WHERE IS FRIGGIN GAWU.  IT IS TIME TO SHUT THE ENTIRE INDUSTRRY DOWN!!!!!!!  LET THE PNC CUT THE CANE LIKE BURNHAM HAD THEM DOING!!!!!!!!!!!!

looks like this was ongoing...wha happen before...cat got yuh tongue?

Cat got who tongue?? Go back and look I called on GAWU to strike against the PPP Govt on more than one occasion. I dont hang my mouth for soup, I ONLY tell it like it is

LBI estate slated for closure since 2011 – GuySuCo

Posted by: Jomo Paul in Agriculture April 14, 2016 0 Comments

Nehru posted:

Cat got who tongue?? Go back and look I called on GAWU to strike against the PPP Govt on more than one occasion. I dont hang my mouth for soup, I ONLY tell it like it is

so what makes you think they will do something now? 

Guyana needs big big changes

Granger is finally doing what Jagdeo and Ramoutar should have done a long time ago. Govt can"t keep subsidizing a dead industry. 

Drugb posted:

Granger is finally doing what Jagdeo and Ramoutar should have done a long time ago. Govt can"t keep subsidizing a dead industry. 

So close the Bauxite Industry!!!!!!!!!!!!

Nehru posted:

Drugb posted:

Granger is finally doing what Jagdeo and Ramoutar should have done a long time ago. Govt can"t keep subsidizing a dead industry. 

So close the Bauxite Industry!!!!!!!!!!!!

Is bauxite being subsidized?  Sugar can not survive on its own without govt subisidies. It should be closed down or turned over to privte investors.

YES!!!!

Drugb posted:

 

Is bauxite being subsidized?  Sugar can not survive on its own without govt subisidies. It should be closed down or turned over to privte investors.

Your hero Jagdeo, had the opportunity to privatize Guysuco, but instead squandered millions on Skeldon.

Now that Guyana's production costs are way above global prices, and there is a global sugar glut, no one will be interested, other than DDL, which needs molasses for its rum.  They will immediately close down the bulk of Guysuco, were that to happen.

caribny posted:

Drugb posted:

 

Is bauxite being subsidized?  Sugar can not survive on its own without govt subisidies. It should be closed down or turned over to privte investors.

Your hero Jagdeo, had the opportunity to privatize Guysuco, but instead squandered millions on Skeldon.

Now that Guyana's production costs are way above global prices, and there is a global sugar glut, no one will be interested, other than DDL, which needs molasses for its rum.  They will immediately close down the bulk of Guysuco, were that to happen.

Jagdeo is not running things now.  It seems that this Granger Government does not know what to do, although they claimed to have the answer to everything.  They could have only fooled people like you. Are you too ashamed to admit that this Government is a failure and the PPP was better?

Ramakant-P posted:

Jagdeo is not running things now.  It seems that this Granger Government does not know what to do, although they claimed to have the answer to everything.  They could have only fooled people like you. Are you too ashamed to admit that this Government is a failure and the PPP was better?

Anyone admitting to that would be lying.

Drugb posted:

Nehru posted:

Drugb posted:

Granger is finally doing what Jagdeo and Ramoutar should have done a long time ago. Govt can"t keep subsidizing a dead industry. 

So close the Bauxite Industry!!!!!!!!!!!!

Is bauxite being subsidized?  Sugar can not survive on its own without govt subisidies. It should be closed down or turned over to privte investors.

Nonsense, you and many others, clearly don't understand the "macro-economic" role of the Sugar industry in the Guyana economy.  The sugar industry still brings positive added value to Guyana and must continue by receiving subsidies on local input costs!  As long as the input costs remains GYD and the revenues are USD, the sugar industry is net positive.  The case for bauxite is very very different!!

Until there is an alternative for Forex inflows, the sugar industry will still be vital!!

ba$eman posted:

Drugb posted:

Nehru posted:

Drugb posted:

Granger is finally doing what Jagdeo and Ramoutar should have done a long time ago. Govt can"t keep subsidizing a dead industry. 

So close the Bauxite Industry!!!!!!!!!!!!

Is bauxite being subsidized?  Sugar can not survive on its own without govt subisidies. It should be closed down or turned over to privte investors.

Nonsense, you and many others, clearly don't understand the "macro-economic" role of the Sugar industry in the Guyana economy.  The sugar industry still brings positive added value to Guyana and must continue by receiving subsidies on local input costs!  As long as the input costs remains GYD and the revenues are USD, the sugar industry is net positive.  The case for bauxite is very very different!!

