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COVID-19, hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin: what you need to know

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Dear Editor,
I DO wish to lend my voice to the debate on the use of hydroxychloroquine, an anti-malarial medication and azithromycin, an antibiotic, in the treatment of COVID-19. Before I venture into this medically directed missive, it behoves me to emphatically state that presently a curative treatment for COVID-19 is outside of our medical knowledge, hence there is some justification in using the aforementioned medications at the time of this paralysing pandemic. Having said that, both hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin do come with contraindications, that is circumstances and conditions that they should be avoided in. These contraindications need to be carefully considered when one is undertaking a risk-benefit analysis.

Most, if not all readers would be understandably confusticated by the proposition of doctors using an anti-malarial and antibiotic to treat a viral condition. Surely, the only comparable “preposterous” act that can closely compete with this medical irregularity is someone using their car to mow the lawn. The fact is, the associated potential curative treatment of COVID-19 with hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin occurred by chance, even as we are still in the process of understanding the mechanisms of actions. I must hasten to add that this chance occurrence, or coincidence for want of a better word, is not unusual with a notable example being minoxidil(Rogaine) which is an anti-hypertensive, that was later found to be effective in testosterone- driven hair loss.

At this time of great uncertainty- driven questioning, I would not be overly surprised if readers at this stage would wish to rightfully probe the medical rationale underpinning the use of hydrocychloroquine and azithromycin for the curative treatment of COVID-19, when there are many unanswered questions. I shall address these uncertainties utilising a two- part answering schema. Firstly, it is without doubt that both hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin were both extensively studied in malarial and bacterial infections respectively, with good safety profiles. Secondly, with these good safety profiles and limited evidence of benefit in COVID-19, it could be argued that in a potentially fatal condition where there is no curative treatment, there is justification for using hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin, provided the benefits far outweigh the risks. This argument somewhat loses substance due to the absence of quality studies for the aforementioned drugs in COVID-19.

Notwithstanding these limitations, the fact that hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin both have good safety profiles in the curative treatment of malarial and bacterial infections respectively, along with limited promise and absence of curative treatment in COVID-19, then it was not a complete surprise that the FDA provided emergency approval in the treatment of COVID-19. In my humble opinion, if these two medications were completely new with no pharmacological history, then it is unlikely that the FDA would have taken this position.,

Further, it is my professional view that the limitations of both hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin in treating COVID-19, are multifactoral. For the reader to have a better appreciation of these limitations, it is imperative that they first have a basic understanding of the processes involved in testing drugs efficacy for any medical condition. Firstly, the efficacy of any drug in treating any given condition is assessed by a process known as a, Randomised Control Trials(RCT). A RCT, which is the gold standard research process for assessing the efficacy of a medical intervention generally involves two cohorts of patients.

One cohort of patients would have the condition in question and are known as the cases, while the other cohort without the condition are known as the controls. The drug to be tested is compared to an unidentifiable placebo. The placebo is a completely impotent drug-mimic, since it has no drugs inside and sometimes could simply be a sweet that has the shape of a capsule. For simplicity I will denote the real drug as A and the placebo as B. Following on, the drugs A or B are then randomly administered to each case and control.

This simply means that the cases or controls will randomly receive either A or B, but not both. The cases and controls are completely unaware of what they are given. Using researchers language, the cases and controls are blinded to A or B. They don’t know what was administered, hence they cannot fake benefits. On some occasions the researcher may also be blinded to the drugs administered to any given case or control. Since cases, controls and researchers are all blinded,- then the research is considered to be double- blinded. To have a wider cross-section of patients and improve credibility of the results, the research may be undertaken in many hospitals. As a result, the research may now have another label of being multi-centred. This would result in research of this nature to be called a “Double- blinded, Multi-centred RCT.” This is the gold standard in medical research and takes years from start to completion.This is the type of rigorous testing that any drug would undergo before it is given approval by the relevant authorities. Once completed the data is analysed by researchers and statisticians and the findings are ultimately published in medical journals and presented at medical conferences.

Now armed with this knowledge, I will expound on the limitations of hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin. The fact is that approximately 80% of patients with COVID-19 will recover on their own, without medical intervention. Approximately 17% may require some form of medical intervention and will recover without any drug administration.

