Bibi Haniffa posted:

Furthermore, if my theory above holds water, Nagamootoo first sold out the PPP.  And then he went on to sell out the AFC to APNU.  Remember a certain elderman on this forum once told us that Cheddi said Nagamootoo can sell ice to Iceland.  I think he did!!  Tw-ice!!

Why blaming others for PPP loss,blame Jaggy who kick out some of the old boys and positioned himself for control,anyway it's good they lost no country can function properly with one party rule,that's like dictatorship they get power drunk,that behavior was noticed with some of the PPP ministers.

Zed posted:

Caribny, the PPP was not "installed" by the US in 1992. The presence of the Carter and others and their intervention ensured that the elections were free and fair, reflected the wishes of the Guyanese electorate and that the  government was th one that people voted for.  Certainly there are defects in the constitution, but that is another discussion. 

 

Regarding the future success of the PPP in returning to office. the present administration is helping in that area by their duplicity, broken promises, inability to see and deal with the broader issues, continued high crime rate, etc. They seem to be tone deaf. I think recent utterances by Jagdeo might indicate some shift in what they see as necessary to first solidify their base and concurrently reach out to the disenchanted from those who voted for the coalition. 

But the bottom line for me is that the present  government is making the PPP's job easier and even if the PPP leadership do not scream race, the populace is wise enough to see it it front of them. I think that part is solidified as of now so  the PPP, as you rightly noted must reach out to the other groups.  Will this happen? I am unsure because many politicians become arrogant and think they know everything, start believing in group think, etc. The PPP needs to become a modern political party, believe in and and sell itself as the party of all the people. 

I suggest that you tell your buddies to cease braying about APNU/AFC being installed.   The presence of the Carter and others was clearly way more visible and of critical important than any US presence.

Guyanese spoke in 1992, and they spoke again in 2015. The PPP needs to accept this, and cease insulting Guyanese by screaming that Obama installed Granger! He no more did so than did George HW Bush install Jagan in 1992!

Even though Hoyte had brought in many reforms, many people simply thought that the PNC needed to go.  Even  many who would be considered to be PNC supporters murmured "gi de coolie a chance".  They hoping that the PPP would be more effective AND inclusive than their own PNC was.  Sadly this was not to be, and so the PPP was dumped last year.

The PPP needs to re-invent itself.  They need to stop seeing themselves as the "coolie people party". The notion that they need to wait until they rebuild their presumably Indian base is NONSENSE.  If non Indians continue to see them as an Indian party, they will NEVER support them.  No one will willingly put themselves into a subordinated position.

Petty corruption, and abuse remains rife, even as many fought to rid Guyana of the PPP, in the hopes that this would be reduced.  Why doesn't the PPP DUMP JAGDEO, and find a new cadre of multi ethnic YOUNG and bright leaders. 

Guyana must grow beyond ethnic fear, and your suggestion that the PPP must focus first on its base, before out reaching to others only enhances the prospect of an ethnically based civil war.

The PPP needs NEW MULTI ETHNIC leadership.  They need to DUMP Jagdeo and the rest of the thieves who were responsible for their defeat!

And Zed let me inform of about the ethnic demographics.   In 1991 Indians were 49% of the population, and OVER 50% of the VOTING age population.

It is a belief that Indians are now 40% of the population, with some estimating at 45% of the VOTING age population.

If this rate of decline continues, Indians will be 35% of the population, and maybe 40% of the voting age population by 2020.

So if you think that race alone will impact the results, you MAD! The Indian party will NOT be able to beat the African/mixed party.  The PPP formula that they only need to add a few Amerindian votes to get them over 50% FAILED in 2011, and in 2015, and stands NO CHANCE by 2020.

Their only hope will be to cease being the "coolie people party", and that will NEVER happen with the likes of Jagdeo and Rohee at the helm, because their SOLE campaign tactic is to scream race. 

Jagdeo, Rohee, Ravi Dev, and the Guyana Times are throwing gas on dry grass.  If the next national election is about race, then it will be easy to whip up segments of the African population by making them feel that what ever minute gains that they might have received under APNU (a few patronage jobs and projects) will be in threat if the "coolie people party" once again sends them back into "slavery".

The problem with almost all Indians on GNI is that they operate with the premise that only Indians matter, so COMPLETLY ignore how the African population might react if they feel that Indo domination might return. 