Until there is an alternative for Forex inflows, the sugar industry will still be vital!!

Tell us how does Guyana gains by producing sugar at 800 and selling for 300.  How is this sustainble and why did the rest of the Carribbean close down theiir industry?

Ramakant-P posted:

 It seems that this Granger Government does not know what to do, ?

They know what to do. SHUT IT DOWN.

But of they do so, you and the rest of your brown bai KKK wil go into extreme hysteria, blocking the streets of Manhattan outside of the UN, screaming that "Guyana is now "Rawanda".

Jagdeo took Guysuco beyond the point where it can be salvaged, and even you know this.

ba$eman posted:

  The sugar industry still brings positive added value to Guyana

So why don't you sell it if you think it brings value.

Bauxite brings in foreign exchange, and the industry is no longer owned by the gov't, nor does it receive gov't subsidies.

What is so special about sugar workers.  Let them feel the full brunt of the market place as bauxite workers did. 

After all isn't it you who boast how "hardworking" Indians are?

caribny posted:

 

What is so special about sugar workers.  Let them feel the full brunt of the market place as bauxite workers did. 

 

your slip is showing. Yes sugar workers have received subsidies, but to say that bauxite workers have not is a patent lie. The whole of Linden receives free or heavily subsidized electricity. But I am not surprised because this is coming from a guy who once said that every Indo who votes for the PPP is a racist. 

For me though, none of this should be based on race or party affiliation, the wealth of Gy belongs to all of Gy and all must share the gains or pains for its development. 

However, I am totally in support of privatizing the sugar industry or diversifying. 

Can the dumb FOOL tell us why not close the Bauxite Industry?????????  Bloody RACIST PIG!!!!!!!!!

Nehru posted:

Can the dumb FOOL tell us why not close the Bauxite Industry?????????  Bloody RACIST PIG!!!!!!!!!

Bro, you must remember the PNC is out to suffer Indians and their way of life that they must run and beg the PNC for jobs. When they run and beg, they will be given a PNC card after they subscribed to Granger and the PNC. Granger's aim is to make Guyana a PNC Guyana, where every citizen must forget about the PPP. You are now under PNC control.

One Berbice factory produces more than two Demerara estates

GAWU was aware of LBI closure since 2011…

The decision to cease the remaining operations of the LBI sugar estate and consolidate it at Enmore, East Coast

GAWU’s General Secretary, Seepaul Narine

Demerara, started five years ago, with the unions very much aware, the Guyana Sugar Corporation (GuySuCo) said yesterday.
GuySuCo’s claims come amidst objections by the two unions, Guyana Agricultural and General Workers Union (GAWU) and the National Association of Agricultural, Commercial and Industrial Employees (NAACIE), over an announcement Tuesday by GuySuCo during a meeting.
The unions said that the closure of the LBI operation would result in more than 800 workers being deployed to Enmore estate.
The corporation, at the meeting, informed the two unions that the company has decided to have the operations of the Field Workshop, Mill Dock, Field Lab, Stores, and Administrative Offices that are based at LBI Estate merged with similar operations at Enmore Estate during this year.
The unions claimed that in 2011, when the LBI factory was closed and its workers were transferred to Enmore factory, both unions were assured by a member of the current Interim Management that there will be no closure of any other department after the closure of the factory.
“Thus, it was never expected that the corporation under the same management could decide to dismantle the costly buildings at LBI Estate, and end the operations which it approved about five years ago.”
However, GuySuCo is claiming something else.
The corporation said that earlier this month, on April 5, at a meeting at the La Bonne Intention (LBI) Estate

GuySuCo’s Finance Director, Paul Bhim

between GuySuCo and GAWU, the unions was informed of the need for the two parties to meet to discuss the completion of the integration process.
“A date was agreed upon, hence the meeting on April 12, last. Officials of GuySuCo met with representatives of the two unions on the ‘Finalisation of the Integration of East Demerara Estates’ on April 12, last.”
GuySuCo explained that since 2011, the unions and the corporation had met with each worker in the LBI factory over a five-day period to discuss the closure of the LBI factory and their re-deployment.
“The factory was then closed in the same year and workers were re-deployed to other positions within the Enmore Estate. In some instances, the authorized manning levels were exceeded to accommodate the workers,” GuySuCo said.
The corporation insisted that GAWU was fully involved in that process.
“Yet, the integration progress was not completed, since there are still two Mill Docks, two Field Workshops, two Field Laboratories, two Field Offices and two stores, within the East Demerara Estates operations at LBI.”
Tuesday’s meeting was to discuss the process of completing the integration which will see the Finance and Human Resources Departments moving to Enmore, the consolidation of the mill dock, the field workshop, the stores and the field laboratory from LBI with similar operations at Enmore.
“It should be noted that the full integration process should have been completed since 2011 but this was not done, to the further detriment of the economics of the EDE,” GuySuCo said.
“This state of affairs must be compared with Albion Estate which produces more than twice the amount of sugar