Approximately 3% would unfortunately die despite medical intervention. From examining those numbers, it can be concluded that 97% of patients with COVID-19 will make a complete recovery without drug treatment. Therefore, if a patient is given Hydroxychloroquine and/or azithromycin and recovers, it is difficult to determine what contributed to this recovery. Was this recovery down to the fact that the patient would have recovered anyway, or was this recovery down to the intervention of administering hydroxychloroquine and/or azithromycin? It is these questions that any future RCT would hope to answer before we can confidently state that hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin are both curative treatments for COVID-19. This in a nutshell outlines the limitations of both hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin in the present- day treatment of COVID-19. There is no RCT to support its use, hence they have no research legs to stand on.

On the other hand, many would swear by hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin because Donald Trump has endorsed them. The reality is that medicine is not a political race of endorsements. The danger, for want of a better word, is that Donald Trump is a businessman and not a medical doctor, therefore he is completely oblivious to the medical information and drug- testing protocol. For all we know, Donald Trump may be advancing his own business interest. More concerningly, all President Trump has to support his weak case is anecdotal or hearsay evidence, which is frowned upon in the scientific world, since It is the lowest level in the hierarchy of scientific evidence. In summary, both hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin can be used in COVID-19, but it is critical that one carefully considers their limitations and contraindications. Finally, I do wish to extend condolences to those who have lost loved ones from COVID-19. I would also like to wish those afflicted with COVID-19 a quick recovery. And for the rest of the citizenry, I would like to stress the importance of following the guidelines outlined by the government to reduce COVID-19 transmission.

Regards
Dr. Mark Devonish MBBS MSc Med. Ed FRCP(Edin) FRCP(UK)
Consultant Acute Medicine
Nottingham University Hospital, UK

Replies sorted oldest to newest

Tests using those drugs have stopped due to deaths. As we should all know, everything trump agrees on is usually shite. He should be proactive, take his own advice " what's he got to lose?"  and grab himself some of those meds....cyan have a pres getting sick now, can we?

cain
Last edited by cain

Everyone can talk and have an opinion on this and that. Hydrochloroquin was owned by my former Swiss employer. It was the standard care for malaria for decades. The active ingredient base compound comes from a tree bark in the DRC.  They divested in the late 90s.

The drug is safe but, as any drug, has its side effects, the most common being diarrhea.  The other serious side effects are more remote and experienced with prolonged use.

Apart from the malaria itself, it reduces some inflammation of the lungs and fend off infections.

For Covid sufferers, this is exactly what the virus does. It suffocates the victim by starving them of oxygen. This then leads to septic shock leading to renal and total organ failure.

Without a vaccine, the best approach is to push back, buy time and keep the victim from deteriorating in the hope their immune system will create antibodies and fight the virus. So nowhere was it claimed this actually neutralizes the virus. It just buys precious time with the hope of an autoimmune response.

In all three deaths in my family, these drugs were used. The victims would improve for a day or two, enough to FaceTime with family, then a quick reversal.

In NY they have even started turning the patients over to drain parts of the lung and prevent septic shock. It’s all a race against time. 

So anyone who chooses to criticize, belittle or politicize any trial or approach, I hope you don’t have to face the choice when nothing works.  You would even try goat shit if it buys time.

Dr Devovish is known to know everything, so I’m not surprised.  However, What he wrote there is standard drug trial protocol, nothing special.  

I think he also knows the PNC won the elections fair and square. Just the world don’t agree!

FM
Last edited by Former Member
cain posted:

Tests using those drugs have stopped due to deaths. As we should all know, everything trump agrees on is usually shite. He should be proactive, take his own advice " what's he got to lose?"  and grab himself some of those meds....cyan have a pres getting sick now, can we?

Does Canada really have a low death rate compared to the rest of the world, or is pretty boy Trudeau fudging the numbers to protect his friends at the Virology lab in Wuhan?

Bibi Haniffa
Bibi Haniffa posted:
cain posted:

Tests using those drugs have stopped due to deaths. As we should all know, everything trump agrees on is usually shite. He should be proactive, take his own advice " what's he got to lose?"  and grab himself some of those meds....cyan have a pres getting sick now, can we?

Does Canada really have a low death rate compared to the rest of the world, or is pretty boy Trudeau fudging the numbers to protect his friends at the Virology lab in Wuhan?

