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Sara Khan, 17, a New Yorker whose parents immigrated to the United States from Pakistan, said of President-elect Donald J. Trump, “What are we going to do if he tries to kick us out?”CreditChristian Hansen for The New York Times

Muslim Americans, already alarmed by the election of Donald J. Trump, said Friday that Mr. Trump’s choices for crucial posts heightened their fears of discrimination, violence, deportation and even detention.

Many said they worried that a more hostile America could prompt more Muslims to join forces with terrorists.

During the presidential campaign, Mr. Trump said “Islam hates us,” endorsed the idea of a government registry of Muslims and proposed suspending immigration by Muslims or people from some Muslim-majority countries. In interviews on Friday, many Muslims said that they were not sure before the election how seriously to take such talk, hoping that it was more political hyperbole than policy, but that the personnel moves of the last few days had confirmed their worst fears.

At the Dream Cafe, a hookah bar in the Astoria neighborhood of Queens, Sara Khan, 17, whose parents are from Pakistan, expressed particular concern about her family’s ability to remain in the United States. “What are we going to do if he tries to kick us out?” she asked of Mr. Trump.

 
 

“People from all over the world come here to find freedom,” she said, but now she wonders what that freedom means if “one man can take it away.”

Mr. Trump has offered the post of national security adviser to Michael T. Flynn, a retired Army general who has written that “fear of Muslims is rational,” has said that “Islam is a political ideology” and is “like a malignant cancer.” For director of central intelligence, Mr. Trump has tapped Representative Mike Pompeo of Kansas, who has said that “most Islamic leaders across America” were complicit in terrorist attacks for not speaking out more forcefully.

He has asked Senator Jeff Sessions of Alabama, who has endorsed a Muslim immigration ban, to be attorney general, and has named Stephen K. Bannon, whom critics have denounced as a white nationalist, as senior White House strategist. And some Trump supporters have cited the internment of Japanese-Americans during World War II as a possible precedent.

“I did not take Trump’s statements seriously enough, and I did not take these white nationalists as seriously as I should have,” said Zareena Grewal, an associate professor of American studies and religious studies at Yale. “That these people have moved from the fringe of American politics to the very center should frighten everybody.”

Hanan Hassan, a native of Iraq who works at a refugee center in Phoenix, mostly with people from Syria, said her mood and that of her clients had changed drastically.

“Some of us are scared of being sent back,” she said. “Our children are having issues at school.”

Ms. Hassan, 37, who said her parents and her brother were killed by a car bomb in Baghdad, said, “We left home because it was not safe there,” but now the United States feels unsafe.

Some voiced worries about a Muslim registry, and the prospect of being tracked and investigated by the government, noting that a registry for noncitizens from some Arab countries, in effect from 2002 to 2011, resulted in few leads on terrorism, but many deportations. Others shrugged off the prospect, saying that they assumed they were under surveillance already.

And people were still unsure how seriously to take the even more troubling idea — not raised by anyone with a formal role on the Trump team — of internment.

“I don’t put it past them,” said Nihad Awad, executive director of the Council of American Islamic Relations. “Personnel is policy, and Flynn considers us as the enemy, so what kind of policies is he going to push forward? The Muslim community will be at his mercy.”

Linda Sarsour, executive director of the Arab American Association of New York, said: “I believe in my heart that our fellow Americans would not let that happen. I’m not saying that it definitely won’t happen. The fact that we’re even having this conversation is really spreading a lot of fear in the community.”

Muslim leaders said their strategy would be to mount legal challenges and to strengthen alliances with other religious and ethnic groups.

Muslim, Jewish and Christian clergy members and lay leaders gathered in front of mosque in Washington on Friday in a demonstration of mutual support. Mobilized by an interfaith group called “Shoulder to Shoulder,” they asked President-elect Trump to keep his election-night promise that he will serve as the president of all Americans.

“American Muslims follow the U.S. Constitution,” said Rizwan Jaka, chairman of the board of the ADAMS Center, one of the nation’s largest mosques, in Northern Virginia. “We call upon this incoming administration to also follow it.”

They refrained from criticizing Mr. Trump or his selections, and instead called on them to recognize that American Muslims serve the United States as doctors, teachers and law enforcement officers. They said that, contrary to claims by Mr. Pompeo and others, American Muslims routinely denounce terrorist attacks perpetrated by Islamic extremists, and have been credited by the Department of Homeland Security with preventing attacks by reporting suspects to the authorities.

