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FM
Former Member

CALM, NEGOTIATIONS, AND A COMMISSION OF INQUIRY

 
July 20, 2012 | By | Filed Under Features / Columnists, Peeping Tom -- Source

 

Those three persons who were killed on Wednesday in Linden during a protest demonstration did not have to die. It is so terrible and heartbreaking to think about what has happened and the pain and suffering that their families now have to endure.


And for what reason? What was the cause that led to their deaths? What were the circumstances that resulted in them being shot and subsequently to the unwarranted destruction of property?


The cause of the protestors was untenable. The protestors were agitating against the reduction – not the removal – of a subsidy that was applied to electricity and which would have led to a phased increase in rates. In terms of dollars and cents and using the average household consumption for the rest of the country, the increases would not have been prohibitive.


Yet Lindeners found themselves out in the streets calling for the impossible: that there should be no increase at all. This was an unreasonable request.


There was no way that any government would continue to allow one community to pay $15 per kilowatt hour while the rest of country pays over $50 per kilowatt hour. This was an untenable situation, just as untenable as the unreasonable stance taken that Lindeners could not afford any increase.


How could any reasonable government accept this intractable position, especially considering the high per capita subsidy, and the fact that the average household consumption for electricity in Linden is three times the national average?


That large numbers of Lindeners found themselves on the streets, has to do with the intractable positions adopted by certain leaders within the community. It was these leaders and others in the political arena who forced the scuttling of the agreement between the government and APNU over the tariff increases.


There was agreement reached, and it would have seen the increase being phased in and being complemented by development commitments to the people of Linden.


Even after the talks failed, and with it hopes for a consensus on the 2012 Budget, the PPP said it was still willing to honour the agreements made but not consummated with the opposition. So why then was it necessary to take to the streets to ask for the impossible: no increase at all?


After the first round of protests, Lindeners were made to believe that they had power in their hands. They were misled into thinking that somehow they could force the government to not increase the tariffs at all because Linden was the gateway to the interior.


This suggestion which was put to the people of Linden that somehow they could cripple interior traffic was the first salvo that went astray. The people were being pointed in the direction of confrontational politics when there was hardly an attempt at reopening negotiations.


The doors to any such discussion were further closed when some leaders insisted that Linden could not afford to pay anything more. Reason was being spurned for grandstanding.


And with the Congress of the main opposition party only days away, the grandstanding took on a different dimension, because there were those who were keen to use the people of Linden to secure their political fortunes at that Congress. Being in the limelight of the struggle would boost the standing of some leaders at the Congress.


The people of Guyana – all the people- have to understand that you must be careful which leaders you follow. There are some leaders who will take you to glory, but others will take you to the gallows and to the grave.


What happened in Linden last Wednesday should never have happened. There was no need for confrontational politics. The people were being misled into believing that by shutting down the town they could force the government to withdraw the planned increases. That cannot happen. The rest of the country will not accept such discrimination when it comes to application of electricity tariffs.


The protestors should also never have been in a situation whereby they had to block any bridge. No peaceful protests impede the rights of others. You can have a show of force without causing any disruption. Unfortunately, too often in our country, protestors have felt that their point would not be heard unless they engage in illegal conduct such as blocking thoroughfares.


The police had to act to clear the blocked bridge. That blockage was illegal, but the circumstances under which the police acted needs to be clarified, and this can only be done through the appointment of a commission of inquiry into the incidents of last Wednesday.


The circumstances that led to the deaths of those persons need to be investigated by an impartial probe team headed by someone from outside of Guyana.


Even before the police explained its side, the online media in reporting the clashes – and the media houses who were at the protest all day – had indicated that the police were attacked.


If this happened then something went radically wrong with the protests. If the police say to you to move, you must move. If the police were attacked they would have been within their rights to defend themselves.


However, there is concern as to whether they defended themselves in the only way possible and whether less lethal force could not have been used. The answer to this question is dependent on the circumstances under which the police came under attack, if indeed they were attacked.


Already we are seeing some media houses retreating from that version, but that is not anything strange in this politicized country.


The first step, therefore, in resolving this issue, has to be a call by all concerned for calm, and a willingness to reopen negotiations that were closed off after the failure to reach consensus on the Budget.


The second demand should be for an independent commission of inquiry. This should be headed by a jurist from the Caribbean and there should be public hearings.


