Guyana is notorious for Smuggling People, this is nothing new. Law enforcement knows about this, some are in cahoots with the smugglers. The former top Lawman Mr.Felix should know about such activities.

Felixx knows what he is doing. Jean Claude duvallier is becoming John Claude Johnson.

TEIXEIRA STRUGGLING TO CONTROL HOME AFFAIRS MINISTRY

2005 December 28

https://search.wikileaks.org/p...EORGETOWN1349_a.html

1. (U) SUMMARY. Charge, Deputy Consul, and PolOff met with Minister of Home Affairs Gail Teixeira on December 23. Teixeira had requested a Consular briefing on trends in fake Guyanese civil documents detected by the Consular Section. Teixeira also described problems with control of the visa process in Guyana's foreign missions, including those in India, China, Israel, and Africa. Teixeira also discussed voter registration problems that continue to dog the Ministry of Home Affairs (MHA) (septel). END SUMMARY. No Control Over Birth, Marriage Registrations ---------------------------------------------

2. (C) Charge, Deputy Consul, and PolOff met with Minister Teixeira at the MHA on December 23. Teixeira had asked Ambassador last month to send a Consular Officer to brief her on fraudulent birth and marriage certificates issued by the General Register Office (GRO) that had been detected by the Consular Section. Teixeira was particularly worried that she is not getting full and accurate details on these incidents in the briefings GRO gives her. Deputy Consul described the problematic birth and marriage certificates submitted to the Consular Section in Immigrant Visa cases, which appear to have been genuinely issued using GRO paper and seals, but which were not obtained in accordance with Guyanese law. The clear implication is that GRO is issuing civil documents improperly.

3. (SBU) Birth certificates. In a common example, someone whose original birth certificate does not list a father is able to obtain a new certificate from GRO that includes the purported father's name. Teixeira confirmed this was not legal without the father at least going to court and accepting paternity.

4. (SBU) Marriages. Guyanese marriage certificates state whether the marriage is by license, by notice, or by banns. The latter two methods require both the bride and groom to be in Guyana for weeks before the marriage. In Guyana's widespread business marriages, the Guyanese-American petitioner will usually remain in the country less than a week and use an unscrupulous marriage officer to wed them and obtain a certificate. Texeira confirmed these quick visit marriages are invalid if done by notice or banns.

5. (C) Minister Teixeira expressed what seemed to be genuine displeasure with these improperly or unlawfully issued civil documents involving GRO. She explained how she is already trying to fix the problem. She has confronted GRO about similar incidents but to date GRO has denied responsibility for the fraudulent documents. However, the evidence is too convincing now -- the paper stock, seal, and signatures of these certificates are all genuine. Regarding marriages, Teixeira has revoked the license of one marriage officer and is scrutinizing the entire marriage license process. She has also required the GRO to implement basic management controls over controlled items, such as locking up the seal when not in use and inventorying and securing supplies of blank certificates. She also asked Deputy Consul to keep her apprised on a monthly basis of problems encountered with GRO issued documents. Trying to Control Who Comes In and Who Stays Out --------------------------------------------- ---

6. (C) Teixeira mentioned several suspicious visa cases on her plate. She said this flow of people wanting to enter Guyana on unlikely pretenses could relate to trafficking in persons, the gold and diamond industries, arms smuggling, or terrorist links. She said she would like to work with USG to prevent these activities. She takes some files immediately to the Guyana Police Force's Special Branch for them to check Interpol databases or any other sources, since the Ministry has no computer resources to conduct such checks.

7. (C) Following up on the November 17 meeting's discussion of Indian tour operators (reftel), Teixeira said she is taking a hard line with tour operators applying for visas for large groups of young, single, businessmen purportedly traveling to Guyana for tourism. Almost every set of applicants included an older man with an Indian passport issued at a location outside of India (such as Beirut or Frankfurt). Teixeira has compiled a case file with passport numbers for each of these tour group applicants. In early December, a new tour operator appeared requesting visas for another group of "tourists". Teixeira forwarded the operator's supposed e-mail address to the Indian High Commission, which determined the address was fictitious.

8. (C) Teixeira described a court case involving a group of Indians waylaid in Guyana before trying to enter the U.S. or Canada illegally. In what she said is a typical scam, their families probably paid human smugglers to take them to "America". After bringing the group to Guyana (in the "Americas") the smugglers then demand additional payments for onward transport to the U.S. or Canada. In the case at hand, one man escaped and went to the Indian High Commission. Three Indians are now in protective custody as witnesses but the authorities will not be able to keep them much longer. Teixeira does not know how these three entered Guyana. She admitted she is unsure what she is dealing with but this case is just the "tip of the iceberg".

