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FM
Former Member

Islamic State says immolation was justified; Islamic experts say no

 
February 4 at 6:30 PM

This post has been updated.

The Islamic State video depicting the brutal immolation of a Jordanian pilot was different from the start. The Islamic State has released numerous videos showing acts of barbarity including beheadings and mass shootings. Those videos, often starring the masked militant known as Jihadi John, are sometimes rough and hurried. This one, by contrast, plodded through 22 long minutes. It had a narrative quality. There was building tension. And a clear message.

It revolved around a searing and unsettling new theme: Fire. The video showed snippets of news segments showing Jordan’s involvement in the U.S.-led fight against the Islamic State before focusing on computer generated images of a “crusader” fighter jet firing missiles and a truck burning. The camera zooms in on charred corpses hidden under rubble. Each image bursts into flames.

Eventually, the video settles on Lt. Muath al-Kaseasbeh, walking across ruins, surrounded by militants. He enters a cage and is set alight. After he has been killed, rubble is tipped on his corpse by a front-end loader. In a broadcast on Islamic State-controlled radio on Wednesday, Kaseasbeh’s fiery death was described as “punishment for what he had done of burning Muslims with the fire of his plane.”

[Jordan executes two prisoners after pilot is burned alive]

The use of immolation was especially shocking because it was so unusual – burning someone to death is almost unheard of in the modern Middle East and throughout Islamic history – and the killing sparked a theological argument. Clerics from the Islamic State quickly issued a fatwa to justify the killing, while other prominent clerics, such as the Saudi Sheik Salman al-Oudah, argued that immolation was prohibited by Islam.

“Many statements attributed to Muhammad condemn the practice, so ISIS guys have to rely on a Quranic verse to get around it,” Will McCants, Director of the Brookings Institution’s Project on U.S. Relations with the Islamic World, wrote in an e-mail, using an acronym of the Islamic State. “Pretty shaky jurisprudence.”

That Quranic verse (16:126) forms part of the basis for “qisas,” a broad concept in Islamic law that calls for equal retribution for crimes – in essence, an eye for an eye. As Shiraz Maher, a senior fellow at the International Center for the Study of Radicalisation at King’s College London, writes, it’s usually used in cases of murder or mutilation. At points, jihadist groups have used it to justify jihadists’ attacks before: Al-Qaeda later used the concept to justify a 1995 strike on the Egyptian Embassy in Islamabad, for example.

On Twitter, supporters of the Islamic State and other Muslims debated the use of qisas to justify what they saw in the video. “Teenage fanboys giving rulings on what qisas is and when it applies,” wrote one critical user, dismissively.

Hassan Hassan, an analyst with the Delma Institute, a research center in Abu Dhabi, says that at best “qisas” can only be broadly applied by the Islamic State, as “it is not clear who was burned by the pilot or his country.” Instead, the Islamic State repeatedly refers to “mumathala” (reciprocity), a broader term for dealing with enemy combatants. “The way ISIS justified the immolation of the pilot is the way it justifies many of its brutal acts,” Hassan explained. “It relies on genuine but isolated incidents in Islamic history.”

Hassan notes that the Islamic State pointed to the example of Khaled bin al-Walid, Muhammad’s commander-in-chief, who burned “apostates” and that it also pointed to specific Islamic scholars who justified the use of immolation, such as al-Hafidh bin Hajar, a prominent Sunni scholar from the medieval era. These references may be obscure, but the fact that other Islamic scholars ignore them gives the Islamic State an upper hand, Hassan says. “By having monopoly over telling these stories, ISIS can shape them as it see fits to suit its brutal ideology,” he explains. “Theology matters a lot in this context.”