Friends in Wuhan? Who is the idiot who spoke highly of that dam Chinese dictator and just loved how he held parades?Trudeau never ignored the warning signs nor the professionals, he never used the word "fake". You are jealous because our PM is smarter than your dumbass idol who says "I take no responsibility" meanwhile the jackass is the reason you make so many death entries in the Covid thread.

cain
Last edited by cain

Trudeau was begging an American company called 3M for medical supplies and when Trump decided to direct it to American hospitals he got pissed. Now he is under reporting all those deaths in the nursing homes.  The man is dangerous.

Bibi Haniffa
cain posted:
Bibi Haniffa posted:
cain posted:

Tests using those drugs have stopped due to deaths. As we should all know, everything trump agrees on is usually shite. He should be proactive, take his own advice " what's he got to lose?"  and grab himself some of those meds....cyan have a pres getting sick now, can we?

Does Canada really have a low death rate compared to the rest of the world, or is pretty boy Trudeau fudging the numbers to protect his friends at the Virology lab in Wuhan?

Friends in Wuhan? Who is the idiot who spoke highly of that dam Chinese dictator and just loved how he held parades?Trudeau never ignored the warning signs nor the professionals, he never used the word "fake". You are jealous because our PM is smarter than your dumbass idol who says "I take no responsibility" meanwhile the jackass is the reason you make so many death entries in the Covid thread.

Wuhan is responsible for the 149,000 deaths in the world from Covid 19. Not Trump. Is that what Trudeau is telling people?

Bibi Haniffa
Bibi Haniffa posted:
cain posted:
Bibi Haniffa posted:
cain posted:

Tests using those drugs have stopped due to deaths. As we should all know, everything trump agrees on is usually shite. He should be proactive, take his own advice " what's he got to lose?"  and grab himself some of those meds....cyan have a pres getting sick now, can we?

Does Canada really have a low death rate compared to the rest of the world, or is pretty boy Trudeau fudging the numbers to protect his friends at the Virology lab in Wuhan?

Friends in Wuhan? Who is the idiot who spoke highly of that dam Chinese dictator and just loved how he held parades?Trudeau never ignored the warning signs nor the professionals, he never used the word "fake". You are jealous because our PM is smarter than your dumbass idol who says "I take no responsibility" meanwhile the jackass is the reason you make so many death entries in the Covid thread.

Wuhan is responsible for the 149,000 deaths in the world from Covid 19. Not Trump. Is that what Trudeau is telling people?

I will give you credit that you know about Trump and Jagdeo but don't mess with Canada? You don't know Trudeau.  In the beginning Canada shipped suppliers to China and today China is sending to Canada. Trump wants a new free trade, well it works both ways. 

Do you think because Trump lies every second that Canada PM does the same. Canada adopted a strict distancing and stay at home before the US and it's citizens are compensatied well. We are even sending medical personals to help the US.

K

This virus really exposes the USA of its screwed up system of government. Imagine, each State claiming they have more jurisdictions than the President of the country. A perfect recipe for confusion and disaster.

Anybody find it strange that this virus can live on metallic surfaces for a considerable time. And its instantaneously appearance on the entire planet. It has the plot of a deliberate pandemic.  

S
kp posted:
Bibi Haniffa posted:
cain posted:
Bibi Haniffa posted:
cain posted:

Tests using those drugs have stopped due to deaths. As we should all know, everything trump agrees on is usually shite. He should be proactive, take his own advice " what's he got to lose?"  and grab himself some of those meds....cyan have a pres getting sick now, can we?

Does Canada really have a low death rate compared to the rest of the world, or is pretty boy Trudeau fudging the numbers to protect his friends at the Virology lab in Wuhan?

Friends in Wuhan? Who is the idiot who spoke highly of that dam Chinese dictator and just loved how he held parades?Trudeau never ignored the warning signs nor the professionals, he never used the word "fake". You are jealous because our PM is smarter than your dumbass idol who says "I take no responsibility" meanwhile the jackass is the reason you make so many death entries in the Covid thread.

Wuhan is responsible for the 149,000 deaths in the world from Covid 19. Not Trump. Is that what Trudeau is telling people?

I will give you credit that you know about Trump and Jagdeo but don't mess with Canada? You don't know Trudeau.  In the beginning Canada shipped suppliers to China and today China is sending to Canada. Trump wants a new free trade, well it works both ways. 