Unless these initial actions are taken, the situation will only get worse, and the working class will find themselves being misled again and again by those who have their own agendas.

Replies sorted oldest to newest

Ministry of Home Affairs also sought to extricate itself from the action stating in a release Thursday night that the events which took place at the McKenzie-Wismar Bridge were “strictly a Police operation with no direct or indirect involvement of the Ministry of Home Affairs.” Demerara Waves 7/20/12


If the above is true it leaves much to be construed. Ministry of Home Affairs cannot pull a Pontius Pilot on this situation especially one of this magnitude and nature.

 

It was only a matter of time before political elements start to usurp economic situations to incite race hate which this will become over time. The fueling of such fires does not do anyone in Guyana any good.

FM
Originally Posted by kidmost:

Ministry of Home Affairs also sought to extricate itself from the action stating in a release Thursday night that the events which took place at the McKenzie-Wismar Bridge were “strictly a Police operation with no direct or indirect involvement of the Ministry of Home Affairs.” Demerara Waves 7/20/12


If the above is true it leaves much to be construed. Ministry of Home Affairs cannot pull a Pontius Pilot on this situation especially one of this magnitude and nature.

 

It was only a matter of time before political elements start to usurp economic situations to incite race hate which this will become over time. The fueling of such fires does not do anyone in Guyana any good.

I agree but when you have politicans who are frustrated, angry and has lots of passion, you will not get level headed thinking. The POOR Citizens died while the socalled Leaders are with their families. Sad indeed!!!

Nehru
Originally Posted by kidmost:

Ministry of Home Affairs also sought to extricate itself from the action stating in a release Thursday night that the events which took place at the McKenzie-Wismar Bridge were “strictly a Police operation with no direct or indirect involvement of the Ministry of Home Affairs.” Demerara Waves 7/20/12


If the above is true it leaves much to be construed. Ministry of Home Affairs cannot pull a Pontius Pilot on this situation especially one of this magnitude and nature.

 

It was only a matter of time before political elements start to usurp economic situations to incite race hate which this will become over time. The fueling of such fires does not do anyone in Guyana any good.

This is why an investigation should be launched examining:

 

  • The Govt's (MoHA) role and action
  • the police chain of communication/command giving orders
  • the groups/individuals in instigating/inciting the protestors
  • the Protestors and any role they played provoking the police reaction.

I'm sure there will be blame all around.

FM
Originally Posted by kidmost:

It was only a matter of time before political elements start to usurp economic situations to incite race hate which this will become over time. The fueling of such fires does not do anyone in Guyana any good.

I hope you're not implying that the AFC was inciting "race hate" by supporting the people of Linden in their very genuine economic struggles.

FM

This blind PPP hack can waste his time not ours. The people believed they had a reason and they stood to make that reason clear. They died at the hands of their government's secutity force and now we have a compound problem. Writing bilge that reduces their deaths to their own fault means this bat has morphed into a PPP monkey.

 

 

FM
Originally Posted by Ronald Sugrim:

Politicians do not have to pull the trigger. They incite and stir up people and in many cases that is enough to cause trouble. 

These people died because they had a cause that they stood for. Why is it you in your presumed infinite wisdom reduce their lives to ignorance and mediocrity if not insignificance? Those who killed them were trigger happy and it emerges from a culture of autocratic arrogance cultivated in the PPP.

FM

President Ramotar is pursuing the matter diligently and peacefully, but when you have to deal with two neemakaram opposition serving as leaches that is part of the problem, there will never be a quick and sensible solution to the problem.

FM
Originally Posted by ABIDHA:

President Ramotar is pursuing the matter diligently and peacefully, but when you have to deal with two neemakaram opposition serving as leaches that is part of the problem, there will never be a quick and sensible solution to the problem.

 President Ramotar's diligence is not sufficient. Given the PPP's habit to stymie any action that questions their integrity, he will not do.

 

As for a leech, check Mr Piggie above. 20 years he did not have a pot to piss in. Now he is in your mind the Noblesse oblige

FM
Originally Posted by Stormborn:
Originally Posted by ABIDHA:

President Ramotar is pursuing the matter diligently and peacefully, but when you have to deal with two neemakaram opposition serving as leaches that is part of the problem, there will never be a quick and sensible solution to the problem.