NAACIE’s General Secretary, Kenneth Joseph

as produced by the East Demerara Estates and operates efficiently with one Mill Dock, one Field Workshop, one Field Laboratory and one Mill Dock.”
GuySuCo said that interestingly, the unions have requested further information and have committed to work with GuySuCo to finalise the integration process over the coming weeks. “Therefore, GuySuCo finds it strange, that having been a part of the integration process over the years and having made commitments to see the process to completion at recent meetings, the unions would now issue this contradictory statement to the press.”
On Thursday, GuySuCo’s Finance Director, Paul Bhim, noted that LBI factory has been closed for a number of years now.
“The factory is already closed. We are consolidating the field and other administrative operations with Enmore where the factory is. The fields required to grow canes will still be doing that.”
GuySuCo, a state-owned company, has fallen on hard times and facing financial difficulties.
It has for over a decade been falling behind production targets with consecutive Governments being forced to plug billions of dollars annually to keep it afloat.
The David Granger administration had sacked the entire board and its boss, Dr. Raj Singh, when it took office last year May.
The industry managed to reach its annual target for the first time in a decade, at the end of 2015.
This year, as part of the cost-cutting measures, GuySuCo has announced plans also to consolidate and close its oldest factory, at Wales, and shift operations to Uitvlugt.
However, the unions have been against the closures and have held protest actions and vigils.
“Our unions are wary and concerned about the fate of the LBI workers. GAWU and NAACIE are hopeful that the unsavory and oppressive situation at Wales is not repeated, and call on GuySuCo to revisit its decision on the full closure of LBI.
“The unions reiterate their commitment to stand by the workers and will defend their rights that are protected by local and international labour laws,” the statement said yesterday.

politikalamity posted:

The whole of Linden receives free or heavily subsidized electricity.

 

Light bill subsidy vs.  subsidizing a job.  Even you will admit that this is hardly equivalent.

You do know that BOSAI also benefits from this subsidy.

politikalamity posted:

 

However, I am totally in support of privatizing the sugar industry or diversifying. 

 

And who will buy Guysuco in its current state?   Does the world need Guyana sugar?  NO!  Are the prepared to pay the price for Guyana sugar that will allow Guysuco to cover costs?  NO!

So why will any one buy it other than for real estate, or for molasses, in the case of DDL? DDL I am sure can produce most of its needs from a fraction of the acreages currently under Guyana sugar.

Rather than running around screaming "black man a starve ahbe" Jagdeo should be devising strategies to ease the transition from an industry which is no longer viable.  But folks would rather scream at the coalition gov't, as it struggles to deal  with the mess that Jagdeo left.

Drugb posted:

ba$eman posted:

Drugb posted:

Is bauxite being subsidized?  Sugar can not survive on its own without govt subisidies. It should be closed down or turned over to privte investors.

Nonsense, you and many others, clearly don't understand the "macro-economic" role of the Sugar industry in the Guyana economy.  The sugar industry still brings positive added value to Guyana and must continue by receiving subsidies on local input costs!  As long as the input costs remains GYD and the revenues are USD, the sugar industry is net positive.  The case for bauxite is very very different!!

Until there is an alternative for Forex inflows, the sugar industry will still be vital!!

Tell us how does Guyana gains by producing sugar at 800 and selling for 300.  How is this sustainble and why did the rest of the Carribbean close down theiir industry?

The 800 is mostly local input costs, very little is imported costs.  The 300 is all hard currency.  The 300 hard currency is then used to purchase critical foreign materiel to be used in creating much greater LVA and local economic activity.  Between Duties and VAT on LVA created using critical foreign materiel, the benefit to the domestic economy could be up to 10 fold the 300 forex imported materiel, dwarfing the 800 GYD local input costs.

The rest of the smaller nations found tourism to be more beneficial so they went that route.  If Guyana could find the alternative source of the 300 hard currency with less than the 800 local input costs, then go for it.  Until then, the 300 ounces of gold will be worth much more than the 800 ounces of brass!