9. (S) Teixeira described the steps she has taken to curtail irresponsible, or corrupt, consular operations at Guyana's diplomatic posts. She said she encountered "great resistance in foreign missions trying to tighten up on visa issuances" and lamented that the MFA and other ministries do not understand that visa officers overseas are an important part of the country's security apparatus. All diplomatic missions are supposed to send visa issuance reports to the MHA, but the Ministry receives them six weeks after the fact when the travelers have already either transited Guyana or have arrived and disappeared. -- Teixeira said she has managed to bring Beijing visa operations under control. Guyana has ceased issuing visas for Chinese to join their families in Guyana, although Chinese are still granted visas to work in the timber and sugar industries (Note: China is financing a US$100 million restructuring of Guyana's sugar industry. End note.) She said that a corrupt system operated in China involving the mission and the Ministry. Now, the mission in Beijing can only deal with bilateral cooperation and investment issues. -- In response to Charge's question, Teixeira said the visa situation in India is "manageable". All visa applications from South India come to the MHA in Georgetown for adjudication, allowing for greater scrutiny. She believes South Indians who want a Guyanese visa would not travel all the way to New Delhi to apply in person at the High Commission there. In response to Charge's direct question about visa operations at Guyana's Embassy in New Delhi, Teixeira said "Delhi doesn't deal with us". When the conversation turned to Delhi, the normally animated Teixeira slowed down and spoke carefully and deliberately. She was noticeably less forthcoming about the situation in Delhi than about any other topic during the two and a half hour meeting. However, she did suggest twice that her relationship with the Delhi Embassy was dictated by orders from higher authority. (Note: Teixeira's predecessor as Minister of Home Affairs, Ronald Gajraj, was implicated in death squad activity and was forced to resign under pressure from the US and other donors after he admitted to consorting with and illegally granting gun licenses to known murders. Gajraj has now taken up appointment in New Delhi as Guyana's High Commissioner to India. End note.) -- Texeira said Guyana's embassy in Suriname and Guyana's honorary consuls (particularly in Africa and Israel) are now her biggest problems on the visa front.

10. (S) In Teixeira's words, Guyana does not have an immigration policy. There is little control over visa issuance. Immigration authorities cannot control or keep track of who enters the country. The government loses immigration cases in court. Deportation is expensive and often ineffective. In the past, all immigration decisions contained a note that refused applicants could appeal directly to the Minister, a practice Teixeira said she had abolished. Teixeira said disorder in the immigration process is embarrassing to the government and the GoG wants to do something about it. But President Jagdeo is also concerned about profiling travelers by race or nationality -- an image he does not want to project. Corruption Interferes Constantly --------------------------------

11. (S) During the meeting, Teixeira acknowledged there "was quite a lot of corruption in the immigration division". She has tried to deal with it by firing many employees in the Ministry. However, she fears that these corrupt former employees will sell their knowledge of the system and ability to forge documents. For example, she said the former MHA Security Policy Coordinator, Sultan Kassim, is "very closely linked to a number of networks, particularly the Chinese" and described a slush fund financed by Brazilian fees for work permits that Gajraj and Kassim had run. Unable to pin any direct evidence of illegal activity on Kassim, Teixeira said she had dealt with him by sending him on long-term leave.

12. (S) Teixeira stated that while corruption also existed in the police force and GRO, the corruption of justices and magistrates was the most worrying. She said all Guyanese know which cases, magistrates, and lawyers are tainted by corruption. As a result, the government cannot win important convictions. Similarly, she said everyone knows who the "drug lawyers" are, but the local bar association is too feeble to disbar anyone. Still Uneasy about American Religious Groups and Airstrips --------------------------------------------- -------------

13. (C) Teixeira reiterated the concern she raised at the previous meeting about the Seventh Day Aviation medical group operating in Guyana. She said a different group now wants to build an airstrip in the Rupununi hinterland. This group has suddenly expanded from one priest with an aircraft in the late 1990s to a group of around 20 missionaries whose projects always involve airstrips. Teixeira emphasized the government's desire for fewer rural airstrips, given their link to narco-trafficking, and its policy of destroying some of them. She thinks these American religious groups are somehow taking advantage of the Amerindian villages that host them. However, besides referring to reports of drug drops at one location, she shared no evidence of possible sinister activity on the missionaries' part. Request for Assistance ----------------------

14. (U) Teixeira made two requests for assistance. -- First, she would like to computerize the civil document process (all birth, marriage, and death certificates are now handwritten) and create scanned archival copies of all old records. She said two groups are submitting proposals to do this but she does not have the money to implement the project. Teixeira noted that this major project will have to wait until after the 2006 elections. -- Second, Teixeira asked for assistance in auditing the GRO's internal control procedures and in training GRO personnel to better understand and manage the critical security component to their jobs. She would like such training to culminate in new standard operating procedures for GRO's activities. Comment -------

15. (C) This meeting further confirmed that Teixeira genuinely wants to fight the corruption and inefficiency that have a crippling effect on her broad portfolio (including GRO, immigration, the attorney general and the courts, and the police force). Long-standing smuggling routes that transfer illegal migrants from India, Pakistan, and China through Guyana to the U.S. and Canada are ideal for exploitation by terrorists and others who would do us harm. Thus, it would be strongly in U.S. interest to find ways to assist Teixeira in vetting suspect visa applications and tightening control of civil documents.

