the security forces.

As I said, it is a racist/ cultural   wedge issue no less than the idea of Moses denouncing his identity It is meant to distract from how horrible these people are.

so, what did Burnham "incite" dem blackman to do about de gold? . . . doan keep me in suspense, please

Sort of like Kruschev and Stalin.

not really

Dem boys wore (so did I )  wrist band with eagle and initials, some with gold chains, yes even da cainsta had gold in his tooth in dem days.

A possibility exists that there might have been a violent attack on some PPP supporters as they passed through a mainly African village.  We do not know the full facts as to whether the attack was staged, if it did occur, whether some unscrupulous APNU supporters acted out of order.  Or even if teh attack occurred in the first place.

What we do know is that the biggest reason why many Indians vote PPP is because of their fear of violence from a segment of the PNC support base.  The mythology of kick down the door bandits, ordered by Forbes Burnham to harrass Indians is legendary.

So this isnt a wedge issue.  Admitting that there was a nexus between law enforcement and crime in the Burnham era, but stating that it is MUCH WORSE now is how one deals with it.  Making note that this STOPPED under Hoyte is an additional point.

In other words if people chose to vote PPP it CANNOT be because they think that they will be safer. 

Corruption!!!!! More people benefit from corruption than you might think, so that mightnt disturb people as much as it should. 

I remember that Burnham speech on the gold given in the 70s. I used to stay up to listen to Burnham the orator and crook.

However, Jagdeo crossed the line.  There is more crime under the PPP than under the OLD PNC.

Kick down the door was not a military thing; it was banditry.  I used to be part of the vigilante village groups to keep watch at nights. Then, there were some dirty military people who committed crimes as happens now.

The military was only involved in raiding and seizing uncustomed goods, not the robbing of civilians.

“When they link up with the Military and come into your homes and start kicking the doors down and when they come after you, who is going to be there…?”
-Bharrat Jagdeo

There is banditry now (not military; the military should respond to the Chief Crook).  When you call the PPP police, you would be lucky to get an answer.  And if they answer, they will say we don't have anyone available to come.  And when they come, it will be hours after the bandits have left.  Who is the Minister in charge?  The PPP's General Secretary, the Goat Man.

Do not take Shaitaan on with his nonsense.  IF this speech did occur it would have been within the context of the 62-64 Civil war and obviously the PPP, including Cheddi would have had his own matching rhetoric.

In the 70s Burnham had a different focus and riling up blacks against Indians wasnt it.  He felt that Indians had no leaders, given that Cheddi had been reduced to being a little poodle begging for attention.  Cheddi's antics were mere amusement for Burnham.  So he had no need to rile up any against this.

What I do recall is much screaming about who had a "colonial mentality".  Maybe about "Potagees", given that to many blacks they were the very manifestation of this "colonial mentality".  And certainly when the Catholic Standard, together with the WPA began to mount the most vigorous resistance to the Burnham regime.

The thing is that Shaitaan doesnt know.  He is a little yankee boy.

Carib must think Burnham was a god.

I can only wonder how you can read that and think that I think that he is a god. I suggests a power drunk megalomanic and a rather smug and unpleasant character to most people.  That he outsmarted Cheddi and made him look like an idiot shows that you should stop seeing Cheddi as a god when a mere mortal outfoxed hhim.

So if Burnham was a crook, you blame Jagan for not being a bigger crook to outsmart the Burnham crook?

Burnham is dead.  Now I know PPP supporters like YOU don't know this.

Jagdeo is alive and itching to take over ownership of Guyana again. 

So who really is more concern here, and why does the fact that Burnham was a bad man mean that we should excuse Jagdeo who copies him?

Here is the difference between me and you.  I don't worship as gods mere mortals like Cheddi and Nagamootoo.  Apparently you must.  When an ordinary man is worshipped as if he is a God then those doing this are considered members of a CULT!