Usama Shami, president of the Islamic Community Center in Phoenix, said he had received an outpouring of support from non-Muslims, including some who came in person to join in Friday Prayers, and others who offered to register as Muslims if a registry is created.

“All of that gives us comfort,” Mr. Shami said. “The problem is, in this day and age — this is 2016, almost 2017 — we’re going backward. Make America great again? How? Having an internment camp for Muslims as they had for Japanese? Appointing Islamophobes for key positions?”

Still, some Muslims held out hope that the Trump team may be more bluster than real threat.

“He is a businessman, and businessmen have plenty of masks they wear everyday,” said Heshem Hassane, 42, an Egyptian immigrant who owns an ironworks in New York. He expressed doubt about whether the new administration would follow through on some plans, but added, “there’s no person who’s not concerned unless he’s isolated about what’s going on.”

For many Muslims, their fears are less about Trump administration policies than about a hostile atmosphere that they say could promote violence against them. The FBI reported this week that anti-Muslim hate crimes rose 67 percent in 2015, and Muslim groups say 2016 is on track to be worse.

“Every day people are calling from all over the country to tell me about incidents and attacks, and I have to tell people, I’m not a Trump emergency responder,” Dr. Grewal said. “People are worried about their actual, physical safety, about attacks. People are asking, ‘Do we buy a gun? Do we get a dog?’ ”

For many Muslims, the worst prospect of all is that members of their community, alienated by the political atmosphere and government action, could heed calls by Islamic extremists to carry out terrorist attacks.

“ISIS will have more disenfranchised people, people pushed to the margins, to appeal to,” Mr. Awad said. “This is music to their ears.”

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NY Attorney General Calls for Vigilance on Hate Crimes | DiversityInc

“To remain silent is to engage in a dangerous new permissiveness that threatens our American way.”

By Kaitlyn D’Onofrio

In light of the recent surge in hate crimes across the country, New York Attorney General Eric Schneiderman is urging law enforcement to identify and prosecute those that occur.

Schneiderman held a meeting with civil rights leaders Thursday to discuss the sharp increase in hate crimes, which the Southern Poverty Law Center (SPLC) previously reported has hit record numbers since Donald Trump became the president-elect on Election Day.

“As the state’s top law enforcement officer, let me assure anyone who is feeling scared or threatened at this time that this office stands behind you and has your back,” Schneiderman said. “New York’s diversity is our greatest strength, and we will not allow anyone to turn that strength against us.”

Schneiderman and his team sent a bulletin to law enforcement and district attorney offices in the state that provides help and guidance “to identify, investigate, and prosecute hate crimes against immigrants, religious minorities, ethnic and racial minorities, women, LGBTQ New Yorkers, and other vulnerable communities,” according to a release from his office.

“It is not okay to be a bigot in New York or in America. It never has been it never will be,” Schneiderman said on Thursday.

NY Attorney General Eric Schneiderman Calls for Vigilance on Hate Crimes

New York Attorney General Eric Schneiderman

As of November 14 the SPLC has collected 437 reports of hate crimes just since the election. This number of hate incidents is often seen over a period of several months, rather than less than one week. The SPLC also reported that “many incidents involved direct references to the Trump campaign and its slogans.”

New York has been no exception. On Wednesday night, Ku Klux Klan (KKK) fliers were found in Patchogue, Long Island, and on Thursday morning a swastika was found drawn on the B train in Manhattan. Earlier crimes included “Make America White Again” graffiti and a swastika found in Buffalo, a Black doll hung by a noose in a freshman dorm at Canisius College (also in Buffalo), a gay pride flag burned on someone’s porch in Rochester and a swastika and “Trump” found spray painted on a dorm building at State University of New York (SUNY) Geneso.

New York Gov. Andrew Cuomo issued a statement on Thursday calling on everyone “to denounce and repudiate these expressions” and to hold accountable those who are responsible:

“Let me be very clear: These acts of hate and intolerance go against everything New York stands for. We have welcomed generations of immigrants with open arms. This state will continue that proud legacy – we will not turn our backs and we will not let this heated rhetoric divide us. We will stand strong united in the face of intolerance and show the world that we are one people, one family, and one New York.”