16. (C) Unfortunately, although Teixeira criticizes her predecessor Gajraj's imperious, direct control over the Ministry's workings, she has only slightly loosened the reins of control herself. This may reflects her very valid concerns over both corruption and competence within the MHA, or the PPP's habit of centralized decision-making and micro-management. The fact that she involves herself personally in sensitive visa applications supports either hypothesis. Another possibility is that the position has overwhelmed her. Post rates Teixeira highly as an honest, forthright interlocutor. However, more than a few Guyanese insiders think of her as a lightweight better suited to her previous position as Minister of Youth, Culture, and Sport. END COMMENT. THOMAS

SECRET TAPE, RAID ON DRUG LORD'S ASSETS ROCK GUYANA

https://search.wikileaks.org/p...GEORGETOWN278_a.html

1. (U) SUMMARY. Georgetown is flush with intrigue as a joint army/police team conducted raids March 19-20 on drug lord Shaheed "Roger" Khan's properties and, concurrently, a secret recording of Police Commissioner Winston Felix's phone conversations was anonymously and widely distributed to the media, GoG, private sector, and diplomatic missions. Theories abound as to the motives and linkages behind these events, but no conclusive explanations have emerged yet. However, one thing is clear - the power struggle between narco-trafficking interests and the Guyanese state has escalated to a new level. END SUMMARY. --------------------------------------------- -------- Army/Police Joint Operation Targets Khan's Properties --------------------------------------------- --------

2. (U) The Guyana Defence Force (GDF) and Guyana Police Force (GPF) conducted a joint operation March 19 and 20, targeting homes and businesses belonging to Guyana's top drug lord Shaheed "Roger" Khan. The GDF spearheaded the operation, with the GPF in tow to make arrests and ensure chain of custody for seized evidence.

3. (C) The GDF claims that the operation was part of its attempt to recover the 33 AK-47s and other weapons that disappeared from the GDF headquarters' armory one month ago (ref B). Given Khan's known role as a large-scale weapons trafficker, it seems unlikely that he would resort to stealing weapons from the GDF. It is more plausible that the GDF wanted to counteract the growing impunity with which criminal organizations are operating in Guyana. Post sources indicate the operation was a scattershot effort in hopes of finding anything incriminating. Regardless of the motive, Post believes the operation succeeded in penetrating criminal organizations' comfort zones and, specifically, ratcheting up the pressure on Khan.

4. (C) According to public reports, the joint team has seized cocaine and illegal firearms and detained nineteen people and 175 vehicles. In March 20 meeting with Charge and UK and Canada High Commissioners, Minister of Home Affairs Gail Teixeira added that the operation netted 41 kilograms of cocaine, GPF and GDF uniforms, computers, and sophisticated communications intercept equipment. The GDF has custody of the seized items and has requested USG assistance with forensic analysis - particularly of the computers. Post has offered Teixeira such assistance in writing and is making necessary arrangements with LEGATT.

5. (C) Khan's whereabouts are unknown. Teixeira said he must have been tipped off to the raid, even though the GDF planned the operation unbeknownst to both GPF and Teixeira. --------------------------------------------- ----------- Secret Tape of Police Commissioner's Phone Call Released SIPDIS --------------------------------------------- -----------

6. (C) A taped conversation between GPF Commissioner Winston Felix and opposition party PNC/R executive committee member Basil Williams was anonymously and widely distributed March 20 to the media, GoG, private sector, and diplomatic missions. Post was already familiar with a shorter version of the tape, which appears to be a Khan production. Khan had for some time been seeking an outlet for the tape; the Ambassador and DCM discussed it with Teixeira March 10 (ref A). Khan was pushing the spin that the longer recording implicates Felix in deliberately misdirecting the investigation into the recent murders at Agricola (ref B), leading to the conclusion that Felix should be sacked and replaced by (the notoriously corrupt) Deputy Police Commissioner/Crime Chief Henry Greene.

7. (U) Reaction to the tape from the media and GoG has been surprisingly muted so far. Teixeira released a statement that the GoG was "deeply disturbed about the circulation and broadcast" of the tape, which had "implications for national security". The media's cautiousness partly derives from a sense that there is a lot they do not know rather than from lack of interest. More attention has been paid to the potential origins and the security implications of the tape - how and why were the Police Commissioner's phone calls recorded. The press has even speculated that Khan has intercept equipment capable of producing such a tape.

8. (U) The taped conversation itself spans a variety of topics - including the GPF's response to the Agricola murders, the upcoming national elections, and Ronald Waddell's execution (refs B and D). However, the conversation does not seem to contain incriminating statements. It does contain a frank, expletive-laced discussion between the Police Commissioner and a senior opposition politician about serious criminal activities. The tape actually captures Felix making some reasonable comments - such as, "some people don't understand, you know once you want to play with violence, violence will have to surround you". Certainly the tape may be embarrassing for the conversants and their bosses, but it does not actually implicate anyone in anything. The tape is a tool in Khan's plot to get rid of Felix because the commissioner is intent on fighting organized crime.

9. (S) Ambassador spoke early March 20 with Norman McLean - former Commissioner of Police and former head of the GDF - regarding the tape. McLean said that President Jagdeo had heard the tape and that Felix would be offered early retirement. Greene, who has a heavily tarnished reputation and a relationship with Khan, is the logical choice to replace Felix. Post is seeking Department concurrence to have Greene's visa revoked on those grounds.

10. (S) Charge and UK and Canadian High Commissioners met with Teixeira evening of March 20. Teixeira agreed that given the dubious origins of the tape and likelihood that it had been edited before its release, there should be due consideration before any decisions are taken regarding Felix's continued employment. However, Teixeira also indicated that the tape and Felix's future would be a major subject on the agenda for the March 21 Cabinet meeting and that she could not guarantee that cooler heads would prevail. Charge and the High Commissioners indicated that there would be serious difficulties for continued bilateral police cooperation if Greene were named Police Commissioner. Teixeira concurred that Greene would be a problem for many reasons and asked for assistance in leaking to the media the fact that the tape originated with Khan.