And BTW, this is why the Sugar industry has to remain in the Govt's hands, there is no alternative!  Only the GoG has national economic and taxing jurisdiction to make this model work!

ba$eman posted:

The 800 is mostly local input costs, very little is imported costs.  The 300 is all hard currency.  The 300 hard currency is then used to purchase critical foreign materiel to be used in creating much greater LVA and local economic activity.  Between Duties and VAT on LVA created using critical foreign materiel, the benefit to the domestic economy could be up to 10 fold the 300 forex imported materiel, dwarfing the 800 GYD local input costs.

The rest of the smaller nations found tourism to be more beneficial so they went that route.  If Guyana could find the alternative source of the 300 hard currency with less than the 800 local input costs, then go for it.  Until then, the 300 ounces of gold will be worth much more than the 800 ounces of brass!

And BTW, this is why the Sugar industry has to remain in the Govt's hands, there is no alternative!  Only the GoG has national economic and taxing jurisdiction to make this model work!

The 800 is still cost, regardless of local or not. The bottom line is that 800 is expense and 300 is income which leaves a deficit of 500 which then becomes a liability to the state, hence the constant bailouts by govt. 

Drugb posted:

ba$eman posted:

The 800 is mostly local input costs, very little is imported costs.  The 300 is all hard currency.  The 300 hard currency is then used to purchase critical foreign materiel to be used in creating much greater LVA and local economic activity.  Between Duties and VAT on LVA created using critical foreign materiel, the benefit to the domestic economy could be up to 10 fold the 300 forex imported materiel, dwarfing the 800 GYD local input costs.

The rest of the smaller nations found tourism to be more beneficial so they went that route.  If Guyana could find the alternative source of the 300 hard currency with less than the 800 local input costs, then go for it.  Until then, the 300 ounces of gold will be worth much more than the 800 ounces of brass!

And BTW, this is why the Sugar industry has to remain in the Govt's hands, there is no alternative!  Only the GoG has national economic and taxing jurisdiction to make this model work!

The 800 is still cost, regardless of local or not. The bottom line is that 800 is expense and 300 is income which leaves a deficit of 500 which then becomes a liability to the state, hence the constant bailouts by govt. 

You totally miss the macro-economic model.  What you say is true if sugar is in private hands and the owner's sole responsibility is to make a straight-out Revenue less Costs = Profit domain model.  That is not the model for that industry.

You are smart, but you miss that boat on this!

The Govt has to bail out as the sugar industry contributes to economic activity beyond its immediate domain and the national treasury is the beneficiary!  The "bail out" is the subsidy which the Sugar industry deserves for being a Forex generator!

As I said, unless you can point to the source of replacing the 300 Forex, the Sugar industry is in-play!

ba$eman posted:

 

The 800 is mostly local input costs, very little is imported costs.

And where does the local dollars come from.  Since May you have been screaming that Guyana is in a depression, so clearly, using your logic, the gov't doesn't have the funds to spend tens of millions (US) on a few thousand workers, to the detriment of the vast majority who don't work in sugar.

Over the past 10 years Guysuco has received US$500 million in bailouts.  Do you think that this can be sustained indefinitely?

ba$eman posted:

 

The 800 is mostly local input costs, very little is imported costs. 

Aside from labor, a huge chunk of their costs are in hard currency.  Do you think that the massive amounts of debt that has been incurred will be serviced in GY$?

ba$eman posted:

Only the GoG has national economic and taxing jurisdiction to make this model work!

The problem is that they don't.   Guyana has a limited income tax base, and VAT is already killing the population.

caribny posted:

ba$eman posted:

 

The 800 is mostly local input costs, very little is imported costs. 

Aside from labor, a huge chunk of their costs are in hard currency.  Do you think that the massive amounts of debt that has been incurred will be serviced in GY$?

Excluding labor, what percentage of their remaining cost is in hard currency and what are these costs?

Who is the guarantor of the "massive amounts of the debt"?

caribny posted:

ba$eman posted:

The 800 is mostly local input costs, very little is imported costs.

And where does the local dollars come from.  Since May you have been screaming that Guyana is in a depression, so clearly, using your logic, the gov't doesn't have the funds to spend tens of millions (US) on a few thousand workers, to the detriment of the vast majority who don't work in sugar.

Over the past 10 years Guysuco has received US$500 million in bailouts.  Do you think that this can be sustained indefinitely?