Cuomo also launched a hotline for residents to report bias, hate crimes and discrimination. New Yorkers can call the toll-free hotline at (888) 392-3644 from 9:00 a.m. to 5:00 p.m. Monday through Friday.

Civil rights activists and leaders praised Schneiderman’s efforts and the bulletin. Thomas Zugibe, president of the District Attorneys Association of New York, called the bulletin “an important tool for law enforcement and district attorney offices.”

“I applaud Attorney General Eric Schneiderman for leading the effort and coordinating this useful document,” Zugibe said.

Evan R. Bernstein, regional director of the Anti-Defamation League in New York, called the rise in anti-Semitic hate crimes “deeply concerning” and said the crimes have bred fear and anxiety.

“We have been gratified by the strong statements of support that have come from our elected officials in response to the hate and hope it continues,” he said.

“LGBTQ immigrants are too often targets for violence and persecution,” said Aaron C. Morris, executive director of Immigration Equality. “We are grateful to Attorney General Schneiderman for his leadership in ensuring that New York remains a safe haven for the queer immigrant community.”

On Election Day Trump lost New York to Hillary Clinton, 58.8 percent to 37.5 percent. Trump was booed by New Yorkers when he went to the ballot to cast his vote in his home state.

 

Chief

I suppose when Christians and Hindus are persecuted in Pakistan, that is not considered a hate crime. Or, is it because in Urdu there is no such word. I suppose pay back is a bitch.

My advise, live within the American laws. Doan mek waves, Doan impose your will. Live and let live.

And remember, we are all visitors in the White mans world. Anytime, he can deny us. There is no law that prevents him from doing it.

We all immigrate from some place, but the White people doan even consider that they too immigrated. And those who wish  to shame them for it is juss behaving like an ass.

Trump's victory will make the muslims work even harder to weed out any radicals. Bcz, if something should go wrong they all will be painted with same brush.

As for the appointments, I agree with them. The administration is doing what is right for ENTIRE AMERICA. Not for communities. That is good government.

However, to give Mitt Romney, Secretary of State is a big mistake. He doesn't have what it takes for the job. He will make things a mess for Trump.

God Bless the President-elect. Donald J. Trump. Let the man take his office and then observe.

S
seignet posted:

We all immigrate from some place, but the White people doan even consider that they too immigrated. And those who wish  to shame them for it is juss behaving like an ass.

In this free country the ole USA,European immigrants doesn't have more rights than any Immigrants from other parts of the world,who ever wants to change that will have a difficult time,wait and see.

Django
Last edited by Django
Django posted:
seignet posted:

We all immigrate from some place, but the White people doan even consider that they too immigrated. And those who wish  to shame them for it is juss behaving like an ass.

In this free country the ole USA,European immigrants doesn't have more rights than any Immigrants from other parts of the world,who ever wants to change that will have a difficult time,wait and see.

Go down south, redneck country and tell them this. You will be seen hanging form a tree.

FM

The first thing to note is that the Supreme Court can overturn a Presidential Executive Order. Don't believe that the judges, whether put in there by GW Bush, Obama or Trump vote along party lines on big issues, even Roe v Wade where disruption would be great in the context of decades-old acceptance. Congress can also pass legislation blocking some or all provisions and a 2/3 majority can over-ride a the norm. Presidential veto. 

Once the Intelligence community is done giving Trump and his advisors, they will realize that Congress and the Supreme Court will find this outside 

Right now it's rhetoric and Trump's choice of security advisors are feeding a frenzy. Don't forget too a lot of cities, NYC included have said they will become sanctuary cities and will not work with the Administration on any Registry or reporting illegals.

Kari
skeldon_man posted:
Django posted:
seignet posted:

We all immigrate from some place, but the White people doan even consider that they too immigrated. And those who wish  to shame them for it is juss behaving like an ass.

In this free country the ole USA,European immigrants doesn't have more rights than any Immigrants from other parts of the world,who ever wants to change that will have a difficult time,wait and see.

Go down south, redneck country and tell them this. You will be seen hanging form a tree.

Bhai Skelly, i mingled with some of these fellas at Conferences in the middle of this country [the attendance about three hundred],the colored crowd was about 10,my friend from India [living in Massachusetts] and my self are the only Indians,i learned a lot from my observation,I am a proud New En-glander i love these States where i can travel freely where you are treated with respect.Whites from the North East aren't accepted favorably down south,one guy who travel this whole country due to his gob type told me he have to change his accent when down south.

