Shusssh yuji,shush, you make little sense,shhhhhhhhhhhhhh.

Co cain, I do not expect any better from you.

Sugrim not getting a heart attack at all. HE HEART strong. But you know what? The opposition milked this to cause violence. Do your homework and come back.

Another 'expert' prattling. If you want to know how they didn't get a scratch then you can ask the Colonial Government. Vic Puran is asking some pertinent questions. The APNU Nand AFC lit the fuse and ran away and we all know the result.

The result is the PPP have blood on their hands in the creation of four martyrs under their watch.

They are no martyrs because you say so. Their deaths were unfortunate and it never should have happened but that does not make them martyrs and you know it.  

Since when have terrorists become martyrs ?

True martyrs are the 3000 Indo Guyanese from Wismar and other areas who were raped or killed by PNC supporters. Read your history books.

Yes when those 3000 people will be classed as martyrs. What did they do wrong? 

It's now etched in History that four blacks are now martyrs under the rule of the PPP.

Just stop it . . . the 3 (4?) people killed on the bridge were not "terrorists"!

and, 3,000 people were not killed [to be martyred means to DIE, you jackass] in 1964 . . . refugees, yes.

Enough with the hysterical lies . . . you dishonor those who were actually murdered nearly 50 years ago at Wismar and Mackenzie.

Disgusting little scumbag

Would you care to comment on the 3000 Indo Guyanese who were raped or killed by the PNC ?

BTW many were children.

You disgusting man refuse to accept that 3000 yes, 3000 INDO Guyanese were raped or killed by the PNC. Many were children.

Sash related a story of how a nighbour hid him in a toilet and give him food for days so that he would not be killed by PNC supporters just because he was Indian.

Shame on you.  I guess Indo Guyanese are not Guyanese but foreigners and your blood brothers tried to wipe them out.

Simply an astounding lie!

I am closer to that event than you think.

Yuji, it's obvious you are ignorant of the support by Indos for the Lindeners. I have posted the videos and it's also obvious that you have not taken the time to view them.

You are spending too much time under that rock.

It is  you who need to read. Dr Ishmael has a serial history of the era on this site it would do well for you to become acquainted with it.  It is not that any of these deaths were trivial events. They were accompanied with great evil and must not be trivialized by a sycophant like you.

These three people who died recently terrorized no one. Whether you agree with their protest or not they died at the hands of a careless security force. Some one has to account. If you fail to grasp that in the presence instance in its real context how can you interpret and relate history? No wonder you come up with that concocted number.

Yuji gettin beat up bad but he too stupidy to realize it.

Maybe he should go way and come back with a new nic, we'd still beat up on him for being stupidy but at least it'll seem like a new beating.

You can be as close as you want but the Indians that perished in Linden have a right to be martyrs. They were going about their lives innocently and you know the rest, or do you want to be told?   

Did the 3000 Indo Guyanese terrorize anyone ?

So now your polemic has changed . . . to conjuring up an argument with ghosts about settled history which no one disputes . . . a [belated] ass cover for shameful nonsense you have written, and for which you have been rightfully rebuked.

Now, the innocents murdered @ Wismar/Mackenzie in1964 were indeed martyred [we all know how many] . . . but the absurd numbers you are throwing around to stir passions is appalling. Just stop it.

Do not cheapen THEIR memory by associating their singular tragedy with Goebbelsian lies!

Yes . . . Burnham was a cynical and cruel dictator, but he was no Hitler; and there was/is no genocidal campaign against Indo-Guyanese, or Afro-Guyanese for that matter. Again, just stop it.

What has become clear though is that the PPP murdered 3 innocent people @ Linden on July 18, and sick bums like you are slyly implying that it's OK because those guilty of ORIGINAL SIN had it coming.

'Nice' way to change the conversation   

I have no desire to engage you since you are decidedly a moron. However, forum decorum demand I respond. You are again making a statement that denies our sociopolitical reality.

We are a divided by race. The numerical disparity between the racial groups in this vertical bifurcation is slight. One or the other winning the state as their ethnic prize  does so by mobilizing social and cultural cues in stereotypical ways to generate and the social glue that maintain group cohesion.

These include is the myth of the victimized Indian who is long suffering, resourceful, morally upright and frugal as opposed to the brutish blacks, quick to pillage and murder, and who are lazy and given to licentious ways.

