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Dear Editor,

I have been following with interest the exchange of ideas on the issue of national unity which is so vital for a prosperous Guyana. At the sociological level, there is a fair measure of inter-ethnic cohesion. People in Guyana of all ethnic groups relate to each other with the greatest of cordiality and respect. This speaks well of our maturity as a people despite attempts by some people to take advantage of our diversity to further their own self-interests.

At the political level, class and ideology and not race have always been the dominant factors. The split of the PPP in 1955 was based more on political opportunism rather than on racial considerations. Were race the issue, Jagan would not have enjoyed the support of Afro-Guyanese in the party leadership such as Martin Carter, Rory Westmaas, George Robertson, Fred Bowman, Lionel Jeffrey, Sydney King (Eusi Kwayana), among others, and Burnham would not have enjoyed the support of JP Lachmansingh and other big businessmen, the majority of whom were non-Africans. The party leadership saw the split in ideological terms. That explained why of the 11-non-Indians of the PPP General Council, only three joined with Burnham.

With the passage of time the class unity which was forged by Dr Jagan and the PPP in the early 1950s became somewhat fractured by the intrigues of power-hungry politicians with the support of foreign vested interests, again for political/ideological reasons. The PPP was too much to the left for the liking of western interests and their supporters locally. The removal of the PPP from office in 1953 and 1964 was essentially ideologically driven with a strong class bias.

The point I am seeking to make is that class and not race was, and to a large extent continues to be a dominant factor in our politics. It was the dominance of class interests that led to the assassination of Walter Rodney on June 13, 1980 after he resolutely opposed the anti-working class positions taken by the PNC. The pauperization of the Guyanese working people including the Afro-Guyanese segment of the working class began under the Burnham administration and continued well into the Desmond Hoyte years.

National unity cannot be created in a vacuum. It has to be built around an agreed national framework which must in the first instance be reflective of the democratic aspirations of the Guyanese people and on a broadly agreed programme of national development. It was this difficulty to arrive at an acceptable framework for national development that has led to the failure of earlier attempts to forge national consensus on the way forward for Guyana. The situation was not helped by rigged national elections and the PNC’s insistence that it was the ‘Bolshevik’ party and therefore could not negotiate on equal terms with a ‘Menshevik’ party when the whole world knew otherwise.

It is time for us all to understand the true genesis of our poverty and under-development which has very little if anything to do with race and ethnicity, but more with the promulgation of programmes and policies which are people-centred and development-oriented. This is exactly what the current PPP/C opposition is committed to do, namely to create a society in which there is social justice for all Guyanese regardless of their race or ethnic background.

Yours faithfully,

Hydar Ally

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Excellent argument up to the last sentence: "This is exactly what the current PPP/C opposition is committed to do, namely to create a society in which there is social justice for all Guyanese regardless of their race or ethnic background."

Really?

A

Hydar Ali cannot discuss why after it lost the support of working class blacks in 1956, 60 years later the PPP have failed to regain it.

Politics in Guyana is dominated by ethnic insecurity and the politicians merely exploit this. Were Guyanese not trapped by this they would have rejected the PPP and the PNC generations ago.

2020 will be another race based election.  The results will be driven by the fact that the PNC base will stay home. As disgusted as they are with APNU/AFC they will NOT vote PPP.  And they will not do so as they suffered racial oppression from the PPP, especially after 2000.

FM
Brian Teekah posted:

I can tell you Hyday Ally is a first class dinosaur from the JACKARSE breed.

This letter is so, so stupid.

At least Mr. Hydar Ally is not as stupid as you are to throw his support behind a snake oil salesman like you did. You and your GNI brothers are worse than the jackass breed of dinosaur.. Maybe you guys have a subclass breed of jackass dinosaur of your own. The anthropologists would be very happy to get their hands on you.

FM

Well, the heading for one. Race has always dominated Guyana's politics. Secondly, "People in Guyana of all ethnic groups relate to each other with the greatest of cordiality and respect", he obviously never experienced any kind of discrimination against him. How many indo-Guyanese have been taunted with "coolie watah rice......"? During the riots in the 60"s, what were the "classes" involved? Rich and poor Indians were targeted alike. Rodney was assassinated because he was getting support based on his ideology and not race and no amount of "rigging"  would have saved the PNC so he had to go. I can go on but I don't have the time.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

GTAngler

OK the heading could have been better.`But I still think it is correct. The key word dominant I would like to reflect on.

To ignore or reduce the impact of RACE is also not very convincing. You are RIGHT predominantly INDIANS were affected, I myself saw it over and over with my own eyes and only recently a very Ugly woman did so in GT at a Rice farmer protest.

It is also true that the Business Class who supported the Dictatorship were protected  There were  people telling the Rioters which Indian Business NOT to burn and so on, so I get your point but Mr Ally also has a very good feel of the situation.