Django
Last edited by Django
Kari posted:

 NYC included have said they will become sanctuary cities and will not work with the Administration on any Registry or reporting illegals.

More cities will follow,chaos in the next four years.

Django
Chief posted:

We will be okay insha Allah.

The trauma to our Muslim kids is what I am worried about.

Chief,

ALL of us are concerned about the killing of people by governments, whether its Guyana, Pakistan, India or Rwanda. I said before that you, Kari and DG (he only post negative things about Trump) are over-reacting about the Trump presidency. When I dragged my feet to vote for Clinton I did feel that Trump's argument to make the country more secure from terrorist threats and controlling illegal immigration make sense and its something all  governments ought to do.

First, we dont know exactly what he plans on doing in terms of policy. So pressing the panic button now is like putting the cart before the donkey. 

Second, this country is not Guyana. They abide by long established laws. Trump makes me nervous toot, but here are many checks and balances, and organizations that will address some of the concerns you guys are expressing here.

Third, Trump was especially targetting illegals and suspected terrorists (I dont see any way in which they can simply target the Muslim religion and get away with this). Your point in another thread that only a tiny fraction of Muslims are engaged in these acts is well taken but the issue has to be addressed, whether its a small number or not. Open borders is not good for anyone. The Venezuelans can walk over and take over Ankoko and no one will notice or say a word.

Four, you and Kari are safe in your homes in this country. Both of you are legal here. You have nothing to fear. Its a little hypocritical when you start whining about your rights being emasculated. Yours will never be

Five, I am sure both of you good Guyanese at heart. But I notice that both of you resort to calling people names if they say anything that may be construed as support for Trump. Pointing out these things does not automatically make anyone anti-Muslim.  

Cheers brother,

Vish 

 

V

Vish I know that you think that you are white. Do some research and you will find that this country does have a history of government sanctioned murder by government officials  Just ask Ahmadou Diallo's mother about how GHOULIANI behaved after his armed thugs gunned down her son with 41 bullets.

This is NOT a country of laws!

FM

Kari I challenge you to tell me when the conservative judges have ever voted against the GOP. Trump will put a member of the KKK, because that is clear in his appointments.

Just hope that Kennedy or Ginsburg don't suddenly get too ill to remain on the Supreme Court because then the GOP will go full hog. A second KKK will be appointed.

FM
caribny posted:

Vish I know that you think that you are white. Do some research and you will find that this country does have a history of government sanctioned murder by government officials  Just ask Ahmadou Diallo's mother about how GHOULIANI behaved after his armed thugs gunned down her son with 41 bullets.

This is NOT a country of laws!

Carib,

For a guy who is usually well aware of things, but mostly prone to calling people names and using pigeonhole pejoratives, and who seem to live on this site to score points, my comments about the fear about Trump is recognized but there are safeguards in this country. 

First you tell me that I am "white" (I am a Guyanese dougla, if you want to know) and that this country has a history of sanctioning murder by government officials.

No one is denying government liability, but you fail to acknowledge that there are democratic safeguards and legal redress for citizens of this country today. Its not Guyana. You fail to acknowledge that Diallo (god rest his soul), or his family was "compensated". There are laws to address these kinds of crimes.

You fail to recognize that the USA has changed over the centuries from the time when only wealthy white males could vote.   

Your comment that "This is NOT a country of laws!" is as much of a BS statement as they come from you. This is a very litigious society, which has evolved from its chequered past. Even your most loyal friends on GNI will not support this comment of yours. You must be drinking the weekend piwari.

V
Kari posted:

The first thing to note is that the Supreme Court can overturn a Presidential Executive Order. Don't believe that the judges, whether put in there by GW Bush, Obama or Trump vote along party lines on big issues, even Roe v Wade where disruption would be great in the context of decades-old acceptance. Congress can also pass legislation blocking some or all provisions and a 2/3 majority can over-ride a the norm. Presidential veto. 

Once the Intelligence community is done giving Trump and his advisors, they will realize that Congress and the Supreme Court will find this outside 

Right now it's rhetoric and Trump's choice of security advisors are feeding a frenzy. Don't forget too a lot of cities, NYC included have said they will become sanctuary cities and will not work with the Administration on any Registry or reporting illegals.