The use of immolation likely achieved another purpose: the introduction of a fresh form of terror. The most potent tool in the Islamic State’s arsenal has been its willingness to push the boundaries of barbarity, which has attracted both global notoriety and a deluge of recruits. “‘We’ve lopped off enough heads,’ they might have said,” Timothy Furnish, a conservative historian of Islamic history who is frequently critical, said in a phone call on Tuesday. “‘Now, let’s kick it up a notch and find a horrible way to kill this man.’ ”

It’s not easy to continuously deliver shock value. The Islamic State’s decapitations were utterly horrifying at the time of American photojournalist James Foley’s death — but do they impart the same effect today? Terror has a habit of escalating. Hijacked airliners gave way to suicide bombings. Suicide bombings gave way to decapitations and crucifixions and, now, immolations. It’s disturbingly new, but also tragically familiar, The Washington Post’s Philip Kennicott wrote on Tuesday. Horrific killings do more to transport us back to our civilization’s roots than offer anything new.

“This isn’t about mankind’s macabre ability to invent new forms of murder; it’s about reanimating our oldest, and collectively shared, habits of barbarism,” Kennicott wrote. “… The Islamic State is not innovative in its depredations. Its thugs simply reach into the museum of human-made misery and pull out something at once horribly familiar, and terribly alien.”

Replies sorted oldest to newest

Surat An-Naĥl (The Bee) - سورة النحل

16:126
Sahih International
 
And if you punish [an enemy, O believers], punish with an equivalent of that with which you were harmed. But if you are patient - it is better for those who are patient.
FM
Originally Posted by Shaitaan:

Surat An-Naĥl (The Bee) - سورة النحل

16:126
Sahih International
 
And if you punish [an enemy, O believers], punish with an equivalent of that with which you were harmed. But if you are patient - it is better for those who are patient.

huh . . .? this is a restating of Exodus 21:23-25

 

weak

FM
Originally Posted by redux:
Originally Posted by Shaitaan:

Surat An-Naĥl (The Bee) - سورة النحل

16:126
Sahih International
 
And if you punish [an enemy, O believers], punish with an equivalent of that with which you were harmed. But if you are patient - it is better for those who are patient.

huh . . .? this is a restating of Exodus 21:23-25

 

weak

 

My Point Dear Islamic Apologist is that these Islamic State moonheads aren't making random shyte up. They're drawing from the Quran, Sira, and Hadith...they very textual foundations of Islam.

 

If Jews or Christians were going around invoking Exodus we could similarly draw such a line. And if and when they do on some matter, I will be sure to point out their nonsense belief system and not give them a free pass.

FM
Originally Posted by Shaitaan:
Originally Posted by redux:
Originally Posted by Shaitaan:

Surat An-Naĥl (The Bee) - سورة النحل

16:126
Sahih International
 
And if you punish [an enemy, O believers], punish with an equivalent of that with which you were harmed. But if you are patient - it is better for those who are patient.

huh . . .? this is a restating of Exodus 21:23-25

 

weak

 

My Point Dear Islamic Apologist is that these Islamic State moonheads aren't making random shyte up. They're drawing from the Quran, Sira, and Hadith...they very textual foundations of Islam.

 

If Jews or Christians were going around invoking Exodus we could similarly draw such a line. And if and when they do on some matter, I will be sure to point out their nonsense belief system and not give them a free pass.

ummmmmm . . . remind me again just who the parties are on this BB that claim the terrorists were "making random shyte up"?

 

chill lil, and contemplate THAT tatty straw man u just waste time clapping such 'manly' lash pan

 

dear boy, your time and talents might be much better spent volunteering on that other lout opportunist Piyush (Babby) Jindal's nascent, no-so-presidential campaign

 

and btw, i'd suggest u be very careful tagging people u don't know as "Islamic Apologist" . . . just a thought

FM
Last edited by Former Member
Originally Posted by TI:

Shaitan...circumcision went wrong, hehehe

Anyone who chooses the name Shaitaan , what can you expect?

From the begging of time Satan was evil and what this idiot is revealing here on GNI is not only he is evil but he is dangerous.

In real life he has no friends and everyone in our community shuns him and rightly so. Here on GNI he is a loner and a loser and in real life he will be the same if continues with his wickedness.

 

Anyone who says they are a believer and  shows disrespect for a Prophet of God whether Jesus Christ or Muhamad ( uwbp)  then that person is afool and a monkey. I know atheists such as D2 AND THEY NEVER SHOW DISRESPECT TO THE PROPHETS.