11. (S) As of March 23, Felix's position is still vulnerable, but improving. Teixeira told Charge March 22 that she "got things on a more even keel" at the Cabinet meeting. Sources indicate a meeting/confrontation between President Jagdeo and Felix occurred March 21, during which Jagdeo demanded that Felix retract certain statements that could be interpreted as implying GoG involvement with the tape. Felix refused, and he apparently also refused to take early retirement. Sacking Felix would require investigation and action by the Disciplined Services Commission. Given the lack of serious impropriety on the longer version of the tape and the lack of concern from the media and the public regarding Felix's remarks as recorded, it seems unlikely that a call for an investigation of Felix would gain much traction. The bottom line is that the general public thinks that whatever Felix said in his private conversations makes for a relatively innocuous indisretion compared to secretly recording phone calls of senior government officials. ------- Comment -------

12. (S) The release of the secret tape within a day of the GDF/GPF raid on Khan's properties is an unlikely coincidence. Khan reportedly despises Felix because he is resistant to Khan's control. It is almost certain that Khan wants Felix replaced by someone more pliable - someone like Greene. Even though Felix was not the driving force behind the raid on Khan (GDF Chief of Staff Edward Collins was), releasing the tape was probably Khan's (or his associates') way of fighting back. If that was Khan's strategy, it has backfired so far.

13. (C) Comment continued. The role of McLean and fellow Private Sector Commission leader Jerry Gouveia in spreading word of the tape is also troubling. Gouveia in particular has played the role of Khan's cheerleader in recent weeks, vouching for the legitimacy of the tape and Khan himself. It is unclear whether these eminent figures sought to discredit Felix simply because they think he is incompetent or for a less benign reason.

Teixeira has told Charge and UK and Canada High Commissioners that Gouveia and McLean enjoy a very close relationship with and ready access to President Jagdeo, including the ability "to pick up the telephone and call him at any time", which implies an uncomfortably convenient link between Jagdeo and Khan. END COMMENT. THOMAS

Django posted:

Guyana is notorious for Smuggling People, this is nothing new. Law enforcement knows about this, some are in cahoots with the smugglers. The former top Lawman Mr.Felix should know about such activities.

These people are coming in legally. Lacking a purpose, money as  tourist they should not be let in. This is done with the full complicity of the government. The PPP did it with Chinese in transit to Vancouver according to some. 

Worse, they could be remaining in Guyana since the numbers do not not add up. 

Stormborn posted:

Django posted:

Guyana is notorious for Smuggling People, this is nothing new. Law enforcement knows about this, some are in cahoots with the smugglers. The former top Lawman Mr.Felix should know about such activities.

These people are coming in legally. Lacking a purpose, money as  tourist they should not be let in.

This is done with the full complicity of the government. The PPP did it with Chinese in transit to Vancouver according to some. 

Worse, they could be remaining in Guyana since the numbers do not not add up. 

Guyana is a small place, it's unbelievable they aren't aware of the smuggling, actions should be taken.

Prashad posted:

Felixx knows what he is doing. Jean Claude duvallier is becoming John Claude Johnson.

Baby Doc is rotting in hell. 

Stormborn posted:

Django posted:

Guyana is notorious for Smuggling People, this is nothing new. Law enforcement knows about this, some are in cahoots with the smugglers. The former top Lawman Mr.Felix should know about such activities.

These people are coming in legally. Lacking a purpose, money as  tourist they should not be let in. This is done with the full complicity of the government. The PPP did it with Chinese in transit to Vancouver according to some. 

Worse, they could be remaining in Guyana since the numbers do not not add up. 

A Guyanese-Chinese who migrated years ago to St. Lucia, then the US, told me recently about the Chinese to Guyana to North America. I didn't know this was transpiring on such a large scale.

Leonora posted:

Stormborn posted:

Django posted:

Guyana is notorious for Smuggling People, this is nothing new. Law enforcement knows about this, some are in cahoots with the smugglers. The former top Lawman Mr.Felix should know about such activities.

These people are coming in legally. Lacking a purpose, money as  tourist they should not be let in. This is done with the full complicity of the government. The PPP did it with Chinese in transit to Vancouver according to some. 

Worse, they could be remaining in Guyana since the numbers do not not add up. 

A Guyanese-Chinese who migrated years ago to St. Lucia, then the US, told me recently about the Chinese to Guyana to North America. I didn't know this was transpiring on such a large scale.

That happening for a long time, since Kabaka days.

Stormborn posted:

Worse, they could be remaining in Guyana since the numbers do not not add up. 

So why dont you help out Jagdeo by telling him where the Haitians are.  You will need to figure out how to get to Cayenne.  Haitians are estimated to be about 20% of the population of that territory.

Blinded in nonsense its amazing how foolish Guyanese get.  Listen just go and send in your PPP vote because you must be a PPP fool not to see the racial animosity that Jagdeo is playing.  Get Indians all panicked because hordes of blacks are arriving.

caribny posted:

Stormborn posted:

Worse, they could be remaining in Guyana since the numbers do not not add up. 

