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Gov’t’s efforts have reduced crime rate

-Ramjattan

Minister of Public Security Khemraj Ramjattan

August 12 2018

Source

Minister of Public Security Khemraj Ramjattan on Wednesday rubbished claims by the parliamentary opposition that government has not taken urgent measures to manage the country’s crime problems, while arguing that the existing statistics are proof of its efforts.

In fact, he said that the opposition ought to be working along with government to address crime, while adding that it had failed to do so during its 23 years in office.

The government and opposition traded blame during a debate on an adjournment motion on crime, which was brought to the National Assembly by Opposition Chief Whip Gail Teixeira. The motion sought to have the National Assembly call on the government to take urgent measures to effectively manage the public security sector and to uphold its responsibility to protest the safety of all citizens and reduce the levels of crime which are “eroding public trust and lowering the quality of life.”

Ramjattan, in rebutting the premise of the motion, disputed that there is an erosion of public trust, while pointing out that the measures introduced by government since it took office in 2015 have actually resulted in a steady decrease in the crime rate.

In fact, he produced statistics for the years 2013 to 2017 to highlight the steady decline in serious crimes.

With loud murmurs coming from the opposition benches, Ramjattan accused the PPP/C members of Parliament (MPs) of not wanting to listen to the truth.

With regards to murder, he said the 155 cases recorded in 2013 fell to 115 in 2017. He quoted figures for other categories of serious crime which are on the decrease and made mention of the drastic decline in incidents of piracy since 2015, while informing the House that more criminals are being caught.

Noting that the figures presented are “not being made up,” he admitted that the crime situation is still “bad” as too many robberies, rapes, sexual assaults, and burglaries are still being committed.

According to Ramjattan, with the resources made available, government is training more policemen, ensuring that more patrol vehicles are on the road and that the mounted and canine sections are involved in catching the criminals.

“It is not as if we haven’t a handle on the situation but honestly indeed it is high and it is high because obviously there is a lot of say about other factors,” he said before listing domestic violence as a factor which leads to murders, which he described as “very troubling.”

The minister said it is untrue that the ministry has not been collaborating with all the relevant agencies dealing with public security.

Holding up a piece of paper, Ramjattan said that he has maps to show where crimes are occurring. This prompted an opposition member to shout out, “We want a map showing no crime occurring.” The minister, in response, said that “we have to realistic,” particularly given that Guyana, which has porous borders, is located in a region where there are lots of guns and narcotics, which breed a lot of crime.

Despite a warning by the Speaker, the opposition MPs continued to heckle Ramjattan until the end of his presentation.

Ramjattan, however, noted that many persons have praise the government for its efforts, which are far better than those of the opposition when it was in office. “I want to urge that we have to act together… you might help because indeed you have been there for 23 years. You could now probably recognise that there were some mistakes done so that you can probably ensure it doesn’t reoccur,” he said

Teixeira, in her presentation to the National Assembly, expressed dissatisfaction with the way government is handling the crime situation.

“You have a police force that is being demoralised… that came under the Commission of Inquiry [CoI]in which they were targeted,” she said before pointing out that the person who headed that CoI, retired Assistant Commissioner Paul Slowe, has since been appointed the Chairman of the Police Service Commission.

“You have a crime situation where there is a lot of under reporting ….partly because of a lack of confidence in the police force”, she said, while adding that with the non-appointment of a Chairman of the Police Complaints Authority, citizens have no other avenue to have their complaints properly heard.

Tackling the existing crime situation, she said, requires a joint effort by the various agencies and the sharing of intelligence.

“The government more and more is showing total incompetence to deal with the public security sector,” she said before making it clear that she is not trying to attack Ramjattan. “I am attacking the whole government because everyone is responsible,” she added.

Teixeira called on the government to effectively manage the public security sector, while arguing that after three years it has shown that “it is not making a dent.” She said that government cannot complain about the lack of financial and other resources. She appealed to government to not be defensive on the issue but take responsibility.

Former Home Minister and opposition frontbencher Clement Rohee in his contribution said that there is a lot of talk and discussions about the crime situation in Guyana. Noting that citizens look forward “to action [and]…results… [and] value for money,” Rohee said. “…As I said before all we hear is a lot of platitudes, a lot of excuses, a lot of defensive rhetoric coming from the government with no action behind it. The action has to be on the law enforcement side as well as on the civilian side,” he further stressed.