The reality is to the contrary. If  if one side was brutal and depraved and the other passive, the passive one  would be eating dirt. If one was morally upright it would not be at our nations helm where they are the harbingers of social ills ranging from a drug culture, extrajudicial murders and plundering of the state resources en mass.

The people who died in these struggles on both sides die because there are too many sheep like you willing to sallow the poison pill whole and regurgitate nonsense about Indian saints and Black terrorists. You would instead be asking why the hell this racist condition persists. Alas you are alien to inquiry.

Continue to display your intense hatred of AfroGuyanese.  Thanks to folks like you they will NEVER vote for the PPP.

Before we comment you will have to prove that 3,000 Indos werent raped or killed by the PNC.

I caution an insecure little man like you, who probably feels emasculated every time an Indo female rejects you and selects a black man, that those Indian females who VOLUNTARILY consent to sexual intercourse with black men are not rape victims.

so please provide evidence of all these rapes and killings.

And many AfroGuyanese had to hide in the homes of Indians until they could safely leave for majority black areas while PYO thugs were burning down their homes in the dead of night and hunting them down, armed with cutlasses and guns.

Brutality existed on both sides...so is your point that blacks lives dont matter?  I can imagine a racist like you will think so.

So go ahead and have pig farms and chicken farms with the run off soaking into the water table poisoning LIndeners.  Already they suffer smoke pollution, but now must also suffer from polluted water.  Sand is porous and pollution entering the soils will quickly contaminate water supplies.  A pig here and a chicken there is fine, but massive farms....you do know that even in teh USA this is becoming a huge problem so what of GY which lacks the ability to deal with it where the soils cannot sustain it? 

Buit you hate black people so those who arent made ill from respiratory diseases due to Linden's smoke laden air will die from various microbes in the water that they drink.

A more sensible plan will be to locate manufacturing in Linden and give it Export Processing Zone (EPZ) status.  And offer those who locate there cheap electricity which will provide Lindeners with sustainable jobs, to resplace those lost in the bauxite industry.  A major reason for the poor performance of Guyana's manufacturing sector is oiur high electricity costs so this should help stimulate a sector which according to TK is SMALLER than it was in the 70s.

I also note your excuse for sugar.  If bauxite should have been privatized because its losses were no longer sustainable than so should sugar.  Indeed almost every other Caribbean nation has dropped sugar as an export..only Barbados is left.  At least they are honest and consider it a subsidy to the old ladies who work in it and who at their age cannot do anything else.

If sugar is not profitable SHUT IT DOWN!!! Anything less is a subsidy to those who work in sugar, paid for by every one else.  So if Linden shouldnt get a subsidy then neither should Skeldon, Rosehall or Leonora.  Accoirding to you there is no social reason to keep sugar and it clearly is a huge drain on the govt.

Certainly a reasonable proposal.  But why don't opposition put forward a proposal of what they are talking about and the value proposition of incentivizing businesses to bring the type of operations to the area.  If the PNC comes with something sensible, I'm sure people would listen.  Off the bat, I don't know what type of manfg would make sense but i'm sure people do.

I met a businessman there who wants to do food processing for export but it only makes sense to grow in Ebo and ship to Trini for processing due to power costs.  I'm certain if guarantees could be made by the stakeholders and the economics is there, you will get takers. A businessman will evaluate the risk and opportunities presented and go for it if it makes business sense.

On Sugar, I actually believe in more mechanization, down-streaming and value-added products to inject overall viability, thus the push for ethanol.  Creating viability for that industry via ethanol, etc might be more possible domestically than Bauxite as aluminum is at the mercy of large consuming nations with their own agenda.  It would make sense to have them directly "roped-in".

So tell me something that Indians who were killed in Linden ought to be martyrs but the blacks who were killed on that ferry and all over the rural coastlands ought not to be.  And please dont peddle that lie about the fact that PYO operatives didnt blow up that boat because you ought to know well that PNC supporters in McKenzie had loads of dynamite available to them right there.  That would be like importing ruce from Jamaica to Guyana.

Daily you and your other PPP buddies reveal the depths of your hatred for AfroGuyanese.

Privatize bauxite but dont privatize sugar.  Make Indians who were murdered in the 60s by blacks to be martyrs but deny the blacks who were also murdered by Indians.

Clearly you subscribe to the notion that the rights of AfroGuyanese matter nothing to you.

Let you into a secret though.  In a nation where one group is 45% and the other is 40% if either group has rights denied to them the other will also not have rights.  Each will ensure this.