 President Ramotar's diligence is not sufficient. Given the PPP's habit to stymie any action that questions their integrity, he will not do.

 

As for a leech, check Mr Piggie above. 20 years he did not have a pot to piss in. Now he is in your mind the Noblesse oblige

Now he pissing all over you like you is shit.

FM
Originally Posted by baseman:
Originally Posted by Stormborn:
Originally Posted by ABIDHA:

President Ramotar is pursuing the matter diligently and peacefully, but when you have to deal with two neemakaram opposition serving as leaches that is part of the problem, there will never be a quick and sensible solution to the problem.

 President Ramotar's diligence is not sufficient. Given the PPP's habit to stymie any action that questions their integrity, he will not do.

 

As for a leech, check Mr Piggie above. 20 years he did not have a pot to piss in. Now he is in your mind the Noblesse oblige

Now he pissing all over you like you is shit.

He may attempt at that but only attempt at it. Unfortunately, it is our own among the poor  that he and those in the PPP communally defecates on when they steal us blind.

FM
Originally Posted by Ronald Sugrim:

You guys getting too personal. Let us stick to the issues.

This is a sand box not a soap box. We kick sand. That is what  I do at least. Only I happen to have my 22 in the bushes near by least these idiots whip out their own first. In any event,  somewhere in it all are kernels of wisdom; like the thieving and pillaging part by the PPP. They are Marcos class predators.

FM
Originally Posted by redux:
Originally Posted by kidmost:

It was only a matter of time before political elements start to usurp economic situations to incite race hate which this will become over time. The fueling of such fires does not do anyone in Guyana any good.

I hope you're not implying that the AFC was inciting "race hate" by supporting the people of Linden in their very genuine economic struggles.

I am quire sure, positive, there are political elements which will seek to incite race hate. Ethnic suspicians , insecurities and fears still exist in Guyana and whosoever denies this fact has got to be stupid or just plain in denial , the latter being a common and prevalent factor. 

 

GOG better make sure a full investigation and enquiry is launched by an independent commission like yesterday and severe actions taken where due. I am surprised that the Min Of Home Affairs is seeking to seperate his office from the GPF actions.

 

Now many will say look how fast PPP Govt taking action when they were negligent when indians were under attack from the so-called " Freedom Fighters' so, you see how sh1t starts ? A govt which is weak always finds itself in sh1t. Now rebel political elements will use this to stir up hatred. 

 

BTW Ramoutar better consult with Bharrat on this because I really do not think Ramoutar has the capacity to handle this situation ..remember he was always a yesman !

FM
Originally Posted by kidmost:
Originally Posted by redux:
Originally Posted by kidmost:

It was only a matter of time before political elements start to usurp economic situations to incite race hate which this will become over time. The fueling of such fires does not do anyone in Guyana any good.

I hope you're not implying that the AFC was inciting "race hate" by supporting the people of Linden in their very genuine economic struggles.

I am quire sure, positive, there are political elements which will seek to incite race hate. Ethnic suspicians , insecurities and fears still exist in Guyana and whosoever denies this fact has got to be stupid or just plain in denial , the latter being a common and prevalent factor . . .

I would settle for an answer to MY question.

 

Thanks

FM
Originally Posted by redux:
Originally Posted by kidmost:

It was only a matter of time before political elements start to usurp economic situations to incite race hate which this will become over time. The fueling of such fires does not do anyone in Guyana any good.

I hope you're not implying that the AFC was inciting "race hate" by supporting the people of Linden in their very genuine economic struggles.

Yes he is.  How dare any one stop the PPP from exactling revenge on ungrateful black people.

 

The facts are.

 

1.  Lindeners in a democracy had a right to protest.

 

2.  Linden has been a problem for a long time due to difficulties in the bauxite industry and the PPP as never been serious in developing a long term solution.

 

3.  Knowing that protests were imminent the police and the MIn of HA shoulkd have made it a priority for arrangements to be made for peaceful demonstrations w/o disrupting traffic.

 

 

Now we have an angry population worked up over what they see as a racist govt.  Coming after the previous shootings of protesting blacks and a racxist rant in a govt paper please excuse folks for thinking that there arent sinister reasons for PPP behavior. Since the election w ehave heard allo about "ungrateful black people" from people connected to the PPP.  So who is racially inciting here?