Do you think because Trump lies every second that Canada PM does the same. Canada adopted a strict distancing and stay at home before the US and it's citizens are compensatied well. We are even sending medical personals to help the US.

I don’t think Trudeau is a bad guy. He is caught between the Chinese devil and the deep blue sea. The majority of products in Canada are Made in China. When China says to jump, he has to say how high? The Canadian economy is dependent on China. His wife was one of the first reported cases in Canada. He should be reporting accurate numbers. That nursing home fiasco will come back to haunt him.

Bibi Haniffa
Last edited by Bibi Haniffa
Bibi Haniffa posted:
cain posted:
Bibi Haniffa posted:
cain posted:

Tests using those drugs have stopped due to deaths. As we should all know, everything trump agrees on is usually shite. He should be proactive, take his own advice " what's he got to lose?"  and grab himself some of those meds....cyan have a pres getting sick now, can we?

Does Canada really have a low death rate compared to the rest of the world, or is pretty boy Trudeau fudging the numbers to protect his friends at the Virology lab in Wuhan?

Friends in Wuhan? Who is the idiot who spoke highly of that dam Chinese dictator and just loved how he held parades?Trudeau never ignored the warning signs nor the professionals, he never used the word "fake". You are jealous because our PM is smarter than your dumbass idol who says "I take no responsibility" meanwhile the jackass is the reason you make so many death entries in the Covid thread.

Wuhan is responsible for the 149,000 deaths in the world from Covid 19. Not Trump. Is that what Trudeau is telling people?

A BIG NO!

K
seignet posted:

This virus really exposes the USA of its screwed up system of government. Imagine, each State claiming they have more jurisdictions than the President of the country. A perfect recipe for confusion and disaster.

Anybody find it strange that this virus can live on metallic surfaces for a considerable time. And its instantaneously appearance on the entire planet. It has the plot of a deliberate pandemic.  

The United States has three legislative bodies of government - Federal, State, and Local. The heads of each are the President, the Governor, and the Mayor.  Each functions as a separate legislative entity. Unfortunately, with the Covid pandemic they have to work together in the best interest of the American people and in the process disagreements surfaced. Governors are competing for medical supplies given out by the Federal government. A total of 680,000 cases of Covid with 35,000 dead and still counting is not an easy thing to manage.

Bibi Haniffa
Last edited by Bibi Haniffa
Bibi Haniffa posted:
kp posted:
Bibi Haniffa posted:
cain posted:
Bibi Haniffa posted:
cain posted:

Tests using those drugs have stopped due to deaths. As we should all know, everything trump agrees on is usually shite. He should be proactive, take his own advice " what's he got to lose?"  and grab himself some of those meds....cyan have a pres getting sick now, can we?

Does Canada really have a low death rate compared to the rest of the world, or is pretty boy Trudeau fudging the numbers to protect his friends at the Virology lab in Wuhan?

Friends in Wuhan? Who is the idiot who spoke highly of that dam Chinese dictator and just loved how he held parades?Trudeau never ignored the warning signs nor the professionals, he never used the word "fake". You are jealous because our PM is smarter than your dumbass idol who says "I take no responsibility" meanwhile the jackass is the reason you make so many death entries in the Covid thread.

Wuhan is responsible for the 149,000 deaths in the world from Covid 19. Not Trump. Is that what Trudeau is telling people?

I will give you credit that you know about Trump and Jagdeo but don't mess with Canada? You don't know Trudeau.  In the beginning Canada shipped suppliers to China and today China is sending to Canada. Trump wants a new free trade, well it works both ways. 

Do you think because Trump lies every second that Canada PM does the same. Canada adopted a strict distancing and stay at home before the US and it's citizens are compensatied well. We are even sending medical personals to help the US.

I don’t think Trudeau is a bad guy. He is caught between the Chinese devil and the deep blue sea. The majority of products in Canada are Made in China. When China says to jump, he has to say how high? The Canadian economy is dependent on China. His wife was one of the first reported cases in Canada. He should be reporting accurate numbers. That nursing home fiasco will come back to haunt him.