 

 

Chief
Originally Posted by Chief:
Originally Posted by TI:

Shaitan...circumcision went wrong, hehehe

Anyone who chooses the name Shaitaan , what can you expect?

From the begging of time Satan was evil and what this idiot is revealing here on GNI is not only he is evil but he is dangerous.

In real life he has no friends and everyone in our community shuns him and rightly so. Here on GNI he is a loner and a loser and in real life he will be the same if continues with his wickedness.

 

Anyone who says they are a believer and  shows disrespect for a Prophet of God whether Jesus Christ or Muhamad ( uwbp)  then that person is afool and a monkey. I know atheists such as D2 AND THEY NEVER SHOW DISRESPECT TO THE PROPHETS.

 

 

 

Calm down old man. Getting worked up over nothing at your age is unhealthy. I am perfectly willing to accept your opinions of evil, loser, loner, monkey whatnot. Now to the meat of my matter.

 

That you are a "believer" and a respecter of "Prophets" of "God" is your business. No one is obligated to "respect" people you call prophets. I certainly don't. Thankfully I don't live in a failed Muslim state where I am commanded to on pain of death.

 

Furthermore, If you go back to the point of this thread you will find it relatively simple...the Islamic State Muslims are just as Muslim as any other Muslim, they find their justification in the Quran, and any attempt to declare them "non-Muslim" is just childish delusion of a type that defies simple logic.

 

You as a Muslim may consider them "bad" Muslims. That is your right. However, that cannot alter the reality that these men and women draw their inspiration and motivation from Islam and it's textual foundations to justify their actions. One cannot divorce Islamic Terrorism from Islam just because it would make us feel better. Feelings don't alter reality.

FM
Originally Posted by Shaitaan:
. . . You as a Muslim may consider them "bad" Muslims. That is your right. However, that cannot alter the reality that these men and women draw their inspiration and motivation from Islam and it's textual foundations to justify their actions. One cannot divorce Islamic Terrorism from Islam just because it would make us feel better. Feelings don't alter reality.

amusing circular shyte . . . i can recommend readings on logical fallacies to avoid these embarrassments and sharpen your spear

 

lol

FM
Last edited by Former Member
Originally Posted by redux:
Originally Posted by Shaitaan:
. . . You as a Muslim may consider them "bad" Muslims. That is your right. However, that cannot alter the reality that these men and women draw their inspiration and motivation from Islam and it's textual foundations to justify their actions. One cannot divorce Islamic Terrorism from Islam just because it would make us feel better. Feelings don't alter reality.

amusing circular shyte . . . i can recommend readings on logical fallacies to avoid these embarrassments and sharpen your spear

 

lol

 

Do you really expect me to list the absolutely definitive criteria of what it takes to be a Muslim that would be undisputed by all the varied schools of Islamic jurisprudence and every single Muslim on earth?

 

Or can I get away with a more general criteria applicable to the overwhelming majority of Muslims like belief in Allah, Muhammad, Quran, Sira, Hadith, the five pillars etc?

FM
Originally Posted by Chief:
Originally Posted by TI:

Shaitan...circumcision went wrong, hehehe

Anyone who chooses the name Shaitaan , what can you expect?

From the begging of time Satan was evil and what this idiot is revealing here on GNI is not only he is evil but he is dangerous.

In real life he has no friends and everyone in our community shuns him and rightly so. Here on GNI he is a loner and a loser and in real life he will be the same if continues with his wickedness.

 

Anyone who says they are a believer and  shows disrespect for a Prophet of God whether Jesus Christ or Muhamad ( uwbp)  then that person is afool and a monkey. I know atheists such as D2 AND THEY NEVER SHOW DISRESPECT TO THE PROPHETS.

 

 

" Here on GNI he is a loner and a loser"

 

Wrong! Since I woke the banna up, he's putting some of these bimbos in their proper places. I enjoy reading his posts as I do Stormy's, those guys have the knack for proper speech.

 

So who the rass is D2 again? Don't see that nic here.

cain
Last edited by cain

This is just a cyber world where people can spout crap all day

 

then they go home and when reality hit them, they start writing bills and cussing up the govt and fugget all about GNI.