Replies sorted oldest to newest

Gilbakka posted:

Jagdeo seh Ramjattan fudged the numbers. 

The PPP/C should help because  as Ramjattan reminded them they had indeed  been there for 23 years. Jagdeo et al could now probably recognise that there were some mistakes done during those years and especially during  his  terms;  he  can surely ensure it doesn’t reoccur. 

It's everyone's business to fight crime. 

Rohee said. “…As I said before all we hear is a lot of platitudes, a lot of excuses, a lot of defensive rhetoric coming from the government with no action behind it. The action has to be on the law enforcement side as well as on the civilian side,” he further stressed. 

Mitwah

Plop plop goes the slop. I stopped the crime thread as it became evident that it was no longer need due to the foregone conclusion that crime was the same if not worse during PPP time. 
When was the last time that sloppy joe posted article about crime? 
What about this one where police raiding mining camps to rob illegal Brazilians?

 

Cops panic after gunning down Brazilian miner


 

– attempt to dump body

Estevao Costa Marques the Brazilian miner who was shot and killed by police

Reports coming out from the Puruni Landing in Region 7, Essequibo, late yesterday, have revealed that two Police ranks who were in the process of raiding a mining camp some 20 minutes up the Puruni River from the Landing, shot and killed a 37-year-old undocumented Brazilian miner named Estevao Costa Marques, after he ran as the ranks were carrying out the raid.

A witness to the tragic episode claimed that he was not too far from where the incident occurred. The man told this publication through a translator, that the police would normally come and raid the camps – looking to take money from undocumented Brazilian miners in the area.

Around 13:00 hrs yesterday one such raid was being carried out by the two police ranks. As they approached the camp owned by the victim’s mother, a Brazilian miner known as Maria de Nazaré Costa Marques, the man made a run for the bushes. The witness claims that “the police just point his gun and fired two shots”, with one hitting the young Marques in his back and the other hitting him at the back of his head. The witness opined that the man fell dead instantly, as “his head exploded”.

The witness said after the police shot the man, they clearly began to panic.

“They were attempting to dispose of the body; at one time they even tried to burn the body, but other miners started to create a scene. They (police) were telling the people to clear the area, but all the miners in the area came out and kept a watchful eye on them.

FM
Drugb posted:

Plop plop goes the slop. I stopped the crime thread as it became evident that it was no longer need due to the foregone conclusion that crime was the same if not worse during PPP time. 
When was the last time that sloppy joe posted article about crime? 
What about this one where police raiding mining camps to rob illegal Brazilians?

Actually you were banned for a period,so the continuation ceased.

Caution you may there again.

Django
Django posted:

Gov’t’s efforts have reduced crime rate

-Ramjattan

Minister of Public Security Khemraj Ramjattan

 

 

 

 

The chart shows an impressive decline since 2014.  That's an overall decline of 20%+. 

Mitwah
Django posted:
Drugb posted:

Plop plop goes the slop. I stopped the crime thread as it became evident that it was no longer need due to the foregone conclusion that crime was the same if not worse during PPP time. 
When was the last time that sloppy joe posted article about crime? 
What about this one where police raiding mining camps to rob illegal Brazilians?

Actually you were banned for a period,so the continuation ceased.

Caution you may there again.

I was banned for 1 day jackass. I chose not to return, ask Ray.

FM
Mitwah posted:
Django posted:

Gov’t’s efforts have reduced crime rate

-Ramjattan

Minister of Public Security Khemraj Ramjattan

 

 

 

 

The chart shows an impressive decline since 2014.  That's an overall decline of 20%+. 

Did Ramjattan cook up these numbers himself when he was drunk?  People are getting killed and robbed several times a day in Guyana.  Domestic violence is rampant.

Bibi Haniffa

Lilly mohan and the one djangy suffering from rose colored glasses affliction. While Guyanese of all race and classes suffer at the hands of bandits, these two fellows are content to peddle propaganda aka slop can. 

FM

Well, that’s all well and good for the officials however, the people still view crime as out of control and negatively impacting their quality of life.  Everyone I speak to in Guyana complains about crime.  

FM
Drugb posted:
Django posted:
Drugb posted:

Plop plop goes the slop. I stopped the crime thread as it became evident that it was no longer need due to the foregone conclusion that crime was the same if not worse during PPP time. 
When was the last time that sloppy joe posted article about crime? 
What about this one where police raiding mining camps to rob illegal Brazilians?