With rhetoric like that, I am not going to be surprised if civil war breaks out again. The last time it did was over the Freedom States rights to have slaves. Today, it is going to be those who wishes to weaken the States against those who wants to maintain law and order. 

S
Django posted:
Kari posted:

 NYC included have said they will become sanctuary cities and will not work with the Administration on any Registry or reporting illegals.

More cities will follow,chaos in the next four years.

With Flynn and Bannon, ayuh razz looking to get put out. Try breaking the laws of the country and Deportation order will be read. Doan encourage dem bhais to begin chaos, is nah Trump coming for them. Dey have to deal with Flynn and Bannon.

S

Vish, the wannabe white man.  Amadou Diallo was murdered in 1999. His murdered was justified by Giuliani, who will have a major role in this regime.  The murder Dorismond, another black man murdered by agents of the US government, was also justified by Giuliani, and there were many others.

NONE of these people were punished for these murders of innocent people.

So with Giuliani, Sessions, Flynn, and Bannon, all confirmed bigots who don't see that non whites have any rights that they will respect what legal redress can we expect.

What legal redress did Ahmadou Diallo get when he was shot while taken out his wallet to show his ID?

So continue to think that there is no reason to be concerned.  Continue to "normalize" bigotry and attack those who simply warn that they expect equal treatment by agents of the law.

Sessions, who will be AG, thinks that the only wrong with the KKK is that "they smoke pot".  Yes HE will be the one responsible for maintaining the fairness of the laws.

And if you are a dougla better yet. In this country you are BLACK, not white.  It is very evident that there are many who don't think that the lives of blacks matter.

So continue to attack those who express concern with the fact that the Trump regime is an emerging dictatorship of nutcases!

FM
Last edited by Former Member
seignet posted:
Kari posted:

.

With rhetoric like that, I am not going to be surprised if civil war breaks out again. The last time it did was over the Freedom States rights to have slaves. Today, it is going to be those who wishes to weaken the States against those who wants to maintain law and order. 

In fact the West Coast and the Northeast should leave the rest of the country. It is however a fact that we pay more into the Federal government than we get back, so let those Trump slackers take care of themselves!

FM
Last edited by Former Member
caribny posted:

Vish, the wannabe white man.  Amadou Diallo was murdered in 1999. His murdered was justified by Giuliani, who will have a major role in this regime.  The murder Dorismond, another black man murdered by agents of the US government, was also justified by Giuliani, and there were many others.

NONE of these people were punished for these murders of innocent people.

So continue to think that there is no reason to be concerned.  Continue to "normalize" bigotry and attack those who simply warn that they expect equal treatment by agents of the law.

Sessions, who will be AG, thinks that the only wrong with the KKK is that "they smoke pot".  Yes HE will be the one responsible for maintaining the fairness of the laws.

And if you are a dougla better yet. In this country you are BLACK, not white.  It is very evident that there are many who don't think that the lives of blacks matter.

So continue to attack those who express concern with the fact that the Trump regime is an emerging dictatorship of nutcases!

No one is justifying killing or murder. Did they have legal redress? Did a dictator prevent them or their families from going to court? Trump regime is turning into a dictatorship...? 

Just because his ideology and what he says during the campaign does not fit into your vision, is not enough reason to panic. Governing is very different from campaigning.

V
caribny posted:
seignet posted:
Kari posted:

.

With rhetoric like that, I am not going to be surprised if civil war breaks out again. The last time it did was over the Freedom States rights to have slaves. Today, it is going to be those who wishes to weaken the States against those who wants to maintain law and order. 

In fact the West Coast and the Northeast should leave the rest of the country. It is however a fact that we pay more into the Federal government than we get back, so let those Trump slackers take care of themselves!

I've thinking, with all your smarts. Why doan u use the opportunity set aside business offers and develop a company to assist Afro-Americans. So much money is available for the assistance.

S
VishMahabir posted:
caribny posted:

.

No one is justifying killing or murder. Did they have legal redress? .

No legal redress. In fact Giuliani spent lots of time maligning Diallo and Dorismond.  And by the way Dorismond was killed because some plain clothes cops were trying to get him to buy drugs from them He refused, and they got angry.

Giuliani justified these murders.  He used the full force of the law to protect his thugs.  THIS is why there is now an active Black Lives Matter, because evidence is that to many in government the lives of blacks don't!