FM
Originally Posted by kidmost:
.

 

BTW Ramoutar better consult with Bharrat on this because I really do not think Ramoutar has the capacity to handle this situation ..remember he was always a yesman !


And you think Jagdeo does.  It is well within Jagdeo's nature to order a shooting.  Remember his threats before the election, even though there was no significant violence.

FM
Originally Posted by Ronald Sugrim:

You guys getting too personal. Let us stick to the issues.

Yes. The issue is for the SECOND time the PPP has shot and attempted to kill blacks who they disagree with and people like yoiu want to condone this fact.

 

A SECOND time.  I couldnt believe it thinking it was a rumor...sad but not so.

 

Let us change the facts.  Guysuco completely shuts down its Demerara operations throwing thousands out of work.  They protest blocking a major highway.  The police shoots and kills them.

 

You all will scream about how racist black police commit genocide against innocent Indians.

 

Its amazing how when we switch things around it will be seen as being different.

FM
Originally Posted by caribny:
Originally Posted by kidmost:
.

 

BTW Ramoutar better consult with Bharrat on this because I really do not think Ramoutar has the capacity to handle this situation ..remember he was always a yesman !


And you think Jagdeo does.  It is well within Jagdeo's nature to order a shooting.  Remember his threats before the election, even though there was no significant violence.

Leroy Brummel needs to answer that question.

FM
Originally Posted by Ronald Sugrim:

Politicians do not have to pull the trigger. They incite and stir up people and in many cases that is enough to cause trouble. 

Yes. Rohee didnt pull the trigger but he sure sent the message that "we gun show dem ungrateful black man" still enraged that massive black turn outs led the PPP to lsoe control of the parliament.  A PPP embarrassed after previous boasts that they will take Linden and Buxton.

 

Funny how not too long after the election the PPP pulls this stunt.  Wouldnt they have been more honest to tell Lindenerts BEFORE the election of their plans?

FM
Originally Posted by kidmost:
Originally Posted by redux:
Originally Posted by kidmost:

It was only a matter of time before political elements start to usurp economic situations to incite race hate which this will become over time. The fueling of such fires does not do anyone in Guyana any good.

I hope you're not implying that the AFC was inciting "race hate" by supporting the people of Linden in their very genuine economic struggles.

I am quire sure, positive, there are political elements which will seek to incite race hate. Ethnic suspicians , insecurities and fears still exist in Guyana and whosoever denies this fact has got to be stupid or just plain in denial , the latter being a common and prevalent factor. 

 

GOG better make sure a full investigation and enquiry is launched by an independent commission like yesterday and severe actions taken where due. I am surprised that the Min Of Home Affairs is seeking to seperate his office from the GPF actions.

 

Now many will say look how fast PPP Govt taking action when they were negligent when indians were under attack from the so-called " Freedom Fighters' so, you see how sh1t starts ? A govt which is weak always finds itself in sh1t. Now rebel political elements will use this to stir up hatred. 

 

BTW Ramoutar better consult with Bharrat on this because I really do not think Ramoutar has the capacity to handle this situation ..remember he was always a yesman !

 The PPP are resisting an independent commission. They have already taken the heavy handed action to confiscate the bodies of the deceased and did not have the decency to speak to the family to say they were taking the corpses into custody to preserve evidence.

 

The PPP insist we do not have an ethnic problem. It is the reason they resist constitutional reform. They say we have no need to change what is working. I guess that means it works for them.

 

Let the PNC wins a minority administration in the next election and all of those now reluctant to budge on constitutional reform will quickly become political theorist and suggest changes.

 

What do you think totaram, Misir et al were doing when they were not working or receiving contracts from the PPP? They were holding conferences here there and everywhere about constitutional reform. I am quite certain you possibly attended one or two,

FM
Originally Posted by Stormborn:
Let the PNC wins a minority administration in the next election and all of those now reluctant to budge on constitutional reform will quickly become political theorist and suggest changes.

The specific amendments to the constitution require a minimun of sixty-six percent of the elected members.

 

When has the current opposition members since 1992 - PNC and subsequently the AFC - made any attempts to seek the changes to the constitution?