FM
Originally Posted by TI:

This is just a cyber world where people can spout crap all day

 

then they go home and when reality hit them, they start writing bills and cussing up the govt and fugget all about GNI.

 

LOL

 

Pretty much

FM
Originally Posted by TI:

Lucky thing I have 5 wifes of different nationalities. I can continue my diverse discussion in warmth and comfort

I wonder if you are a cousin of mine by any chance. No joke intended.

Mr.T
Originally Posted by Shaitaan:
Originally Posted by redux:
Originally Posted by Shaitaan:
. . . You as a Muslim may consider them "bad" Muslims. That is your right. However, that cannot alter the reality that these men and women draw their inspiration and motivation from Islam and it's textual foundations to justify their actions. One cannot divorce Islamic Terrorism from Islam just because it would make us feel better. Feelings don't alter reality.

amusing circular shyte . . . i can recommend readings on logical fallacies to avoid these embarrassments and sharpen your spear

 

lol

 

Do you really expect me to list the absolutely definitive criteria of what it takes to be a Muslim that would be undisputed by all the varied schools of Islamic jurisprudence and every single Muslim on earth?

 

Or can I get away with a more general criteria applicable to the overwhelming majority of Muslims like belief in Allah, Muhammad, Quran, Sira, Hadith, the five pillars etc?

nah, you are just fundamentally unsound. . . pay attention to what i highlighted in red

 

Muslim terrorists bai . . . no such thing as "Islamic terrorists"

 

u know the difference . . . rite?

FM
Last edited by Former Member
Originally Posted by redux:
Originally Posted by Shaitaan:
Originally Posted by redux:
Originally Posted by Shaitaan:
. . . You as a Muslim may consider them "bad" Muslims. That is your right. However, that cannot alter the reality that these men and women draw their inspiration and motivation from Islam and it's textual foundations to justify their actions. One cannot divorce Islamic Terrorism from Islam just because it would make us feel better. Feelings don't alter reality.

amusing circular shyte . . . i can recommend readings on logical fallacies to avoid these embarrassments and sharpen your spear

 

lol

 

Do you really expect me to list the absolutely definitive criteria of what it takes to be a Muslim that would be undisputed by all the varied schools of Islamic jurisprudence and every single Muslim on earth?

 

Or can I get away with a more general criteria applicable to the overwhelming majority of Muslims like belief in Allah, Muhammad, Quran, Sira, Hadith, the five pillars etc?

nah, you are just fundamentally unsound. . . pay attention to what i highlighted in red

 

Muslim terrorists bai . . . no such thing as "Islamic terrorists"

 

u know the difference . . . rite?

fine.

 

"One cannot divorce Muslim Terrorism from Islam."

 

I don't see what is substantively changed here. You pick any term you like to convey that their religion motivates their actions as terrorists. This is just school yard semantics.

FM
Originally Posted by Shaitaan:
Originally Posted by redux:
Originally Posted by Shaitaan:
Originally Posted by redux:
Originally Posted by Shaitaan:
. . . You as a Muslim may consider them "bad" Muslims. That is your right. However, that cannot alter the reality that these men and women draw their inspiration and motivation from Islam and it's textual foundations to justify their actions. One cannot divorce Islamic Terrorism from Islam just because it would make us feel better. Feelings don't alter reality.

amusing circular shyte . . . i can recommend readings on logical fallacies to avoid these embarrassments and sharpen your spear

 

lol

 

Do you really expect me to list the absolutely definitive criteria of what it takes to be a Muslim that would be undisputed by all the varied schools of Islamic jurisprudence and every single Muslim on earth?

 

Or can I get away with a more general criteria applicable to the overwhelming majority of Muslims like belief in Allah, Muhammad, Quran, Sira, Hadith, the five pillars etc?

nah, you are just fundamentally unsound. . . pay attention to what i highlighted in red

 

Muslim terrorists bai . . . no such thing as "Islamic terrorists"

 

u know the difference . . . rite?

fine.

 

"One cannot divorce Muslim Terrorism from Islam."