Actually you were banned for a period,so the continuation ceased.

Caution you may there again.

I was banned for 1 day jackass. I chose not to return, ask Ray.

That's because you can't stand the heat. You are so full of shit.

Mitwah
Gilbakka posted:

Jagdeo seh Ramjattan fudged the numbers. 

He can produce his numbers. 

1. Murder dropped from a high of 155 under the PPP to a low of 115 under the AFC+APNU.

2. Robbery dropped from a high of 66 under the PPP to a low of 42 under the AFC+APNU.

3. Robbery Under Arms (FA)  dropped from a high of 739 under the PPP to a low of 673 under the AFC+APNU.

4. Robbery Under Arms (OI) dropped from a high of 397 under the PPP to a low of 291 under the AFC+APNU.

5. Robbery with Violence dropped from a high of 213 under the PPP to a low of 143 under the AFC+APNU.

6. Robbery with aggravation dropped from a high of 116 under the PPP to a low of 88 under the AFC+APNU.

7. Larceny from Person dropped from a high of 265 under the PPP to a low of 139 under the AFC+APNU.

8. Rape dropped from a high of 269 under the PPP to a low of 221 under the AFC+APNU.

9. Burglary dropped from a high of 292 under the PPP to a low of 218 under the AFC+APNU.

10. Break and Enter Larceny dropped from a high of 1692 under the PPP to a low of 1106 under the AFC+APNU.

11. Kidnapping dropped from a high of 1 under the PPP to zero under the AFC+APNU.

 

Mitwah

The police do not report when their fellow members commit crimes. Items 2-10 would be much higher if all crimes are reported. Numerous times people refused to report crimes because the police just refuse to investigate or they are being paid off. What happens when citizens report crimes and the phones go unanswered, or the gates are locked, or their vehicle have no gas, or they do not have transportation? Are these included in the statistics? 

FM
Mitwah posted:

Ramjattan should introduce legislation to forfeit anyone's rights to oil money if they have 3 convictions or more. 

Ramjattan would be bitch-slapped by Harmon for even thinking this. He is only a robot. 

FM
skeldon_man posted:
Mitwah posted:

Ramjattan should introduce legislation to forfeit anyone's rights to oil money if they have 3 convictions or more. 

Ramjattan would be bitch-slapped by Harmon for even thinking this. He is only a robot. 

Ramjattan is doing far better than his  predecessor. You are just repeating PPP mantra. Jagdeo should tell us about the 1200 murders during his two terms. The hate for Ramjattan and Moses have caused the PPP and their supporters to loose their focus. 

Mitwah

Hey Mits

I see that you are spinning like Murali for your fabily Ramjattan. Spin bai spin.

The people of Guyana will decide, as of now the AFC is dead met.

Spin bai spin.

Hey Hey Hey

 

FM
Last edited by Former Member
yuji22 posted:

Hey Mits

I see that you are spinning like Murali for your fabily Ramjattan. Spin bai spin.

The people of Guyana will decide, as of now the AFC is dead met.

Spin bai spin.

Hey Hey Hey

 

Hey, Ramotar  is my fambly too.  Yours and the PPP's hatred for Ramjattan and Moses is what is going to cause the PPP to loose at the polls.  Crime is still high but the stats show that there is 20% reduction since 2015. You were a fool to criticize the closing of rum shops at 2:00AM.

Mitwah
Mitwah posted:
yuji22 posted:

Hey Mits

I see that you are spinning like Murali for your fabily Ramjattan. Spin bai spin.

The people of Guyana will decide, as of now the AFC is dead met.

Spin bai spin.

Hey Hey Hey

 

Hey, Ramotar  is my fambly too.  Yours and the PPP's hatred for Ramjattan and Moses is what is going to cause the PPP to loose at the polls.  Crime is still high but the stats show that there is 20% reduction since 2015. You were a fool to criticize the closing of rum shops at 2:00AM.

Hey Mit, good to know all the members of the police force were change in 2015. 

 

FM
Dave posted:
Mitwah posted:
yuji22 posted:

Hey Mits

I see that you are spinning like Murali for your fabily Ramjattan. Spin bai spin.

The people of Guyana will decide, as of now the AFC is dead met.

Spin bai spin.