Any Canadian can get a test done, unlike America!. Trudeau's wife caught the virus in Britain and immediately upon her return she was quarantined . Fox news don't know Canada, Every day the Provinces, the Cities and the country have their leaders and medical specialists address the nation and every death is reported, yes it is higher in the nursing homes. &75% of the deaths are people 70 years and over. Many grocery stores in Toronto would give you a mask and glove when entering to shop, police are ticketing people who don't obey the strict stay at home laws.

Canada is in no rush to get back to normal, unless the cases and deaths are way down. Canadians are not protesting and begging for food like the US.  Look pick another country to worry about, we are TOO good.

K
Bibi Haniffa posted:

Trudeau was begging an American company called 3M for medical supplies and when Trump decided to direct it to American hospitals he got pissed. Now he is under reporting all those deaths in the nursing homes.  The man is dangerous.

Brain to Bibi, come in!

Had idiotman trump done the right thing in time he wouldn't have to hustle his ass at the last minute to stop exports and you people would have all the protection required and your deaths might have be a lot less.

Do you really think Canada depends on America but Amerca doesn't depend on Canada's help?  If Trudeau was a prick like your idol he would have pulled the nurses and doctors who give their time by heading South to assist the US in various towns close to the border, but he did not, he did the decent thing by putting lives of "people" regardless of where they are from before his own popularity as your idot in chief does. Sometimes your posts do not require an answer.

cain
Bibi Haniffa posted:
kp posted:
Bibi Haniffa posted:
cain posted:
Bibi Haniffa posted:
cain posted:

Tests using those drugs have stopped due to deaths. As we should all know, everything trump agrees on is usually shite. He should be proactive, take his own advice " what's he got to lose?"  and grab himself some of those meds....cyan have a pres getting sick now, can we?

Does Canada really have a low death rate compared to the rest of the world, or is pretty boy Trudeau fudging the numbers to protect his friends at the Virology lab in Wuhan?

Friends in Wuhan? Who is the idiot who spoke highly of that dam Chinese dictator and just loved how he held parades?Trudeau never ignored the warning signs nor the professionals, he never used the word "fake". You are jealous because our PM is smarter than your dumbass idol who says "I take no responsibility" meanwhile the jackass is the reason you make so many death entries in the Covid thread.

Wuhan is responsible for the 149,000 deaths in the world from Covid 19. Not Trump. Is that what Trudeau is telling people?

I will give you credit that you know about Trump and Jagdeo but don't mess with Canada? You don't know Trudeau.  In the beginning Canada shipped suppliers to China and today China is sending to Canada. Trump wants a new free trade, well it works both ways. 

Do you think because Trump lies every second that Canada PM does the same. Canada adopted a strict distancing and stay at home before the US and it's citizens are compensatied well. We are even sending medical personals to help the US.

I don’t think Trudeau is a bad guy. He is caught between the Chinese devil and the deep blue sea. The majority of products in Canada are Made in China. When China says to jump, he has to say how high? The Canadian economy is dependent on China. His wife was one of the first reported cases in Canada. He should be reporting accurate numbers. That nursing home fiasco will come back to haunt him.

Don't forget Trudeau is part Chinese. 

Prashad

The Chinese immigrations have infiltrated and control many aspects of Canadian life but with a China bias.  There is backlash coming in Canada against this infiltration.

An Indian immigrant doctor in Canada built a diagnostic device and had it approved and is exported to many countries. The head of procurement for this in Canada is a Chinese immigrant. She opted for the Chinese-made device and not the Canadian. 

New legislation is coming to the US which will change the supply chain dynamic globally. Trump has already set up a task force to come up with policy.  Congressman Ro Khanna is one Democrat on the task force to help the de-Globalization of America’s supply chain.

Suh ayuh nah mek worries, 3M will have to bring manufacturing back to America.

This crisis will prove beneficial to Trump America first doctrine!

FM
Baseman posted:

The Chinese immigrations have infiltrated and control many aspects of Canadian life but with a China bias.  There is backlash coming in Canada against this infiltration.

An Indian immigrant doctor in Canada built a diagnostic device and had it approved and is exported to many countries. The head of procurement for this in Canada is a Chinese immigrant. She opted for the Chinese-made device and not the Canadian. 

New legislation is coming to the US which will change the supply chain dynamic globally. Trump has already set up a task force to come up with policy.  Congressman Ro Khanna is one Democrat on the task force to help the de-Globalization of America’s supply chain.