 

I don't see what is substantively changed here. You pick any term you like to convey that their religion motivates their actions as terrorists. This is just school yard semantics.

really now? lol

 

well, at least we can actually have a conversation now

 

so, Muslim terrorists interpret the Koran to justify their barbarism in pursuit of secular/tribal goals in the Middle East . . . golly, what must the Koran do?

 

oooh,oooh, this is so novel in the annals of religion inspired wars, genocide and butchery these past 3 millennia

 

please . . .

FM
Originally Posted by redux:
Originally Posted by Shaitaan:
Originally Posted by redux:
Originally Posted by Shaitaan:
Originally Posted by redux:
Originally Posted by Shaitaan:
. . . You as a Muslim may consider them "bad" Muslims. That is your right. However, that cannot alter the reality that these men and women draw their inspiration and motivation from Islam and it's textual foundations to justify their actions. One cannot divorce Islamic Terrorism from Islam just because it would make us feel better. Feelings don't alter reality.

amusing circular shyte . . . i can recommend readings on logical fallacies to avoid these embarrassments and sharpen your spear

 

lol

 

Do you really expect me to list the absolutely definitive criteria of what it takes to be a Muslim that would be undisputed by all the varied schools of Islamic jurisprudence and every single Muslim on earth?

 

Or can I get away with a more general criteria applicable to the overwhelming majority of Muslims like belief in Allah, Muhammad, Quran, Sira, Hadith, the five pillars etc?

nah, you are just fundamentally unsound. . . pay attention to what i highlighted in red

 

Muslim terrorists bai . . . no such thing as "Islamic terrorists"

 

u know the difference . . . rite?

fine.

 

"One cannot divorce Muslim Terrorism from Islam."

 

I don't see what is substantively changed here. You pick any term you like to convey that their religion motivates their actions as terrorists. This is just school yard semantics.

really now? lol

 

well, at least we can actually have a conversation now

 

so, Muslim terrorists interpret the Koran to justify their barbarism in pursuit of secular/tribal goals in the Middle East . . . golly, what must the Koran do?

 

oooh,oooh, this is so novel in the annals of religion inspired wars, genocide and butchery these past 3 millennia

 

please . . .

 

Oh Lord. Only the most deluded Muslims and useful idiot liberal dhimmis come to me with this nonsense. No matter what outrage, no matter what crime committed in it's name Islam is the pure unsullied virgin.

 

You can't possibly be an atheist. I understand atheists are diverse in opinion but this is just so far out there that only a committed theists would resort to this childish nonsense.

 

For this theory of Islamic virginity to work, one must also wash clean and restore the hymen of Christianity as you absolve Christianity of the Crusades, the Inquisition, and slavery.

 

Is this the road you wanna go down?

FM
Last edited by Former Member
Originally Posted by Shaitaan:
Originally Posted by redux:
Originally Posted by Shaitaan:
Originally Posted by redux:
Originally Posted by Shaitaan:
Originally Posted by redux:
Originally Posted by Shaitaan:
. . . You as a Muslim may consider them "bad" Muslims. That is your right. However, that cannot alter the reality that these men and women draw their inspiration and motivation from Islam and it's textual foundations to justify their actions. One cannot divorce Islamic Terrorism from Islam just because it would make us feel better. Feelings don't alter reality.

amusing circular shyte . . . i can recommend readings on logical fallacies to avoid these embarrassments and sharpen your spear

 

lol

 

Do you really expect me to list the absolutely definitive criteria of what it takes to be a Muslim that would be undisputed by all the varied schools of Islamic jurisprudence and every single Muslim on earth?

 

Or can I get away with a more general criteria applicable to the overwhelming majority of Muslims like belief in Allah, Muhammad, Quran, Sira, Hadith, the five pillars etc?

nah, you are just fundamentally unsound. . . pay attention to what i highlighted in red

 

Muslim terrorists bai . . . no such thing as "Islamic terrorists"

 

u know the difference . . . rite?

fine.

 

"One cannot divorce Muslim Terrorism from Islam."