Sessions says that the KKK is OK except that they smoke weed.  The KKK were a group of murderous thugs, who at time enjoyed legal protection. Even up to the 90s there were jurisdictions in the South which prevented the prosecution of these people. Sessions was in the middle of this.

These are the people who you think will enforce the rule of law and allow legal redress.

You are either stupid, naïve, or think that your desire to be white will ensure that they treat you as one.

FM
Last edited by Former Member
seignet posted:
.

I've thinking, with all your smarts. Why doan u use the opportunity set aside business offers and develop a company to assist Afro-Americans. So much money is available for the assistance.

You see this is the problem when clowns like you babble. You don't know me. You don't know what I do.

And in fact by slapping clowns like you down I am helping blacks, because we are SICK and TIRED of clowns like you maligning us on a daily basis.

A black middle class emerged in this country because blacks fought against racism when ever it emerged. It will NOT be tolerated on GNI as long as I continue to post here.

Given that this forum appears quite often on GOOGLE I will NOT allow racists like you to define who blacks are!

FM
Last edited by Former Member

There are some battyboys here who think that Chief and I are worried. We're more American than SeigHeil and VishNUT. These azzholes think that Obama in the last 8 years did nothing about terrorism or illegals. Those pricks, I tell ya.

Kari
seignet posted:

 

Trump's victory will make the muslims work even harder to weed out any radicals. Bcz, if something should go wrong they all will be painted with same brush.

 

This has been happening even before Trump was elected. Perhaps even before you and I left Guyana.

FM

Now that Trump has been elected president, I am resolved to wait and see how he governs. Maybe he will not take us to a point of no return or maybe he will. The question will be if he does, will those lazy Democrats go out in force in 2018 to try to salvage some of America's dignity or would 2018 already be too late.

FM
seignet posted:
Django posted:
Kari posted:

 NYC included have said they will become sanctuary cities and will not work with the Administration on any Registry or reporting illegals.

More cities will follow,chaos in the next four years.

With Flynn and Bannon, ayuh razz looking to get put out. Try breaking the laws of the country and Deportation order will be read. Doan encourage dem bhais to begin chaos, is nah Trump coming for them. Dey have to deal with Flynn and Bannon.

Have you how many of those illegal immigrants breaking the law have been deported by Obama? Why do you think that what Donald Trump intends to do would bring on this "Try breaking the laws of the country and Deportation order will be read." Are you so dumbsh1t that you do not know that has been happening since G W Bush and continued under Obama. What will Donald Trump do that means that hasn't happened? Flynn is an Advisor - not a law maker or enforcer. Same with Bannon. The reason they're mentioned is to show Donald Trump's bigoted thinking. But Trump and those two will get nowhere as America's institutions are stronger than cronies intent on misusing the law. Let them try breaking the law and see where they end up. You know of G W Bush's cronies who ended up in jail, right?! Watch out, this is a nation of laws and these two crooks will be scrutinized. You do not know the power of organizing in America, and what Congress can do to Administration officials. You forgot because Obama's Administration was pure class and very clean.

Kari
Kari posted:
. America's institutions are stronger than cronies intent on misusing the law. ..

1.  the Supreme Court appointing Bush in 2000.

2. The FBI being used to "endorse" Trump a mere few weeks ago.

3. The Supreme Court being used to condone voter suppression in many states in this past election?

You seem to have great faith in these institutions.  I think that your faith is misplaced.

Homeland Security is a creature of Bush. Now just think about that for a minute.

This especially as your Obama was such a gentleman that he let many GOP creatures remain in strong positions, Comey being but one example.

Trump will not only weed out all Democrats, but he will only select those from the nutcase end of the GOP. One can only hope that some sense prevails and Romney becomes Secretary of State.

And don't think that the Democrats will necessarily protect you. Recall how they all caved when Bush declared his ill conceived Iraq invasion, Hillary being but one example, and even Sanders wasn't immune.

FM
Last edited by Former Member

Caribny, there are instances where institutions held officials accountable in the history of the United States. It's not all one-sided. Paul Ryan already told Trump he's getting no money for a deportation force. What does that tell you about institutions? Ryan has a constituency and so too do a lot of GOP Congressmen. Don't forget that less than half of the voting population voted for Trump. And you must pay cognizance to movements that brought change to America - from civil rights to the gay movement and recently Black Lives Matter.

Kari

Hillary won CA by over 3 million. She won the national vote by 1.4 million.  That means that the she lost the remaining states by at least 1.6 million.