Suh ayuh nah mek worries, 3M will have to bring manufacturing back to America.

This crisis will prove beneficial to Trump America first doctrine!

Rotflmao GIFs | TenorRotflmao GIFs | Tenor

Mitwah
Baseman posted
........So anyone who chooses to criticize, belittle or politicize any trial or approach, I hope you don’t have to face the choice when nothing works.  You would even try goat shit if it buys time.

 

May I suggest you and trump both try that goatshit..in idiot in chief's own words, "what have you got to lose?"

The only part of your post I agree with is turning patients onto their stomachs to ease pressure on the lungs.

cain
Last edited by cain

Yes, what have you got to lose if you have three days before your system becomes irreparably damaged.  You actually have nothing to lose.

Trumps doing great and will win 2020 by a significant margin!

FM
Mitwah posted:
Baseman posted:

The Chinese immigrations have infiltrated and control many aspects of Canadian life but with a China bias.  There is backlash coming in Canada against this infiltration.

An Indian immigrant doctor in Canada built a diagnostic device and had it approved and is exported to many countries. The head of procurement for this in Canada is a Chinese immigrant. She opted for the Chinese-made device and not the Canadian. 

New legislation is coming to the US which will change the supply chain dynamic globally. Trump has already set up a task force to come up with policy.  Congressman Ro Khanna is one Democrat on the task force to help the de-Globalization of America’s supply chain.

Suh ayuh nah mek worries, 3M will have to bring manufacturing back to America.

This crisis will prove beneficial to Trump America first doctrine!

Rotflmao GIFs | TenorRotflmao GIFs | Tenor

You can laugh because Canada will benefit as Trump will designate Canada and Mexico as preferred locations for US supply chain anchors.

FM
cain posted:
Bibi Haniffa posted:

Trudeau was begging an American company called 3M for medical supplies and when Trump decided to direct it to American hospitals he got pissed. Now he is under reporting all those deaths in the nursing homes.  The man is dangerous.

Brain to Bibi, come in!

Had idiotman trump done the right thing in time he wouldn't have to hustle his ass at the last minute to stop exports and you people would have all the protection required and your deaths might have be a lot less.

Do you really think Canada depends on America but Amerca doesn't depend on Canada's help?  If Trudeau was a prick like your idol he would have pulled the nurses and doctors who give their time by heading South to assist the US in various towns close to the border, but he did not, he did the decent thing by putting lives of "people" regardless of where they are from before his own popularity as your idot in chief does. Sometimes your posts do not require an answer.

You should know the history, America never acts on anything until a great many are killed/dead. Check back since the Englishmen came accross the Atlantic. They killed enough red ppl. The red man claims that an infected whiteman was deployed to their villages with the smallpox. They killed enough Mexicans during the Spanish American war. And as for the slaves, untold numbers. Trump is a true American, to the standards  of his ancient American nation builders. 

S
seignet posted:
cain posted:
Bibi Haniffa posted:

Trudeau was begging an American company called 3M for medical supplies and when Trump decided to direct it to American hospitals he got pissed. Now he is under reporting all those deaths in the nursing homes.  The man is dangerous.

Brain to Bibi, come in!

Had idiotman trump done the right thing in time he wouldn't have to hustle his ass at the last minute to stop exports and you people would have all the protection required and your deaths might have be a lot less.

Do you really think Canada depends on America but Amerca doesn't depend on Canada's help?  If Trudeau was a prick like your idol he would have pulled the nurses and doctors who give their time by heading South to assist the US in various towns close to the border, but he did not, he did the decent thing by putting lives of "people" regardless of where they are from before his own popularity as your idot in chief does. Sometimes your posts do not require an answer.

You should know the history, America never acts on anything until a great many are killed/dead. Check back since the Englishmen came accross the Atlantic. They killed enough red ppl. The red man claims that an infected whiteman was deployed to their villages with the smallpox. They killed enough Mexicans during the Spanish American war. And as for the slaves, untold numbers. Trump is a true American, to the standards  of his ancient American nation builders. 

My understanding was that it was infected blankets which were given to the natives that caused them to be wiped out.  And yes it had to be an infected Philgrim. But it was the distribution method that was scary. Wonder if the firewater was tampered with as well.

Sheik101

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