 

I don't see what is substantively changed here. You pick any term you like to convey that their religion motivates their actions as terrorists. This is just school yard semantics.

really now? lol

 

well, at least we can actually have a conversation now

 

so, Muslim terrorists interpret the Koran to justify their barbarism in pursuit of secular/tribal goals in the Middle East . . . golly, what must the Koran do?

 

oooh,oooh, this is so novel in the annals of religion inspired wars, genocide and butchery these past 3 millennia

 

please . . .

 

Oh Lord. Only the most deluded Muslims and useful idiot liberal dhimmis come to me with this nonsense. No matter what outrage, no matter what crime committed in it's name Islam is the pure unsullied virgin.

 

You can't possibly be an atheist. I understand atheists are diverse in opinion but this is just so far out there that only a committed theists would resort to this childish nonsense.

 

For this theory of Islamic virginity to work, one must also wash clean and restore the hymen of Christianity as you absolve Christianity of the Crusades, the Inquisition, and slavery.

 

Is this the road you wanna go down?

this virginity thing must somehow give u a thrill . . . yaaaawwn

 

when u finish jerking off, addressing nonsense . . . try deal with what i actually posted

FM
Last edited by Former Member
Originally Posted by redux:
Originally Posted by Shaitaan:
Originally Posted by redux:
Originally Posted by Shaitaan:
Originally Posted by redux:
Originally Posted by Shaitaan:
Originally Posted by redux:
Originally Posted by Shaitaan:
. . . You as a Muslim may consider them "bad" Muslims. That is your right. However, that cannot alter the reality that these men and women draw their inspiration and motivation from Islam and it's textual foundations to justify their actions. One cannot divorce Islamic Terrorism from Islam just because it would make us feel better. Feelings don't alter reality.

amusing circular shyte . . . i can recommend readings on logical fallacies to avoid these embarrassments and sharpen your spear

 

lol

 

Do you really expect me to list the absolutely definitive criteria of what it takes to be a Muslim that would be undisputed by all the varied schools of Islamic jurisprudence and every single Muslim on earth?

 

Or can I get away with a more general criteria applicable to the overwhelming majority of Muslims like belief in Allah, Muhammad, Quran, Sira, Hadith, the five pillars etc?

nah, you are just fundamentally unsound. . . pay attention to what i highlighted in red

 

Muslim terrorists bai . . . no such thing as "Islamic terrorists"

 

u know the difference . . . rite?

fine.

 

"One cannot divorce Muslim Terrorism from Islam."

 

I don't see what is substantively changed here. You pick any term you like to convey that their religion motivates their actions as terrorists. This is just school yard semantics.

really now? lol

 

well, at least we can actually have a conversation now

 

so, Muslim terrorists interpret the Koran to justify their barbarism in pursuit of secular/tribal goals in the Middle East . . . golly, what must the Koran do?

 

oooh,oooh, this is so novel in the annals of religion inspired wars, genocide and butchery these past 3 millennia

 

please . . .

 

Oh Lord. Only the most deluded Muslims and useful idiot liberal dhimmis come to me with this nonsense. No matter what outrage, no matter what crime committed in it's name Islam is the pure unsullied virgin.

 

You can't possibly be an atheist. I understand atheists are diverse in opinion but this is just so far out there that only a committed theists would resort to this childish nonsense.

 

For this theory of Islamic virginity to work, one must also wash clean and restore the hymen of Christianity as you absolve Christianity of the Crusades, the Inquisition, and slavery.

 

Is this the road you wanna go down?

this virginity thing must somehow give u a thrill . . . yaaaawwn

 

when u finish jerking off, addressing nonsense . . . try deal with what i actually posted

 

My point is quite simple:

 

Either all religions are responsible for their respective crimes or they're not!

 

Is it your position that a religion can never be held responsible for any crime committed by its adherents?