The Indians who were massacared in 1964 were martyrs but not those that died a few weeks ago. 

I have already said that while I blame the PPP for what happened I also place the onus on APNU for making constructive suggestions and I lambaste them for not doing so.  Lindeners voted for APNU with the expectation that their interests will be represented and that APNU will lead discussion around the economic transformation of Linden. 

Furthermore Guyanese as a whole, inclusive of those sugar workers who voted PPP, will want to ensure that there is an improved regimen for dealing with protests, whether they are authorized or not, so that deadly force is only used at the last resort and that is to protect the lives of the police, protesters or bystanders.

The fact is that whether we agree with Lindeners or not they have a right to protest if they disagree with actions of the govt.  This is especially as there are many lies and distortions surrounding this issue and we are yet to hear how come BOSAI doesnt lose money generating electricity if it is that Lindeners pay too little.  If they can marginal cost it then it is fair that those who use this electricity benefit from it.  If this only occurs because the govt pays them too much then this should be up for debate.

The fact remains that Linden has been a severely impoverished town for 30 years now and it is unrealisticd to expect the population to be passive when their lives will become more difficult, unless this was accompanied by a robust plan to transform the town.

A reconfiguration of sugar will lead to massive lay offs and loud squeals from the likes of nehru,sugrim and the others that this is being done to punish Indians.  The same people who scream that Linden should be ignored and Lindeners should be forced to pay more (when its not clear that they must, at least not at levels endured by those who must buy from GPL), will demand massive subsidies for sugar estate areas where the social dislocation will be tremendous.   Guyanese must learn to be honest and stop wishing ill on the other side and applying double standards to their own.

There are no double standards here. All are involved like the jig that shakes the loom.

In your racist mind only.  If blacks kill Indians then the Indians are martyrs but when Indians killed blacks in 1964, including an elderly couple in Buxton, then the blacks arent.

You will never earn trust if you peddle such filth.

A loooooog talk around the topic without touching the topic.  What concrete proposals have been brought forward that would marry skills and resource to bring opportunities to the people of Linden?  Lindeners have a clear-cut political representative and they should champion the cause of the people.  The cause it not served by instigating mayhem for cheap power for lavish AC and other consumer use.  What concrete, practical and pragmatic proposals have been put on the table to exploit the strengths of Linden for the betterment and livelihood of the people of Linden.

Personally, I think the PNC want's it exactly as it is, let the people suffer and they will rise up.  The AFC has been an irresponsible foot-stool to this end made worse a few "Indians" searching for a cause and wanting to feel loved.  A depress and unhappy Linden plays into the PNC game plan.

Given that the PPP is supposed to represent ALL of Guyana the onus is as much on them as it is on APNU to develop concrete solutions to Linden's problems.

And if APNU is glad for the mayhem what is the PPP doi9ng to ensure that they find a long time solution to the hatred that AfroGuyanese have for them which provides a basis for "mayhem" (which is what you call protests)?  Until AfroGuyanese begin to feel that they dont suffer under what some of them call "coolie" rule (in a nation where Indians are less than 45%) then there will always be a threat of people who thinking that they have no recourse within the system attempting an alternate course.

I suspect that APNU isnt leading the protests, and neither is the AFC.  They are just ambulance chasers trying to stay relevant. 

That should disturb you at many levels when an entire community feels that the current system of governance not only ignores them but sets out to oppress them.  And that they have no ability to be viewed seriously by the govt in power until they resort to unauthorized protests...and that its only if violence then occurs that a worried PPP, paranoid over the extent to which it has control over the armjed forces, becames to fear for its existence.

So the PPP will make noises about "dialogue" but when the smoke blows over and they think that people have cooled down, its back to normal.  We have a 20 year history of seeing this behavior.

Why baseman if they really seriously wish progress?

So did the PNC pre-1992 but the PPP made their proposals to the PNC and at times got some of what they wanted.  The PNC, as the true reps of the Lindeners should engage the people and make concrete proposals, that's the way it works.  You do not just sit back and wring or fold your hands and expect things to just happen to your liking.  You don't just jump and engage in mayhem without making your proposals.  With it's flaws, Guyana is a democracy and the people of Linden voted 90% PNC, and the PNC is the single biggest opposition group in a democratic parliament.

Representation is not just horse trading but bringing up practical and pragmatic proposals to improve your constituency's fortunes.

Name the proposal made and what has happened to it.  Don't throw dust to confuse and deflect.