So why dont you help out Jagdeo by telling him where the Haitians are.  You will need to figure out how to get to Cayenne.  Haitians are estimated to be about 20% of the population of that territory.

Blinded in nonsense its amazing how foolish Guyanese get.  Listen just go and send in your PPP vote because you must be a PPP fool not to see the racial animosity that Jagdeo is playing.  Get Indians all panicked because hordes of blacks are arriving.

You wicked people will make all types of excuses, meanwhile you avoiding the link between H to H, the Hatians and elections.

Drugb posted:

meanwhile you avoiding the link between H to H, the Hatians and elections.

ahmmm . . . tell abee nah?

the offering just might provide some momentum to your efforts at seizing the 'title' of GNI resident jackass funnyman

ronan posted:

Drugb posted:

meanwhile you avoiding the link between H to H, the Hatians and elections.

ahmmm . . . tell abee nah?

the offering just might provide some momentum to your efforts at seizing the 'title' of GNI resident jackass funnyman

There is no link huh? Keep on being the jackass who support pnc wickedness blindly, it suits you. 

Drugb posted:

ronan posted:

Drugb posted:

meanwhile you avoiding the link between H to H, the Hatians and elections.

ahmmm . . . tell abee nah?

the offering just might provide some momentum to your efforts at seizing the 'title' of GNI resident jackass funnyman

There is no link huh?

tell us

is that so hard?

How desperately morally poor are the PNC and its supporters that they don't even feel competent to be able to inspire people to have confidence in them. Instead they have to employ trickery when all efforts to bully fail.

caribny posted:

Stormborn posted:

Worse, they could be remaining in Guyana since the numbers do not not add up. 

So why dont you help out Jagdeo by telling him where the Haitians are.  You will need to figure out how to get to Cayenne.  Haitians are estimated to be about 20% of the population of that territory.

Blinded in nonsense its amazing how foolish Guyanese get.  Listen just go and send in your PPP vote because you must be a PPP fool not to see the racial animosity that Jagdeo is playing.  Get Indians all panicked because hordes of blacks are arriving.

Why should I be concerned with finding them? And I was travailing to Cayenne overland since I was fifteen so I know the way. I also have close family there in sufficient numbers enough to visit and or have them visit me often enough.

The problem here is you are loud and shrill on how problematic and injurious to Africans it would be with  your dubious claim about the BEGIA wanting to bring in Indians in 1917 to "overwhelm" the African population. Now you are being snide and downright contemptuous at the real possibility that there are large numbers of people coming in and no one knows where they are.

Only 7k is needed to game the system and that much seems to be coming in every few months. We also have 17000K Cubans, "missing" somewhere if the accounting is true.Why is it nonsense that we do not know where large numbers of people are?

Leonora posted:

Stormborn posted:

These people are coming in legally. Lacking a purpose, money as  tourist they should not be let in. This is done with the full complicity of the government. The PPP did it with Chinese in transit to Vancouver according to some. 

Worse, they could be remaining in Guyana since the numbers do not not add up. 

A Guyanese-Chinese who migrated years ago to St. Lucia, then the US, told me recently about the Chinese to Guyana to North America. I didn't know this was transpiring on such a large scale.

That was common place way back.  Everyone knew. They came, opened restaurants or other trading business then find their way to North America.  Few end up staying in Guyana. 

Stormborn posted:

caribny posted:

So why dont you help out Jagdeo by telling him where the Haitians are.  You will need to figure out how to get to Cayenne.  Haitians are estimated to be about 20% of the population of that territory.

The problem here is you are loud and shrill on how problematic and injurious to Africans it would be with  your dubious claim about the BEGIA wanting to bring in Indians in 1917 to "overwhelm" the African population. Now you are being snide and downright contemptuous at the real possibility that there are large numbers of people coming in and no one knows where they are.

Only 7k is needed to game the system and that much seems to be coming in every few months. We also have 17000K Cubans, "missing" somewhere if the accounting is true.Why is it nonsense that we do not know where large numbers of people are?

the 1917-1924 BGEIA affair is part of the Colonial record . . . it is not "dubious" fyi

it is also beside the point

people trafficking thru Guyana is a serious law and order matter dating back nearly 2 decades (much money is being made), and Indo-Guyanese need not be naive and should be vigilant re malign actors plotting stuff on the Afro end to exploit the phenomenon for political advantage

that there are 17K (not 17000K) mostly non-Black Cubans "missing" in Guyana, among other things common sense puts a match to your "real possibility" insinuations

you are unhinged mendacious as well as dumb

ronan posted:

Stormborn posted:

caribny posted:

So why dont you help out Jagdeo by telling him where the Haitians are.  You will need to figure out how to get to Cayenne.  Haitians are estimated to be about 20% of the population of that territory.

The problem here is you are loud and shrill on how problematic and injurious to Africans it would be with  your dubious claim about the BEGIA wanting to bring in Indians in 1917 to "overwhelm" the African population. Now you are being snide and downright contemptuous at the real possibility that there are large numbers of people coming in and no one knows where they are.