FM
Originally Posted by redux:
Originally Posted by kidmost:
Originally Posted by redux:
Originally Posted by kidmost:

It was only a matter of time before political elements start to usurp economic situations to incite race hate which this will become over time. The fueling of such fires does not do anyone in Guyana any good.

I hope you're not implying that the AFC was inciting "race hate" by supporting the people of Linden in their very genuine economic struggles.

I am quire sure, positive, there are political elements which will seek to incite race hate. Ethnic suspicians , insecurities and fears still exist in Guyana and whosoever denies this fact has got to be stupid or just plain in denial , the latter being a common and prevalent factor . . .

I would settle for an answer to MY question.

 

Thanks

I never said nor insinuated the AFC does or will exploit the Linden siatuation to promote ethnic hatred. But now that you ask that question let me say AFC should be careful how their form alliances, passive or active, with political elements on certain issues of national interest lest such alliances be misconstrued by the sections of the public . Please allow me to ask you a question . I understand the A in AFC stands for Alliance and C for Change and since AFC sought and continues to seek to weaken the PPP and APNU stranglehold on the politics of the country why would they even share the same space and time with APNU or even the PPP when people in Guyana are hoping for distinct separation of AFC from APNU and PPP ?

FM
Originally Posted by caribny:
Originally Posted by kidmost:
.

 

BTW Ramoutar better consult with Bharrat on this because I really do not think Ramoutar has the capacity to handle this situation ..remember he was always a yesman !


And you think Jagdeo does.  It is well within Jagdeo's nature to order a shooting.  Remember his threats before the election, even though there was no significant violence.

I sad Bharrat because he used to love up with Lindeners so I figured Lindeners may recall the romantic affair they had with BJ and I dont mean blowjob !

FM
Originally Posted by kidmost:
I understand the A in AFC stands for Alliance and C for Change and since AFC sought and continues to seek to weaken the PPP and APNU stranglehold on the politics of the country why would they even share the same space and time with APNU or even the PPP when people in Guyana are hoping for distinct separation of AFC from APNU and PPP ?

The important aspect for one to remember.

 

AFC was presented as a political organisation that will pursue the interest distinct from the PNC and PPP.

 

From 2012, the AFC has integrated with the PNC.

FM
Originally Posted by Demerara_Guy:
Originally Posted by kidmost:
I understand the A in AFC stands for Alliance and C for Change and since AFC sought and continues to seek to weaken the PPP and APNU stranglehold on the politics of the country why would they even share the same space and time with APNU or even the PPP when people in Guyana are hoping for distinct separation of AFC from APNU and PPP ?

The important aspect for one to remember.

 

AFC was presented as a political organisation that will pursue the interest distinct from the PNC and PPP.

 

From 2012, the AFC has integrated with the PNC.

Don't think so, what you see are two factions at play in the AFC, the pro-PNC and the anti-PPP factions.

FM
Originally Posted by baseman:
Originally Posted by Demerara_Guy:
Originally Posted by kidmost:
I understand the A in AFC stands for Alliance and C for Change and since AFC sought and continues to seek to weaken the PPP and APNU stranglehold on the politics of the country why would they even share the same space and time with APNU or even the PPP when people in Guyana are hoping for distinct separation of AFC from APNU and PPP ?

The important aspect for one to remember.

 

AFC was presented as a political organisation that will pursue the interest distinct from the PNC and PPP.

 

From 2012, the AFC has integrated with the PNC.

Don't think so, what you see are two factions at play in the AFC, the pro-PNC and the anti-PPP factions.

AFC has succumbed to typical Guyana Politricks ! and PPP and APNU sucking them into gutter politics ! If they continue in this vein they may not even get 1 seat come next election. Remember WPA ? Started with a left and right foot and ended up with 2 left foot ! Ramjattan and Trotman should have kept the AFC open to newer , younger generation of leaders and exclude PPP and PNC derelicts . When Rodney was alive he kept WPA tight and closed for as long as he could ,many PPP and PNC stalwarts wanted in and the minute they got in Rodney got murdered , WPA fell apart and eventually became a lame foot to the PNC. Is AFC walking in the footpath of the WPA ? Are they so eager to be anti PPP that they dont mind being perceived as pro-APNU. Perception is what determine outcomes.

Lesson for AFC - when PPP and APNU act in the best interest of the people acknowledge them and when they dont lambaste they backside but dont take up a total anti line nor align oneself with an opposition which is one of the causatives for Guyana's continued demise .