What is the annual forex revenue of the sugar industry?

caribny posted:

ba$eman posted:

 

The 800 is mostly local input costs, very little is imported costs. 

Aside from labor, a huge chunk of their costs are in hard currency.  Do you think that the massive amounts of debt that has been incurred will be serviced in GY$?

Could you please provide the costs breakdown and show me where the vast majority of the costs are hard currency!

What is the debt service ratio of Guyana in May 2015?

caribny posted:

ba$eman posted:

Only the GoG has national economic and taxing jurisdiction to make this model work!

The problem is that they don't.   Guyana has a limited income tax base, and VAT is already killing the population.

Unfortunately VAT is a reality in a nation where hard currency is scarce and earned by loss-making industries which needs injections of subsidies to exist and provide further hard currency.

Back in 2011, I did not see how a major reduction in VAT would be realized!  It may be "killing" the population, but the population has to learn to rely more in locally produced products than foreign.

The best chance at alleviating this through added verticals and LVA was cheap power.  But the APNU/AFC would have none of it.  So the Guyanese people continue to suffer at the hands of selfish, unscrupulous and morally corrupt politicians!

caribny posted:

ba$eman posted:

Only the GoG has national economic and taxing jurisdiction to make this model work!

The problem is that they don't.   Guyana has a limited income tax base, and VAT is already killing the population.

You know little to nothing of what you speak!  I give you that much credit!

ksazma posted:

 

Who is the guarantor of the "massive amounts of the debt"?

100% of the debt is guaranteed by the gov't of Guyana.  Given that Guysuco imports plant and parts, and has raised foreign debt for Skeldon and other projects, I wonder why you think that it uses limited foreign currency.

ba$eman posted:

caribny posted:

ba$eman posted:

Only the GoG has national economic and taxing jurisdiction to make this model work!

The problem is that they don't.   Guyana has a limited income tax base, and VAT is already killing the population.

You know little to nothing of what you speak!  I give you that much credit!

And of course your opinions are so "enlightening" while you suggest that the bulk of the non labor expenses, in a nation which manufactures nothing, and a company which spent millions on a white elephant, doesn't utilize foreign exchange.

Guysuco is a drain, however you measure it.

“This state of affairs must be compared with Albion Estate which produces more than twice the amount of sugar

NAACIE’s General Secretary, Kenneth Joseph

as produced by the East Demerara Estates and operates efficiently with one Mill Dock, one Field Workshop, one Field Laboratory and one Mill Dock.”

Using the Albion method, maybe they can save the sugar industry.  

Tola posted:

“This state of affairs must be compared with Albion Estate which produces more than twice the amount of sugar

NAACIE’s General Secretary, Kenneth Joseph

as produced by the East Demerara Estates and operates efficiently with one Mill Dock, one Field Workshop, one Field Laboratory and one Mill Dock.”

Using the Albion method, maybe they can save the sugar industry.  

Looks like Albion cane have more sucrose content and an efficient sugar mill.

ba$eman posted:

You totally miss the macro-economic model.  What you say is true if sugar is in private hands and the owner's sole responsibility is to make a straight-out Revenue less Costs = Profit domain model.  That is not the model for that industry.

You are smart, but you miss that boat on this!

The Govt has to bail out as the sugar industry contributes to economic activity beyond its immediate domain and the national treasury is the beneficiary!  The "bail out" is the subsidy which the Sugar industry deserves for being a Forex generator!

As I said, unless you can point to the source of replacing the 300 Forex, the Sugar industry is in-play!

I don't see how spending 800 to gain 300 is a sound economic model. Wouldn't it be better to scrap the industry and spend 500 on infrastructure etc?

Drugb posted:

ba$eman posted:

You totally miss the macro-economic model.  What you say is true if sugar is in private hands and the owner's sole responsibility is to make a straight-out Revenue less Costs = Profit domain model.  That is not the model for that industry.

You are smart, but you miss that boat on this!

The Govt has to bail out as the sugar industry contributes to economic activity beyond its immediate domain and the national treasury is the beneficiary!  The "bail out" is the subsidy which the Sugar industry deserves for being a Forex generator!

As I said, unless you can point to the source of replacing the 300 Forex, the Sugar industry is in-play!

I don't see how spending 800 to gain 300 is a sound economic model. Wouldn't it be better to scrap the industry and spend 500 on infrastructure etc?

This is the economic model legacy of the PPP/C. Thanks for pointing it out.