@ baseman

You have a real comic book idea of how things work in a centralised, autocratic system with all power concentrated in the executive; a tribal set-up where there is no incentive to cede anything to the opposition.

The opposition have called for local Gov't elections  . . . PPP sits on their hands . . . don't wanna

The opposition calls for broadcast monopoly to end . . . PPP sits on their hands, fighting in court . . . Linden still has 1 TV station; the country only 1 radio station.

Open up the tax base so that Georgetown can pay its bills . . . nah, let dem rot, it's PNC stronghold.

Invest in a strong Nat'l University to anchor Education Development . . . nah let UG regress and deteriorate; opposition incubator . . . too many brite people looking on . . . nah good fuh tiefin.

Enough with the stupidness, OK

I repeat the PPP is the govt which is elected to reprsent all of its citizens, so it should be held as accountable for the situation in Linden as the PNC.

For all you know the PNC might have made proposals to the PPP prior to the PPP losing control of the parliament.  The PPP has this habit of thinking that they hav eno obligation to listen to others.

So the PPP is as responsible for Linden as the PNC as after all they are the executive and therefore control the allocation of resources.  The PNC, working with the AFC, can block the PPP, but, not being the executive, not controlling an ministries are limited in what ideas can actually be implemented.

The fact is that the PPP might have gotten some of what it wanted for Burnham, but and Jagdeo dcided to listen to no one and to scream that he "has the mandate to govern and no one can tell him what to do".   This mkight show that in certain respects Jagdeo was even worse then Burnham. We are also seeing that Ramotar only reacts when he is in a pickle and is looking to be resscued by pretending to care.

Look at how the PPP was trying to claim that the opposition was responsible and now we hear that police, not uysing police weapons, killed protesters.

They actually think that an inquiry conducted by the GPF or the Min of Home Affairs will be seen as credible?

Redux listed several and most assuredly both APNU and AFC have made other proposals.

You know full well that the Jagdeo/Luncheon dictatorship screamed and wailed that " they have the mandate and that no one can tell them what to do"

Even the UN, Commonwealth Secretariat and the Carter Center noted that the PPP was not inclusive, used parliament as a rubber stamp and refused discusison of ideas from the opposition parties...this a tragedy given that political parties in Guyana correlate to ethnic groups so that when they are excluded entire ethnic groups (Africans, mixed and to a lesser extent Amerindians) are being disenfranchised.

So now the PPP no longer controls parliament, but seems not to know this as they still wail and bawl every time they dont get their way.

So while APNU, as the reprsentatives of Lindeners, is obligated to work with the community to generate ideas for the community's economic and social development, its the obligation of the PPP, as the executive govt to not only listen, but to incorporate Region 10 into its overall national dvelopment planning.

Of course the best way will be for Local Govt elections so that Lindeners can chose THEIR OWN representatives, not having to rely on a bunch og G/twn foks. These folks will then communicate with BOTH APNU and the govt.

So when are the next local govt elections?  Have you noticed that no one is talking about them any more.  Indeed there was also supposed to be a discusison of a total revamping of the system of local governance which had bene developed by Burnham who set it up to destroy the village systems of which he was afraid of.

Condolences
Leader of the House and Prime Minister Samuel Hinds last evening in the National Assembly conveyed Government’s regrets with regards to the unfortunate events that ensued in Linden on July 18; resulting in the deaths three protestors; and leaving several others injured. 
Government supports, fully the first ‘Be It Resolved’ clause in the Motion, which was moved by Opposition Leader, David Granger. This clause called for the National Assembly to condemn the killing of the three persons and the injury to several others and extend condolences to the families to the bereaved families.
The Motion also demands the resignation of Minister of Home Affairs, Clement Rohee; implying that responsible for the lethal actions taken by the police.

Allegations and Commission of Inquiry
The Prime Minister said despite all the opinions and allegations that political elements have since been purporting since the killings, no one in the PPP/C stands to gain anything from the deaths of those three citizens. 
He reminded too, that nothing that is done in or out of the House can reverse or undo the tragic events that have occurred.   
He told the House that on hearing the calls for international presence on the agreed upon Commission of Inquiry, Government stands firm in its commitment to ensure that this happens and anticipates that the inquiry will be comprehensive in its coverage; and examine all aspects of the tragedy.