FM
Originally Posted by Demerara_Guy:
Originally Posted by kidmost:
I understand the A in AFC stands for Alliance and C for Change and since AFC sought and continues to seek to weaken the PPP and APNU stranglehold on the politics of the country why would they even share the same space and time with APNU or even the PPP when people in Guyana are hoping for distinct separation of AFC from APNU and PPP ?

The important aspect for one to remember.

 

AFC was presented as a political organisation that will pursue the interest distinct from the PNC and PPP.

 

From 2012, the AFC has integrated with the PNC.


Perhaps! Perhaps Not!

Mitwah
Originally Posted by kidmost:
Ramjattan and Trotman should have kept the AFC open to newer , younger generation of leaders and exclude PPP and PNC derelicts .

Correct.

 

AFC is far removed from this position.

FM

 

We constantly hear about poverty and lack of opportunities in Linden. I clearly remember how Berbicians sought job opportunities wherever they existed during the dark days of the PNC dictatorship.

 

Some even went to neighboring Surinam to seek work and others ventured elsewhere in Guyana to seek job opportunities. 

 

Those in Linden who do not have job opportunities must do what any hard working person must do and seek employment outside of Linden. Dictator Burnham taught Linden that they were special and that opportunities will be "given" to them

 

Well, now let us call a spade a spade. Look around, smell the coffee and get off your lazy butts and seek employment. The rest of Guyanese are working very hard and seeking employment opportunities where available even though it means working elsewhere.

 

Linden pays $ 15 per kilowatt and Berbice pays $ 53 per kilowatt. What if Berbicians decide to demand the same rate as Linden ? My point is that Linden is not special and the citizens of Linden cannot continue to cry foul while the rest of  Guyanese are paying their fair share and seeking job opportunities.

 

What is so special about Linden ?

FM
Originally Posted by yuji22:

 

We constantly hear about poverty and lack of opportunities in Linden. I clearly remember how Berbicians sought job opportunities wherever they existed during the dark days of the PNC dictatorship.

 

Some even went to neighboring Surinam to seek work and others ventured elsewhere in Guyana to seek job opportunities. 

 

Those in Linden who do not have job opportunities must do what any hard working person must do and seek employment outside of Linden. Dictator Burnham taught Linden that they were special and that opportunities will be "given" to them

 

Well, now let us call a spade a spade. Look around, smell the coffee and get off your lazy butts and seek employment. The rest of Guyanese are working very hard and seeking employment opportunities where available even though it means working elsewhere.

 

Linden pays $ 15 per kilowatt and Berbice pays $ 53 per kilowatt. What if Berbicians decide to demand the same rate as Linden ? My point is that Linden is not special and the citizens of Linden cannot continue to cry foul while the rest of  Guyanese are paying their fair share and seeking job opportunities.

 

What is so special about Linden ?

The appeal to the "dark days of the dictatorship" is spurious. You have dark days here as our assets are being raped Marcos style by the present administration and impoverishing the majority of the people who 20 years into their rule still average 3 dollars a day, slightly above the worse in the world.

 

Linden's assets were multilated via craven deals. OMAI then Iamgold  then BOSAI saw the trading of paper enriching the holders of those paper to the disadvantage of citizens. Good old Ramator was would definitely know how those deals were handled since he was on OMAI board when the got the mine assets for some 5 million in cash  and later to be resold some four years later when BOSAI paid 40 million. This was not inclusive of properties owned by company which fell into a black hole at NICIL.

 

If berbice pays 53 dollars complain to GPL. BOSAI is making a profit selling to lindeners. I wonder if paying rent per year for 12 old  power plants at  the rate of 700Us per plant when they cost 900kUS has anything to do with it?

FM

 

Berbicians are not complaining and destroying and burning because they are civilised and understand that they must pay for what they use.

 

Linden thinks that they deserve a right to pay 1/3 the rate as rest of the country. The government must stop spending billions of tax payers dollars subsiding Linden.


The either pay up or stop using electricity. Period.

 

In North America, you either pay up or your electricity gets cut off, end of story.


If some in Linden cannot afford electricity then they should stop using electricity, it is that simple.

 

The rest of Guyana cannot pay for the poor spending habits of Linden. End of story.

FM

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