Hey Hey Hey

 

Hey, Ramotar  is my fambly too.  Yours and the PPP's hatred for Ramjattan and Moses is what is going to cause the PPP to loose at the polls.  Crime is still high but the stats show that there is 20% reduction since 2015. You were a fool to criticize the closing of rum shops at 2:00AM.

Hey Mit, good to know all the members of the police force were change(d) in 2015. 

 

I know that you are easily persuaded to believe anything. Who is feeding you that kind of turd? I don't think you can come up with that all on your own.

Mitwah
Mitwah posted:
Dave posted:
Mitwah posted:
yuji22 posted:

Hey Mits

I see that you are spinning like Murali for your fabily Ramjattan. Spin bai spin.

The people of Guyana will decide, as of now the AFC is dead met.

Spin bai spin.

Hey Hey Hey

 

Hey, Ramotar  is my fambly too.  Yours and the PPP's hatred for Ramjattan and Moses is what is going to cause the PPP to loose at the polls.  Crime is still high but the stats show that there is 20% reduction since 2015. You were a fool to criticize the closing of rum shops at 2:00AM.

Hey Mit, good to know all the members of the police force were change(d) in 2015. 

 

I know that you are easily persuaded to believe anything. Who is feeding you that kind of turd? I don't think you can come up with that all on your own.

If I give you the answer, I am afraid you will commit suicide 

FM
Dave posted:
Mitwah posted:
Dave posted:
Mitwah posted:

Hey, Ramotar  is my fambly too.  Yours and the PPP's hatred for Ramjattan and Moses is what is going to cause the PPP to loose at the polls.  Crime is still high but the stats show that there is 20% reduction since 2015. You were a fool to criticize the closing of rum shops at 2:00AM.

Hey Mit, good to know all the members of the police force were change(d) in 2015. 

 

I know that you are easily persuaded to believe anything. Who is feeding you that kind of turd? I don't think you can come up with that all on your own.

If I give you the answer, I am afraid you will commit suicide 

Do you think of suicide a lot? Let me guess, perhaps it helps you get thru many bad days and nights. 

Mitwah
Mitwah posted:
Drugb posted:
Django posted:
Drugb posted:

Plop plop goes the slop. I stopped the crime thread as it became evident that it was no longer need due to the foregone conclusion that crime was the same if not worse during PPP time. 
When was the last time that sloppy joe posted article about crime? 
What about this one where police raiding mining camps to rob illegal Brazilians?

Actually you were banned for a period,so the continuation ceased.

Caution you may there again.

I was banned for 1 day jackass. I chose not to return, ask Ray.

That's because you can't stand the heat. You are so full of shit.

I gave you and the djangy long rope. Now I am back to reign you two sloppy boys back in before you hang yourselves. 

FM
Drugb posted:
Mitwah posted:
Drugb posted:
Django posted:
Drugb posted:

Plop plop goes the slop. I stopped the crime thread as it became evident that it was no longer need due to the foregone conclusion that crime was the same if not worse during PPP time. 
When was the last time that sloppy joe posted article about crime? 
What about this one where police raiding mining camps to rob illegal Brazilians?

Actually you were banned for a period,so the continuation ceased.

Caution you may there again.

I was banned for 1 day jackass. I chose not to return, ask Ray.

That's because you can't stand the heat. You are so full of shit.

I gave you and the djangy long rope. Now I am back to reign you two sloppy boys back in before you hang yourselves. 

You wish,you are confused and talking to yourself.

Django
Drugb posted:
Mitwah posted:
Drugb posted:
Django posted:
Drugb posted:

Plop plop goes the slop. I stopped the crime thread as it became evident that it was no longer need due to the foregone conclusion that crime was the same if not worse during PPP time. 
When was the last time that sloppy joe posted article about crime? 
What about this one where police raiding mining camps to rob illegal Brazilians?

Actually you were banned for a period,so the continuation ceased.

Caution you may there again.

I was banned for 1 day jackass. I chose not to return, ask Ray.

That's because you can't stand the heat. You are so full of shit.

I gave you and the djangy long rope. Now I am back to reign you two sloppy boys back in before you hang yourselves. 

Longevity is not part of your genes. I don't want to be responsible if you suddenly drop dead. Those whom the gods wish to destroy they first make mad.  You're mad as a hatter. Check your mercury level. 