Only 7k is needed to game the system and that much seems to be coming in every few months. We also have 17000K Cubans, "missing" somewhere if the accounting is true.Why is it nonsense that we do not know where large numbers of people are?

the 1917-1924 BGEIA affair is part of the Colonial record . . . it is not "dubious" fyi

it is also beside the point

people trafficking thru Guyana is a serious law and order matter dating back nearly 2 decades (much money is being made), and Indo-Guyanese need not be naive and should be vigilant re malign actors plotting stuff on the Afro end to exploit the phenomenon for political advantage

that there are 17K (not 17000K) mostly non-Black Cubans "missing" in Guyana, among other things common sense puts a match to your "real possibility" insinuations

you are unhinged mendacious as well as dumb

The interpretation of their role is dubious. Thanks for reminding me of the error but you know precisely what I am talking about and that the K there was unintentional.  

Who are you to tell Indians how to feel? You are here telling us your interpretation of the BEGIA plot to overwhelm Africans numerical is real and not that they had other motives. Indians can interpret the circumstances exactly as you and Caribj are wont to interpret it. 

I do grant you are as a narcissist as trump and like him you are as transparent a fraud. 

Stormborn posted:

Who are you to tell Indians how to feel?

and where exactly did i do that . . . hmmmm?

your FRAUD isn't even passing clever

lol

ronan posted:

Stormborn posted:

Who are you to tell Indians how to feel?

and where exactly did i do that . . . hmmmm?

your FRAUD isn't even passing clever

lol

Is this about you interpreting for indians:" Indo-Guyanese need not be naive and should be vigilant re malign actors plotting stuff on the Afro end to exploit the phenomenon for political advantage". The only fraud here is the one crying fraud in every post. 

Stormborn posted:

ronan posted:

Stormborn posted:

Who are you to tell Indians how to feel?

and where exactly did i do that . . . hmmmm?

your FRAUD isn't even passing clever

lol

Is this about you interpreting for indians:" Indo-Guyanese need not be naive and should be vigilant re malign actors plotting stuff on the Afro end to exploit the phenomenon for political advantage". The only fraud here is the one crying fraud in every post. 

ahmmm no . . . nice footwork, but all in vain

here’s the actual context in YOUR own words:

“Who are you to tell Indians how to feel? You are here telling us your interpretation of the BEGIA plot to overwhelm Africans numerical is real and not that they had other motives. Indians can interpret the circumstances exactly as you and Caribj are wont to interpret it.”

not nice switching donkeys when you think no one is paying attention

lol

now, about my statement here:

“Indo-Guyanese need not be naive and should be vigilant re malign actors plotting stuff on the Afro end to exploit the phenomenon for political advantage."

that’s not “tell[ing] Indians how to feel” . . . that’s recognition of a condition that exists, and affirming that concern is legit

there is a very good reason why i used the words “need not”

you really need to read more and better [sophisticated use of language is not really hard if you cop to your shortcomings and apply yourself], and concentrate less on fantasy, deception, and make-believe

ronan posted:

Stormborn posted:

ronan posted:

Stormborn posted:

Who are you to tell Indians how to feel?

and where exactly did i do that . . . hmmmm?

your FRAUD isn't even passing clever

lol

Is this about you interpreting for indians:" Indo-Guyanese need not be naive and should be vigilant re malign actors plotting stuff on the Afro end to exploit the phenomenon for political advantage". The only fraud here is the one crying fraud in every post. 

ahmmm no . . . nice footwork, but all in vain

here’s YOUR actual context in YOUR own words:

“Who are you to tell Indians how to feel? You are here telling us your interpretation of the BEGIA plot to overwhelm Africans numerical is real and not that they had other motives. Indians can interpret the circumstances exactly as you and Caribj are wont to interpret it.”

not nice switching donkeys when you think no one is paying attention

lol

now, about my statement here:

“Indo-Guyanese need not be naive and should be vigilant re malign actors plotting stuff on the Afro end to exploit the phenomenon for political advantage."

that’s not “tell[ing] Indians how to feel” . . . that’s recognition of a condition that exists, and affirming that concern is legit

you really need to read more and better [sophisticated use of language is not really hard if you cop to your shortcomings and apply yourself], and concentrate less on fantasy, deception, and make-believe

I know your short term memory is as your long term memory...crap. I spoke to Caribj of his often mentioned commentary that the BEGIA were out to overwhelm black voices for a long time. I said that is interpretation and a dubious one.  You said, "the 1917-1924 BGEIA affair is part of the Colonial record . . . it is not "dubious" and I guess, affirming Caribj's viewpoint. Where is that record of the BEGIA ever stating "lets overwhelm blacks". Luckoo, Ayebe Euden ( sp) et al were agents of the plantocracy and they had a vested interest in a continued supply of free labor. 

If Africans can interpret an influx of Indians as threatening why should you or anyone tell them that they cannot be apprehensive for the reciprocal event? Note the inflow of Haitians is far more rapid that even the BEGIA could anticipate in their attempt to extend indentureship.