Nehru
GTAngler posted:

. How many indo-Guyanese have been taunted with "coolie watah rice......"?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Fair comment if you also admit that Indians also had a whole battery of negative comments about blacks.  Cannot remember them as I don't nurse old hurts but that definitely existed.

In fact from the beginning some Indian indentures (the literate ones) wrote home to their relatives about the "monkeys" (black people).

FM

Let me preface this by saying I am not PNC or PPP. Correct me if I am wrong since this is what was passed on to me. Indians did not go into black areas during the riots. It was the blacks who went where the Indians lived. Now honestly, I can't remember any taunts Indians had for blacks because once again I never experienced any situation where the antagonist was Indian. I am not saying there weren't any. I do remember the "monkey" comments and such but as I remember those were internal, meaning within the Indian community and directed at blacks. No one is nursing hurts. I brought this up in response to race not being dominant in Guyana's politics. We need to remember and understand the past before we can move forward. As Santayana said," those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it".   

GTAngler
caribny posted:
GTAngler posted:

. How many indo-Guyanese have been taunted with "coolie watah rice......"?

 

 

 

 

Fair comment if you also admit that Indians also had a whole battery of negative comments about blacks.  Cannot remember them as I don't nurse old hurts but that definitely existed.

"Black people can't even run cake shop." [Gilly is just reporting.] Welcome back, Carib.

FM
GTAngler posted:

Let me preface this by saying I am not PNC or PPP. Correct me if I am wrong since this is what was passed on to me. Indians did not go into black areas during the riots. It was the blacks who went where the Indians lived. Now honestly,

Confirmation that you are an anti black bigot.

 

BOTH groups were displaced. BOTH groups committed violence. BOTH groups suffered as a result. And BOTH groups have a litany of bigotry directed towards each other.

The fact that you cannot see this indicates that you indeed are a bigot!

 

Note that your notion of the past is the same old "black man bad, Indo good, so black man must apologize" crap that we have been bombarded with on GNI. And why virtually blacks left.  The fact that you cannot see this just shows how knee deep in bigoted filth that you are.

How can Guyanese learn to work with each other if we do not listen to each other.  You cannot focus on the concerns of one group, and ignore that of others, and then scream innocent.

 

Gilbakka. I am not back. just happen to have some down time, peeped in, and saw a new person peddling the same racist nonsense and decided to baptize him.

FM
Last edited by Former Member
Gilbakka posted:
 

"Black people can't even run cake shop." [Gilly is just reporting.] Welcome back, Carib.

That is mild. There was one about how foul blacks smell.  This coming from the mouths of folks whose hair used to stink of the stale coconut oil that they rubbed in their hair.

FM
GTAngler posted:

Well, the heading for one. Race has always dominated Guyana's politics. Secondly, "People in Guyana of all ethnic groups relate to each other with the greatest of cordiality and respect", he obviously never experienced any kind of discrimination against him. How many indo-Guyanese have been taunted with "coolie watah rice......"? During the riots in the 60"s, what were the "classes" involved? Rich and poor Indians were targeted alike. Rodney was assassinated because he was getting support based on his ideology and not race and no amount of "rigging"  would have saved the PNC so he had to go. I can go on but I don't have the time.

 

Race, like religion, is used as a tool by individuals who crave power for power's sake. They manipulate emotions to create a power base that can be used to further their personal ambitions.

A
caribny posted:
Gilbakka posted:
 

"Black people can't even run cake shop." [Gilly is just reporting.] Welcome back, Carib.

That is mild. There was one about how foul blacks smell.  This coming from the mouths of folks whose hair used to stink of the stale coconut oil that they rubbed in their hair.

My mother started me off with coconut oil in primary school. Then she bought vaseline for me during high school years. As soon as I got my first job I bought a can of La India Pomade, made in Jamaica. It was similar to Brilliantine pomade. After that I advanced to Brylcream which I used up to August 2012. After spending 71 days in hospital without Brylcream, I discontinued use upon returning home. Now I use nothing and my hair is thick and luxuriant as ever, but all white.

FM
GTAngler posted:

. As Santayana said," those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it".   

and this is what YOU do.  Now y7ou could have appealed to this gov't to have more compassion for sugar workers (not all of whom are Indian) and not be high handedly arrogant and bigoted as the PPP was to the former bauxite workers.

But not only do you refuse to acknowledge that a precedent was set by the PPP in how it handled people displaced by an industry as it failed and was privatized, but even after I bring this to your attention you refuse to admit to this problem.

And then we have the "black man bad, Indo good" analysis of the 60s which (as we have long been accustomed to hearing from the racists who inhabit the PPP,  then they wonder why they cannot get black support in large quantities).

I am black. As a 6 y/o my parents had to take me from a majority Indian area after black women were attacked and raped by PYO thugs, and other blacks had to flee their homes in the middle of the night.  And then encounter PYO thugs with sharp cutlasses waiting to chop them up.

But you only have interest in the Indian narrative. Call any talk of the black narrative as nonsense, and then scream that those who advance this are stupid.  Good going, but you aren't going to build bridges behaving like that.