The PPP CANNOT be seen as an Indo party! WHY that is something that you don't understand is BAFFLING!

Carib..you are on target they don't factor in the declining Indian population.

What is the confusion?  When did this discussion turn into one about race?  I thought we were talking about the Brassington surveillance and then the cummingsburg accord! Stop drinking that race Kool Aid people.  It wont get you anywhere.

Bibi Haniffa posted:

Furthermore, if my theory above holds water, Nagamootoo first sold out the PPP.  And then he went on to sell out the AFC to APNU.  Remember a certain elderman on this forum once told us that Cheddi said Nagamootoo can sell ice to Iceland.  I think he did!!  Tw-ice!!

Your theory has a few tiny holes and the water is escaping. I shall address this issue in detail after LGE.

Django posted:

 

Oii Bibi this is not 1964 to 1992,there is more Guyanese in the diaspora than in the homeland we will let our voices be heard.Let the PNC faction of the coalition try to pull the stunts they did during that period,they will be serious repercussions.They Guyanese today is a different breed,hopefully the better sense prevail.

People in Guyana don't give two hoots about us, except for what $$ they can squeeze out of us. Any case many of us tire of Guyana.

The Cold War is over, Guyana is minimally important, the Maduro regime is on its way out, and so the ABC nations have no need to care. 

Watch and see what they do with Haiti (nothing) with their current electoral fiasco. 

At least Haiti can threaten the USA with thousands of impoverished refugees.  Guyana is too far to do that.

One day Guyanese, who live in Guyana, will take it upon themselves to demand and obtain proper governance.  Until they do so they will be led by a succession of corrupt and incompetent people.

yuji22 posted:

 We all want to see Guyana make progress.

 

You don't.  You just want the PPP back. 

The emerging arrogance of sections of APNU is because Jagdeo has made this into a race issue, so they think that they have the support of the grass roots blacks.  Newly "liberated" from PPP rule, they aren't about to go back to it, even if they have major disagreements with Granger.

Until you toss your Indo KKK attitude, you will NOT get their support.  I submit to you that continued tribalism damns Guyana into remaining what it currently is.

Bibi Haniffa posted:

  My only hope is Jagdeo. .

Oh yes, tell the man who demonized black people, and made them feel like slaves, that this man will be back.

You MADDDD!  Record numbers of black and mixed Guyanese turned out to vote to ensure that Jagdeo wouldn't be back.

Try better than that!

Amral posted:

 

REVISING THE CUMMINGSBURG ACCORD – By Ralph Ramkarran

This is it right Bibi?

This is an agreement between APNU and the AFC. It was NOT a legislative decision, nor was it a revision of the constitution.

If AFC is happy with APNU, then the Accord has no legal standing.

So why do people refer to it? 

BEFORE the election I went to an event where both Moses and Granger spoke.  When Moses confidently suggested that if he doesn't like what APNU is doing, he could leave, with 40% of the cabinet and 1/3 of the MPs, Granger smirked.

I said after the election,  that Moses and Ramjattan were sidelined by the AFC G/town faction, this being quite evident once we saw who the AFC representatives were.  The AFC Indos didn't bring in enough votes to prove their worth, though they brought in ample funds.

No way that Hughes, Trotman, Gaskin, and Holder are going to contribute to Jagdeo returning to power.  Even if Ramjattan thinks that he can threaten this.

Any way Moses finds his current status too sweet and rumors are that he wants to be the next president.  Not going to happen outside of the coalition gov't, as Jagdeo wants to hang him for treason. I can only wonder what Harmon has to say about this though.

Bibi Haniffa posted:

I don't understand why the AFC never held APNU accountable for violating the accord.  . 

Because you all called the man ni99amootoo, Dirty Indian, neemakaram, so he thinks that Granger is his best friend.

That is what the racist campaigning of Jagdeo did, when its main plank was "Nagamootoo is not an Indian"!

caribny posted:

Bibi Haniffa posted:

I don't understand why the AFC never held APNU accountable for violating the accord.  . 

Because you all called the man ni99amootoo, Dirty Indian, neemakaram, so he thinks that Granger is his best friend.

That is what the racist campaigning of Jagdeo did, when its main plank was "Nagamootoo is not an Indian"!

This would be one of the reasons the last few of us here sided with a coalition where before we wanted the AFC to stand alone.