Stormborn posted:

ronan posted:

Stormborn posted:

ronan posted:

Stormborn posted:

Who are you to tell Indians how to feel?

and where exactly did i do that . . . hmmmm?

your FRAUD isn't even passing clever

lol

Is this about you interpreting for indians:" Indo-Guyanese need not be naive and should be vigilant re malign actors plotting stuff on the Afro end to exploit the phenomenon for political advantage". The only fraud here is the one crying fraud in every post. 

ahmmm no . . . nice footwork, but all in vain

here’s YOUR actual context in YOUR own words:

“Who are you to tell Indians how to feel? You are here telling us your interpretation of the BEGIA plot to overwhelm Africans numerical is real and not that they had other motives. Indians can interpret the circumstances exactly as you and Caribj are wont to interpret it.”

not nice switching donkeys when you think no one is paying attention

lol

now, about my statement here:

“Indo-Guyanese need not be naive and should be vigilant re malign actors plotting stuff on the Afro end to exploit the phenomenon for political advantage."

that’s not “tell[ing] Indians how to feel” . . . that’s recognition of a condition that exists, and affirming that concern is legit

you really need to read more and better [sophisticated use of language is not really hard if you cop to your shortcomings and apply yourself], and concentrate less on fantasy, deception, and make-believe

If Africans can interpret an influx of Indians as threatening why should you or anyone tell them that they cannot be apprehensive

that’s the point i am making you dunce

READ!!!!

ronan posted:

Stormborn posted:

ronan posted:

Stormborn posted:

ronan posted:

Stormborn posted:

Who are you to tell Indians how to feel?

and where exactly did i do that . . . hmmmm?

your FRAUD isn't even passing clever

lol

Is this about you interpreting for indians:" Indo-Guyanese need not be naive and should be vigilant re malign actors plotting stuff on the Afro end to exploit the phenomenon for political advantage". The only fraud here is the one crying fraud in every post. 

ahmmm no . . . nice footwork, but all in vain

here’s YOUR actual context in YOUR own words:

“Who are you to tell Indians how to feel? You are here telling us your interpretation of the BEGIA plot to overwhelm Africans numerical is real and not that they had other motives. Indians can interpret the circumstances exactly as you and Caribj are wont to interpret it.”

not nice switching donkeys when you think no one is paying attention

lol

now, about my statement here:

“Indo-Guyanese need not be naive and should be vigilant re malign actors plotting stuff on the Afro end to exploit the phenomenon for political advantage."

that’s not “tell[ing] Indians how to feel” . . . that’s recognition of a condition that exists, and affirming that concern is legit

you really need to read more and better [sophisticated use of language is not really hard if you cop to your shortcomings and apply yourself], and concentrate less on fantasy, deception, and make-believe

If Africans can interpret an influx of Indians as threatening why should you or anyone tell them that they cannot be apprehensive

that’s the point i am making you dunce

READ!!!!

Dude, you are the one saying it is the Hindutva cartel motivating Indian apprehensions and not what is latent in our culture, ethnic distrust!

Stormborn posted:

ronan posted:

Stormborn posted:

ronan posted:

Stormborn posted:

ronan posted:

Stormborn posted:

Who are you to tell Indians how to feel?

and where exactly did i do that . . . hmmmm?

your FRAUD isn't even passing clever

lol

Is this about you interpreting for indians:" Indo-Guyanese need not be naive and should be vigilant re malign actors plotting stuff on the Afro end to exploit the phenomenon for political advantage". The only fraud here is the one crying fraud in every post. 

ahmmm no . . . nice footwork, but all in vain

here’s YOUR actual context in YOUR own words:

“Who are you to tell Indians how to feel? You are here telling us your interpretation of the BEGIA plot to overwhelm Africans numerical is real and not that they had other motives. Indians can interpret the circumstances exactly as you and Caribj are wont to interpret it.”

not nice switching donkeys when you think no one is paying attention

lol

now, about my statement here:

“Indo-Guyanese need not be naive and should be vigilant re malign actors plotting stuff on the Afro end to exploit the phenomenon for political advantage."

that’s not “tell[ing] Indians how to feel” . . . that’s recognition of a condition that exists, and affirming that concern is legit

you really need to read more and better [sophisticated use of language is not really hard if you cop to your shortcomings and apply yourself], and concentrate less on fantasy, deception, and make-believe

If Africans can interpret an influx of Indians as threatening why should you or anyone tell them that they cannot be apprehensive

that’s the point i am making you dunce

READ!!!!

Dude, you are the one saying it is the Hindutva cartel motivating Indian apprehensions and not what is latent in our culture, ethnic distrust!

ahmmm . . . actually, this what i said:

“Indo-Guyanese need not be naive and should be vigilant re malign actors plotting stuff on the Afro end to exploit the phenomenon for political advantage."

find another limb to jump pan . . . i’m having great fun with my very sharp saw

lol

ronan posted:

ahmmm . . . actually, this what i said:

“Indo-Guyanese need not be naive and should be vigilant re malign actors plotting stuff on the Afro end to exploit the phenomenon for political advantage."

find another limb to jump pan . . . i’m having great fun with my very sharp saw

lol

Maybe you need to map it out on a truth table. Why is it "they need not be naive and should be vigilant" Given you already insisted they are driven to a status of panic by some mysterious Hinditva crowd and not by what is natural political distrust in the system?

Drugb posted:

.

You wicked people will make all types of excuses, meanwhile you avoiding the link between H to H, the Hatians and elections.

I bet you are drooling to meet a Haitian so he can administer his big Haitian vegetable inside you.

ksazma posted:

How desperately morally poor are the PNC and its supporters that they don't even feel competent to be able to inspire people to have confidence in them. Instead they have to employ trickery when all efforts to bully fail.

So has Haitian Kreyol become a language of Guyana yet?  Are employers forced to learn the language and are schools forced to educate huge numbers of Haitian kids who don't know English?