FM
antabanta posted:
GTAngler posted:

Well, the heading for one. Race has always dominated Guyana's politics. Secondly, "People in Guyana of all ethnic groups relate to each other with the greatest of cordiality and respect", he obviously never experienced any kind of discrimination against him. How many indo-Guyanese have been taunted with "coolie watah rice......"? During the riots in the 60"s, what were the "classes" involved? Rich and poor Indians were targeted alike. Rodney was assassinated because he was getting support based on his ideology and not race and no amount of "rigging"  would have saved the PNC so he had to go. I can go on but I don't have the time.

 

Race, like religion, is used as a tool by individuals who crave power for power's sake. They manipulate emotions to create a power base that can be used to further their personal ambitions.

Exactly. All the colonial powers have used race and religion to divide and conquer but by the time we realize, it's either too late or we got fattened up to the point where we don't care.

GTAngler
antabanta posted:
 

Race, like religion, is used as a tool by individuals who crave power for power's sake. They manipulate emotions to create a power base that can be used to further their personal ambitions.

Politicians could not have maintained the level of ethnic distrust and insecurity given that they have failed Guyana for over 60 years.

They merely exploit the feelings that already exist. If Guyanese didn't manifest this distrust they would long ago have insisted on a better system of governance and a higher caliber of leadership.

But since 1973 they have endured one disaster after the other. Each succeeding government as incompetent, corrupt and racist as the previous.

And in 2020 it will be racial voting again. Only thing will be that the PNC (in what ever manifestation that it appears) will get the bashing from their support base that Corbin got in 2006.  But I bet there will be extremely limited cross ethnic voting, as there was true in 2015, despite the claims of some.

FM
GTAngler posted:
 

Exactly. All the colonial powers have used race and religion to divide and conquer

Guyanese have been self governing since 1957 and independent since 1966 and yet we still blame the colonialists.

How many Guyanese remember the days when the British ran the show and Guyanese had no input in how they are governed? Almost none!  For most the 60s is as far back as we can go.  1953 is ancient history for almost all, seen through the lens of a history book.

FM
caribny posted:
GTAngler posted:

. As Santayana said," those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it".   

and this is what YOU do.  Now y7ou could have appealed to this gov't to have more compassion for sugar workers (not all of whom are Indian) and not be high handedly arrogant and bigoted as the PPP was to the former bauxite workers.

But not only do you refuse to acknowledge that a precedent was set by the PPP in how it handled people displaced by an industry as it failed and was privatized, but even after I bring this to your attention you refuse to admit to this problem.

And then we have the "black man bad, Indo good" analysis of the 60s which (as we have long been accustomed to hearing from the racists who inhabit the PPP,  then they wonder why they cannot get black support in large quantities).

I am black. As a 6 y/o my parents had to take me from a majority Indian area after black women were attacked and raped by PYO thugs, and other blacks had to flee their homes in the middle of the night.  And then encounter PYO thugs with sharp cutlasses waiting to chop them up.

But you only have interest in the Indian narrative. Call any talk of the black narrative as nonsense, and then scream that those who advance this are stupid.  Good going, but you aren't going to build bridges behaving like that.

I am beginning to think you are mentally challenged. Please read sloooowly. As I have said before, I wasn't involved in discussing Bauxite. Also, when I mentioned the riots, I did use words like, "correct me if I am wrong" and "this was passed on to me". Now your proper response should have been exactly what you just said about a situation you actually experienced. Take a deep breath, give your brain a flush and come again.

GTAngler
GTAngler posted:
 

I am beginning to think you are mentally challenged.

And there we go. Any discussion that doesn't focus on Indian issues is so damned.  And the fact that you are so ignorant that you will actually peddle the notion that the only openly expressed bigotry in Guyana comes from the mouths of blacks. WHY? Did you leave Guyana as a baby?

You don't give a damn about any one who isn't Indian.

READ SLOWLY. Indians are now a mere 38% of the population, and in fact are LESS than 1/3 of the population which is under 20.

Yet the world must bend to an Indian issue and ignore the problems faced by others, mu8ch of it at the hands of the PPP which turned out to be brutally racist.

FM

I peddled this notion when again? I spoke of what I knew AND once again I prefaced it with "correct me if I am wrong". Trying to speak to you is like telling a bald headed man a hair raising joke. I actually pity you for both being an ignorant racist and for not having the sense to see it.

GTAngler
GTAngler posted:

I peddled this notion when again? I spoke of what I knew

There has been so much discussion about the 60s and how BOTH races engaged in racist violence, and BOTH suffered as a result.  And how BOTH race were both the victims and the victimizers and that it is almost impossible to objectively chronicle which group suffered more.

And yet you didn't know this.

I hate to think about that racist cave in which you live that you can seriously tell me that you didn't know the role that Indians have played in peddling racist animus in Guyana, and thought that such behavior only was from blacks.

Listen every time you write you confirm my belief about you.

FM

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