The GOP don't care a rat's ass about CA. Like NY its a state that they will never win, so let us take off the fact that Trump lost the national vote off the table.

Let is further consider that with NO help from the GOP Trump won 1 million votes more than Romney, even as Hillary got 2 million LESS than Obama.

Even up to a few weeks before the election Ryan told the GOP that they don't have to support Trump. He did NOT campaigning for Trump. Trump will NOT forget this.

If Ryan becomes a thorn in Trump's side he can threaten to primary any number of GOP House candidates to scare them away from working with Ryan.

Here is the deal Kari.  Trump won the electoral college. BOTH the establishment Democrats and GOP lost, and the band of nutcases that Trump is assembling to be part of his leadership is evidence of this.

Trump owns the GOP and the GOP control the Supreme Court, the Presidency, the Senate, the House and the vast majority of state legislatures and governorships.

A further fact for you. More Democratic senators are up for election in 2018, many of these in states that Trump won.

So please don't tell me that institutions are immune, unless you really believe that the FBI wasn't part of a conspiracy to ensure that Hillary lost. Many of these federal institutions are staffed by GOP operatives.

FM

Now let us examine why Trump won the Midwest.

1. He had a "stronger" message which acknowledged the economic concerns of the Midwest working class. Whites who voted for him, and blacks who stayed home. 

2. Immigration, which is not only undocumented migrants but concerns that immigrants on the whole are culturally changing the USA.

3. National security, which means fear of Muslims.

So you think the threat of a registry of Muslims will cause Trump voters to object?  Muslims aren't an important constituency, and well articulated rejection of Trump's anti Muslim bigotry clearly failed. Trump won!

Don't even bet on Schumer, as he takes orders from Jerusalem.

Trump will be stopped when people stop him. If you think that "institutions" will do so you are no different from Vish.

FM

Caribny, we both have the same facts, but our interpretations are different. So some Americans count and others don't in your estimation. So Trump owns the monolithic GOP and the supreme Court and all the Federal judges appointed over the years under Bush and Obama. So suddenly the entire Administration infrastructure is owned by Trump , rendering the great American institutions impotent. Trump is more of a superman than I thought. He uis bigger than a President of the USA. Heck he's more like an imperial King of the United States of Trumpland.

Kari
caribny posted:
seignet posted:
.

I've thinking, with all your smarts. Why doan u use the opportunity set aside business offers and develop a company to assist Afro-Americans. So much money is available for the assistance.

You see this is the problem when clowns like you babble. You don't know me. You don't know what I do.

And in fact by slapping clowns like you down I am helping blacks, because we are SICK and TIRED of clowns like you maligning us on a daily basis.

A black middle class emerged in this country because blacks fought against racism when ever it emerged. It will NOT be tolerated on GNI as long as I continue to post here.

Given that this forum appears quite often on GOOGLE I will NOT allow racists like you to define who blacks are!

I made a simple inquiry. Black people reading ur many posts must be getting sick with ur racism. U definitely have a problem. 

S
Kari posted:

Caribny, we both have the same facts, but our interpretations are different. So some Americans count and others don't in your estimation. So Trump owns the monolithic GOP and the supreme Court and all the Federal judges appointed over the years under Bush and Obama. So suddenly the entire Administration infrastructure is owned by Trump , rendering the great American institutions impotent. Trump is more of a superman than I thought. He uis bigger than a President of the USA. Heck he's more like an imperial King of the United States of Trumpland.

sort of. He comes from an imperial standing. And his Presidency will be more like a monarch ran system. Respect for authority.

S
Kari posted:
seignet posted:
Django posted:
Kari posted:

 NYC included have said they will become sanctuary cities and will not work with the Administration on any Registry or reporting illegals.

More cities will follow,chaos in the next four years.

With Flynn and Bannon, ayuh razz looking to get put out. Try breaking the laws of the country and Deportation order will be read. Doan encourage dem bhais to begin chaos, is nah Trump coming for them. Dey have to deal with Flynn and Bannon.