Commitments
Government has also indicated its willingness to meet with the bereaved families to discuss issues such as post mortems and funerals. Moreover, draft statements addressing the convergence of electricity tariffs in Linden as opposed to those prevailing across the country as well as outlines of special economic initiatives for the region were sent to Regional Chairman, Sharma Solomon and other parties involved.   
Additionally, the Administration has committed to putting on hold the July 1 tariff increases and proposed that a technical team comprising members from both sides be set up to review all available and practical options and come up with a report as expeditiously as possible; preferably within two weeks of its establishment. 
“This Government, ever since we entered Office, has always held the development of Region 10 and all the citizens therein, as an important and major task. We have always been aware, particularly of the difficult challenges of the old industries such as bauxite and sugar and their communities…we have never overlooked Linden in our programmes; Linden benefits equitably in all that we are doing,” the Prime Minister said. 
He made reference to the 2002 census, which recorded Linden ahead of many other regions in Guyana particularly, in the area of education.

Self-fulfilling diet
The Prime Minister lambasted the so-called leaders who he said, are feeding Lindeners the “diet” that they are economically suppressed by the PPP/C Administration.  
“This self-fulfilling diet is doing the people of Linden no good…we heard a lot about unemployment in Linden being over 70 percent in Linden, when it is a mere 15.2 percent according to the 2002 census…when you look at these numbers, there is no basis for all that is being said,” he asserted.

Lighting the fuse
Responding to Granger’s statement that, the Linden killings were shocking but the fuse was burning for three months, he said that, “we must focus on the fuse and the lighting of fuse.”
According to the Prime Minister, the metaphorical fuse was lit when the Opposition, particularly the APNU, reneged on the agreement that was made at the tripartite level during the consideration of the 2012 budget estimates with regards to the electricity tariff increase. 
During that discussion, it was agreed that the alignment to the Guyana Power and Light (GPL) tariffs and elimination of the Linden electricity subsidy were necessary. It was also agreed that the tariff adjustment will proceed from 2012 guided by the principles of gradualism and selectivity; with the transition to the aligned tariffs being introduced in a differentiated manner that will cushion the impacts on the most vulnerable people.    
“This was accepted by Mr. Granger, Dr. Roopnarine, Mr. Greenidge and Mr. Harmon but then all hell broke loose…Mr. Ramjattan (Leader of the AFC) came out with a statement and when that happened the fuse was lit…there are a lot of questions about what happened in Linden that need to be considered in a different atmosphere from this one, we need to have the Commission of Inquiry and we all need to give that Commission our unreserved support,” the Prime Minister said.  
He concluded that the responsibility for the deaths of the three Lindeners is no less on members of the Opposition as it is on the Government side and if they insist with this Motion calling for the Minister’s resignation, then they too should do the honourable thing.

Innocent until proven guilty
Meanwhile, Government’s Chief Whip, Gail Teixeira, who is also a former Home Affairs Minister, reminded the House that a person is innocent until proven guilty and has a right to trial. 
“If one does not hold to these principles and rights, we descend into anarchy. This House has no competence to investigate or be the judge, jury and executioner…if it were found that the Minister gave a direct order or was implicated in anyway, his head will go; we have made that clear as Government,” she stated. 
Quoting from a text entitled ‘Responsible Government: Ministerial Responsibility, Motions of Censure No Confidence by David Blunt, the Chief Whip explained that Ministers very rarely resign for the failings under the part of the administrative units under their authority. 
Further, in the circumstances when a minister does resign, they fall under a number of categories. These include: where a minister cannot support Government policy, where a minister is involved in unethical conduct or scandal, where a minister misleads Parliament or where a minister is responsible for major error provided that there is direct, personal, culpable evidence. 
“Nothing has been said in this House to say that there is any direct culpable evidence against Minister Rohee,” Teixeira affirmed. 

The Home Affairs Minister in his few remarks expressed his gratitude and appreciation to all those who are standing behind him notwithstanding the Motion. He said he will leave the independent Commission of Inquiry to deal with the matter.   
“In my view, a No Confidence Motion cannot and will not arrive at the truth as regards the circumstances surrounding the death of those Lindeners. I await the establishment of the Commission of Inquiry and I do so with a conscience that is clear,” he said. 
The Motion of No Confidence against the Minister was passed last evening after almost all members of the House have had their say.

Evidence that Sugrim cares nothing about AfroGuyanese.  Many people were killed, injured or suffered loss of property at the hands of the PNC/UF and the PPP. Not just Indians.

So why do you only talk about Indian victims?