Try another conspiracy like APNU importing Vincentians.  They can more easily hide, as they speak English and are culturally the same as Afro Guyanese

Like Jagdeo jumped inside your brain and made you stupid.  I also need to remind you that after the earthquake in Haiti Jagdeo was begging Haitians to come to Guyana.  This so that be could pretend to be benevolent to blacks.

Haitians weren't interested in Guyana then and they remain uninterested up to today.

Stormborn posted:

 

Why should I be concerned with finding them?

Because you are insisting that they are hiding in Guyana.  So illogical is your thinking.

Does APNU have the competence to entice Haitians to take an expensive trip to Guyana when most Haitians see Guyana as only slightly less poor than they are?

Why will Haitians bypass wealthy T&T to come hide in Guyana?

And how can a Kreyol speaking population existing in Guyana in the tens of thousands, if we believe your hysterical rant, will be able to hide.

Listen cease braying until Jagdeo can show us a village packed with Haitians.  Until then deal with the fact that the PPP brought in THOUSANDS of Chinese who are VERY VISIBLE.

Stormborn posted:

.

The problem here is you are loud and shrill on how problematic and injurious to Africans it would be with  your dubious claim about the BEGIA wanting to bring in Indians in 1917 to "overwhelm" the African population.

the claim wasn't "dubious". It has been documented and much discussed.

Now please show us whether the ACDA or other Afro Guyanese groups are petitioning for the arrival of Haitians?   Given what I see in NYC there isn't any big lovefest between Anglo Caribbean blacks and people directly from Haiti because we tend to see them as strange.  And in fact have many prejudices directed towards them because Haiti is so poor.

If Haitians were crowding out Plaisance you would have heard people screaming about them just as they now do about Venezuelans.

Of course nothing from you on the Chinese, brought in by the PPP and now pushing many small Guyanese enterprises out of business.

Stormborn posted:

 

 

I know your short term memory is as your long term memory...crap. I spoke to Caribj of his often mentioned commentary that the BEGIA were out to overwhelm black voices for a long time. I said that is interpretation and a dubious one.  You said, "the 1917-1924 BGEIA affair is part of the Colonial record . . . it is not "dubious" and I guess, affirming Caribj's viewpoint. Where is that record of the BEGIA ever stating "lets overwhelm blacks". Luckoo, Ayebe Euden ( sp) et al were agents of the plantocracy and they had a vested interest in a continued supply of free labor. 

If Africans can interpret an influx of Indians as threatening why should you or anyone tell them that they cannot be apprehensive for the reciprocal event? Note the inflow of Haitians is far more rapid that even the BEGIA could anticipate in their attempt to extend indentureship.

The desire of the BGEIA was to make Indians the largest ethnic group in Guyana.  It was NOT their plan to integrate them into Guyana.  It was NOT their goal to have these people join with the black working class against colonial oppression.  In that they lied to the Indian gov't telling them that life for indentures in Guyana was good.  This when India threatened to end the system based on reports of abuse.

That is basically saying, squeeze out black people who were desperately fighting against the white oligarchs for their own space in colonial Guyana.

The BGEIA were an ethnically focused elite group who planned to be part of a system of dominance using a numerically superior Indian population to obtain political clout for themselves.

Now tell us about Eric Phillips screaming that Haitians should be brought into Guyana so that the numbers of blacks could increase. Or cite instances of him telling blacks in Brazil, Colombia or Cuba to flee the racism in their nations by coming to Guyana where the socio economic status of blacks is less dire?

You cannot, so cease being Jagdeo's [poodle.  Jagdeo knows fully well that Haitians are using Guyana as a transit point.  He fully well knows that there are more Chinese and Brazilian immigrants in Guyana. He fully knows that increasingly Cubans visting Guyana are electing to stay.

He knows fully well that the French/Creole Haitians are merely travelling through Guyana as they seek to enter that territory of France with its high wages paid in euros and its promise of a better life!

Ask yourself why you, a man with a black wife, is so intent in being used as part of Jagdeo's racial Machiavellian plot. Why does Jagdeo only cite BLACK immigrants when he fully well knows that these people DO NOT WANT TO STAY IN GUYANA!

caribny posted:

Drugb posted:

.

You wicked people will make all types of excuses, meanwhile you avoiding the link between H to H, the Hatians and elections.

I bet you are drooling to meet a Haitian so he can administer his big Haitian vegetable inside you.

How do you know Haitians have big vegetables?

Bibi Haniffa posted:

caribny posted:

Drugb posted:

You wicked people will make all types of excuses, meanwhile you avoiding the link between H to H, the Hatians and elections.

I bet you are drooling to meet a Haitian so he can administer his big Haitian vegetable inside you.

How do you know Haitians have big vegetables?

Cribby is obsessed with penises. Almost all his posts have to include a mention of it.

ksazma posted:

Bibi Haniffa posted:

caribny posted:

Drugb posted:

You wicked people will make all types of excuses, meanwhile you avoiding the link between H to H, the Hatians and elections.

I bet you are drooling to meet a Haitian so he can administer his big Haitian vegetable inside you.

How do you know Haitians have big vegetables?

Cribby is obsessed with penises. Almost all his posts have to include a mention of it.

Is Cribby exposing his shortcomings? He is obsessed with big black bigan penises.