Have you how many of those illegal immigrants breaking the law have been deported by Obama? Why do you think that what Donald Trump intends to do would bring on this "Try breaking the laws of the country and Deportation order will be read." Are you so dumbsh1t that you do not know that has been happening since G W Bush and continued under Obama. What will Donald Trump do that means that hasn't happened? Flynn is an Advisor - not a law maker or enforcer. Same with Bannon. The reason they're mentioned is to show Donald Trump's bigoted thinking. But Trump and those two will get nowhere as America's institutions are stronger than cronies intent on misusing the law. Let them try breaking the law and see where they end up. You know of G W Bush's cronies who ended up in jail, right?! Watch out, this is a nation of laws and these two crooks will be scrutinized. You do not know the power of organizing in America, and what Congress can do to Administration officials. You forgot because Obama's Administration was pure class and very clean.

America is a nation built by the working class. They are supreme. The rules and laws were made by them,"for the people, by the people." They are barbaric enough to tear anything down. And God knows, they all have access to guns.

And they have just spoken by nominating Trump as their benefactor. Flynn and Bannon has his ears. They will give him White People advise. 

S
seignet posted:

America is a nation built by the working class. They are supreme. The rules and laws were made by them,"for the people, by the people." They are barbaric enough to tear anything down. And God knows, they all have access to guns.

And they have just spoken by nominating Trump as their benefactor. Flynn and Bannon has his ears. They will give him White People advise. 

America was built by slave labor then by oppressive low waged laborers and saw fairness in the system only with the emergence of unions and civil rights.  Less than a 100K people in 3 states; 12k in one 27k in another and the rest in the last so you are making a flawed argument of some working class resurgent movement who are law givers. It is a white old people movement that aided him and to their detriment they will most bear the burdens of his trickle down policies.

Nothing he said will work and the only retrospective of a great america is in his head.  What will work is the remnants of liberal policies that under girds Americas social ethos. It suggests that america greatness is in its unique open society and America being greater in the future and it does not situate itself in insular nativism. It rests in capitalizing on the strength of a global people all working towards the betterment of mankind. The people you mentioned are bigoted dredges

FM
Kari posted:

Caribny, we both have the same facts, but our interpretations are different. So some Americans count and others don't in your estimation. So Trump owns the monolithic GOP and the supreme Court and all the Federal judges appointed over the years under Bush and Obama. So suddenly the entire Administration infrastructure is owned by Trump , rendering the great American institutions impotent. Trump is more of a superman than I thought. He uis bigger than a President of the USA. Heck he's more like an imperial King of the United States of Trumpland.

The institutions are controlled by the President, the Supreme Court, the Senate and the House. Those who lead these institutions are selected by some combination of these.

The laws of this country is interpreted and implemented by some combination of these.

So if Trump controls the GOP, and at least for the time being he does, then YOU should be watching what he is doing. Because ALL of this institutions are now GOP controlled.

It gets worse. With the majority of state governors and legislatures now being GOP controlled, even where decisions and actions are at the local, and not he federal level, the GOP, hence Trump, will have control. And of course the gerrymandering of congressional seats continues unhindered.

So YES when one party controls the entire governing apparatus in this nation its head is a super man.

I would have thought that the whole Comey affair would have taught how corrupted by politics these institutions are.

It was specifically timed to coincide with the last week before the election, when millions vote, and where the undecided voters finally determine their  vote. WE don't know whether Hillary would have won, if this even didn't occur, but we do know that the narrowness of her losses in the Midwest suggest that Comey's antics had some degree of success, when compounded with the Hillary campaign failures.

FACT. The GOP ran against Trump, and Trump won. The GOP establishment are terrified out of their whits.

FM
Django posted:
Kari posted:

 NYC included have said they will become sanctuary cities and will not work with the Administration on any Registry or reporting illegals.

More cities will follow,chaos in the next four years.

Simple solution, cut off Federal funding where possible.  When your taxes skyrocket, see how quickly you say...yes massa!  Illegals not expelled should be quarantined.  Coming illegal should not pay dividends, Illegals have cheated law abiding immigrants!

FM
ba$eman posted:
Django posted:
Kari posted:

 NYC included have said they will become sanctuary cities and will not work with the Administration on any Registry or reporting illegals.

More cities will follow,chaos in the next four years.

Simple solution, cut off Federal funding where possible.  When your taxes skyrocket, see how quickly you say...yes massa!  Illegals not expelled should be quarantined.  Coming illegal should not pay dividends, Illegals have cheated law abiding immigrants!

You may assume it's simple,Presi elect should try that when he gets in the White House.

I also noticed some nazi type of governing in your post.

Django
Last edited by Django

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