Mitwah

Manufactured crime statistics

Dear Editor,
After my last letter on security matters, a confidential source with strong ties to the APNU/AFC Administration, who will remain anonymous, called to plead with me not to be so critical of the Minister of Public Security.
He said, “Harry, Khemraj (Ramjattan) means well, but he’s not being given the support. He’s not getting the money he’s asking for to improve the sector, and he sees money being wasted and unaccounted for in other ministries. They (APNU) want him to fail. They’re using him and (Prime Minister) Moses (Nagamootoo) as pit bulls to go after Jagdeo and his boys. Haven’t you noticed? It is the Indians in the AFC that they’re using to discredit the PPP; our hands are clean.”
So, after pressing for an explanation, I was told that Granger is under pressure from the PNCR executives for giving all the important ministries to the AFC, but he can’t change that now without risking the breakup of the coalition. The APNU is hoping that Ramjattan will get frustrated by his many failures, and either resign on his own, or ask be reshuffled to another ministry.
This year, $37.4 billion was budgeted for the security sector. This is a big increase from the $29.1 billion allocated last year. In addition, the Guyana Police Force recently received from the People’s Republic of China generous gifts of vehicles totalling US$2.6 million, and 200 bicycles (30 of which were given to the City Constabulary) valued at over US$145,000; plus the GPF received another US$20,000 worth of electronic equipment from the United States’ Government.

So, in fact, the Ministry of Public Security should not be short of resources to put systems in place to reduce crime and to secure our prisons. The problem is that this administration is incapable of dealing with the management and leadership issues that exist in the sector.
Then, on July 14, the state newspaper carried a bold headline that read, “Armed robberies down by 8%”. Another section of the media coverage of this story was slightly different. It read, “The Guyana Police Force has recorded 44 murders in the past six months. And with the exception of rape and gun robberies, serious crimes were down by five percent in comparison to the same period last year.”
While other sections of the media reported a two percent increase in robbery under arms in which firearms were used (298 as against 304 this year), the state newspaper had the figures reversed to show a decline of 2 percent, to let the Government look good. Even so, all Guyanese are aware of the almost daily reports of gun-related robberies and other crimes that terrify businesses and communities; and whether it is +2 percent or -2 percent, no one believes those manufactured figures anymore. Shouldn’t rape and gun-related robberies form part of the “serious crime” category, to give us a true and accurate crime report from the Police? Who is manufacturing these crime statistics to give our citizens a false sense of security?
I would wager that if an opinion poll were done today, only two persons would believe these statistics: The Minister of Public Security and the Acting Commissioner of Police. But oh, perhaps there is a third, Crime Chief Paul Williams, who seems willing to compromise his professionalism and integrity by defending an out-of-control Government minister. As this matter is still being investigated by the Police, I would hope the Crime Chief has the decency to recuse himself from any part of this ongoing investigation.
Whatever marginal gains the Guyana Police Force is reporting on crime statistics, even if true, they are totally unacceptable to justify the huge amount of resources allocated to the security sector. We, the citizens of Guyana, demand results. And for the Government to say that crime was also high during the PPP tenure is equally unaccepted. They are the ones that gained office with all the answers to Guyana’s problems and the security experts the likes of former Police Commissioner Winston Felix and former Rear Admiral Gary Best; but crime has since gotten worse.
With the inexperienced Ramjattan now left on his own to hang out to dry, it seems that my source’s information may be credible after all.

Sincerely,
Harry Gill
PPP Member of Parliament
Member of the Parliamentary Oversight
Committee of the Security Sector

FM
Mitwah posted:
Longevity is not part of your genes. I don't want to be responsible if you suddenly drop dead. Those whom the gods wish to destroy they first make mad.  You're mad as a hatter. Check your mercury level. 

Imagine dat, a man with one foot in the grave wishing death on such a superb specimen.  If it will make you feel better then go ahead, but promise to sing a bajan for me if I do  drop. 

FM
Dave posted:
Mitwah posted:

Dave what is your source? Please provide the link. 

Mitt regardless of the source which I am posting below, there is a signature to the letter.

https://guyanatimesgy.com/manu...ed-crime-statistics/

Bhaiji, it's the Forum rule. Anyway, HG even doubts the credibility of his source of his info.  Signatures can be forged or invented.

As you say that Ramjattan is inexperienced, he is doing a great job compared to his predecessor. That young fella is smart eh.

Crime is down 20% after 2014.  Hats off to the police and Mr. Ramjattan.

Mitwah

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