FM
Originally Posted by Shaitaan:
Originally Posted by redux:
Originally Posted by Shaitaan:
Originally Posted by redux:
Originally Posted by Shaitaan:
Originally Posted by redux:
Originally Posted by Shaitaan:
Originally Posted by redux:
Originally Posted by Shaitaan:
. . . You as a Muslim may consider them "bad" Muslims. That is your right. However, that cannot alter the reality that these men and women draw their inspiration and motivation from Islam and it's textual foundations to justify their actions. One cannot divorce Islamic Terrorism from Islam just because it would make us feel better. Feelings don't alter reality.

amusing circular shyte . . . i can recommend readings on logical fallacies to avoid these embarrassments and sharpen your spear

 

lol

 

Do you really expect me to list the absolutely definitive criteria of what it takes to be a Muslim that would be undisputed by all the varied schools of Islamic jurisprudence and every single Muslim on earth?

 

Or can I get away with a more general criteria applicable to the overwhelming majority of Muslims like belief in Allah, Muhammad, Quran, Sira, Hadith, the five pillars etc?

nah, you are just fundamentally unsound. . . pay attention to what i highlighted in red

 

Muslim terrorists bai . . . no such thing as "Islamic terrorists"

 

u know the difference . . . rite?

fine.

 

"One cannot divorce Muslim Terrorism from Islam."

 

I don't see what is substantively changed here. You pick any term you like to convey that their religion motivates their actions as terrorists. This is just school yard semantics.

really now? lol

 

well, at least we can actually have a conversation now

 

so, Muslim terrorists interpret the Koran to justify their barbarism in pursuit of secular/tribal goals in the Middle East . . . golly, what must the Koran do?

 

oooh,oooh, this is so novel in the annals of religion inspired wars, genocide and butchery these past 3 millennia

 

please . . .

 

Oh Lord. Only the most deluded Muslims and useful idiot liberal dhimmis come to me with this nonsense. No matter what outrage, no matter what crime committed in it's name Islam is the pure unsullied virgin.

 

You can't possibly be an atheist. I understand atheists are diverse in opinion but this is just so far out there that only a committed theists would resort to this childish nonsense.

 

For this theory of Islamic virginity to work, one must also wash clean and restore the hymen of Christianity as you absolve Christianity of the Crusades, the Inquisition, and slavery.

 

Is this the road you wanna go down?

this virginity thing must somehow give u a thrill . . . yaaaawwn

 

when u finish jerking off, addressing nonsense . . . try deal with what i actually posted

 

My point is quite simple:

 

Either all religions are responsible for their respective crimes or they're not!

 

Is it your position that a religion can never be held responsible for any crime committed by its adherents?

i don't know what that means

 

sounds like stupidmess setting up an even stupider 'question'

FM
Last edited by Former Member
Originally Posted by redux:
i don't know what that means

 sounds like stupidmess setting up an even stupider 'question'

 

The Crusades and the Inquisition belong to Christianity. They were the outgrowth of and informed by Christian dogma in that particular era.

 

Similarly Islam owns Islamic/Muslim Terrorism committed in the modern era. It is similarly an outgrowth of and informed by Islam.

 

It's just that simple.

FM
Originally Posted by Shaitaan:
Originally Posted by redux:

i don't know what that means 

 

sounds like stupidmess setting up an even stupider 'question'

The Crusades and the Inquisition do belong to Christianity. They were the outgrowth of and informed by Christian dogma in that particular era.

 

this is correct . . . acceptance of "dogma" is required for membership of a religious group; this is how the Catholic Church at the time of the Crusades was able to raise great armies of the faithful from the Kingdoms of Christendom to retake the Holy Land from the Muslims. The Pope as God’s representative on earth was the gatekeeper for membership in the faith and determined then what it took to be a Christian, upon pain of excommunication, or worse, as we know happened during the Inquisitions.

 

Similarly Islam owns Islamic/Muslim Terrorism committed in the modern era. It is similarly an outgrowth of and informed by Islam.

 

ahmmm, WRONG! . . . there is no "dogma" governing membership in the faith which unites the 'Ummah' behind the barbarism of ISIL and Al Qaeda, just like there is no "dogma" governing membership in the faith that binds Christians today to the odd barbarities committed by sundry Christian sects/outfits in the name of Christ

 

It's just that simple.

naw, your'e just being simple minded

see my response(s) in bold above.

 

Opinion follows dogma, not the other way round!

FM
Last edited by Former Member

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