Skip to main content

Democracy Loses in Egypt and Beyond

Even acknowledging that Mursi and his Muslim Brotherhood-backed party did a poor job over their year in power, failing to win over opponents or broaden their base of support, the latest coup is a tragic setback for democracy, constitutionalism and the rule of law. The first protests of the Arab Spring were calls to replace a dictator who had no democratic right to govern. The protests were inspiring not just because they said “enough” to a bad system, but also because the protesters aspired to replace that bad system with democracy. Many of the original protesters were themselves secular or wanted a secular government. But by calling for free elections, they opened themselves to the possibility that the majority of Egyptians wouldn’t agree with them. That, in essence, is democracy: The majority gets to choose the government it wishes, subject to the guarantee of minority rights.

Legitimate Votes

When the Islamists were elected by clear majorities in legislative and presidential elections, the secularists didn’t much like it -- but at first they accepted the results as legitimate. The constitutional drafting process that followed was truncated and in many ways inadequate, but the constitution that emerged was approved by the public in yet a third demonstration that a majority (if not a large one) accepted the government as democratically legitimate. And indeed, the flaws in the constitutional process were caused in no small part by Mursi’s justified fear that the constitutional court would trigger a military coup by declaring the assembly unlawful.

Over time, however, Egyptians who never liked Mursi became impatient. In an astonishing show of bravado, they announced, with plenty of warning, that they were going to begin huge protests on June 30 -- essentially advertising their plans to shut down the country and asking the army to intervene. The protests did their work, producing a constitutional crisis that opened the door for the military to declare that Mursi was no longer president and replace him on an interim basis with the head of the constitutional court, whose institution had been in cahoots with the military all along.

Read More: The Editors, "Egypt’s Coup Can’t Be Sugarcoated"

You might think that replacing an unpopular, Islamist leader with a secular judge is a victory for democracy. It isn’t. In a functioning democracy, there is an orderly constitutional process for protesting and removing a leader. When someone is elected for a term of years, he should serve them out unless he resigns or is impeached. The popularity ratings of U.S. presidents regularly sink below 50 percent -- George W. Bush’s fell into the 20s -- but that doesn’t mean they should be removed from office. The president needs a majority only when elected, not at every subsequent moment. This applies to a president who is doing a bad job and even to a president who is violating the constitution. (Who then, by the way, should be removed by a constitutional process if at all possible.)

What distinguishes constitutional democracy from mob rule is that orderly processes are followed. And what distinguishes it from autocracy is that the military doesn’t get to choose who rules. The Egyptian people as a whole are not getting rid of Mursi. The army is, with cover provided by the protesters who lost at the ballot box.

Expect Autocracy

What will happen next is sadly easy to foresee. A caretaker government will continue to have the strings pulled by the military. Don’t expect elections soon, because it’s entirely possible that the Islamists would win those elections. If there are elections, don’t be surprised if the Islamists are banned from running. Like Iran, Egypt will be an autocracy with elections.

Should we expect the Brotherhood to fight back and ignite a civil war? Probably not. The group has a long history of avoiding violent clashes with the military; it prefers to bide its time and build public support. Still, it’s a sign of Egypt’s newfound volatility that the possibility lands within the realm of reality.

Today, the loser is not just democracy in Egypt but democracy itself. Other nations that choose to rise up against illegitimate leaders may want to forgo elections altogether, opting for the guardianship of an army or some other revolutionary vanguard. Or they may embrace the Chinese model, finding its calm, order and authoritarianism more appealing than the wild ride of democratic elections.

America’s choice of democracy -- a choice we’re in the midst of celebrating -- was considered bizarre and unwise by many in its time. Only our Constitution, with its checks on the mob, consolidated democracy and allowed it to become popular worldwide. Today the anti-democrats, past and present, are doubtless feeling self-satisfied with their newly won appeal. Let’s hope the glory is fleeting in Egypt and the world over.

(Noah Feldman, a law professor at Harvard University and the author of “Cool War: The Future of Global Competition,” is a Bloomberg View columnist. Follow him on Twitter at @NoahRFeldman.)

To contact the writer of this article: Noah Feldman at noah_feldman@harvard.edu.

Replies sorted oldest to newest

I blame this tragedy completely on the incapacity of the brotherhood to broaden their vision of what it is to govern such a large population with limited resources. You cannot begin by engaging the religious community and giving them authority in areas where they have no ability or business being. What happened in Luxor was despicable. It seeded this tragedy in part and objectifies the failure of good sense in the brotherhood in general.

 

The catholic church took some 200 years to relinquish its authority on Christianity and to accept its splintered group inclusive of secular culture as authoritative in social life. Even today vestigial remnants still try to assert holy authority in certain areas ( stem cells, cloning, abortion etc)

 

What is happening in the middle east will have to resolve itself by lots of internal re arranging and power brokering and development of respect and modes of civil conduct outside the persisting religious demands and perception of slights. It will not come easy.

FM

Democracy is an invention of the west and big business. It's real purpose is to fleece resource rich but politically unstable or corrupt governments.

 

In any case, Sharia Law and Islamic State have nothing to do with democracy.

Mr.T
Last edited by Mr.T
Originally Posted by Mr.T:

Democracy is an invention of the west and big business. It's real purpose is to fleece resource rich but politically unstable or corrupt governments.

 

In any case, Sharia Law and Islamic State have nothing to do with democracy.

Democracy was invented before the idea states much less a term as the "west" or big business. Indeed of late it has been used as a means of elites capturing the authority of states to enrich themselves. However, it is the only invention we have that expresses the ideals of individual power and best meet them.

 

Indeed, submission to religious dictum and democracy are antithetical viewpoints.

FM
Originally Posted by Mr.T:

Democracy is an invention of the west and big business. It's real purpose is to fleece resource rich but politically unstable or corrupt governments.

 

In any case, Sharia Law and Islamic State have nothing to do with democracy.

Hmm, so what would you propose, tribalism?

FM

Using the democratic process to install authoritarian rule is a common practice. Morsi did just that. Using foreign rebels to overrun a government like in Syria is OK in the eyes of these same people who are shouting about the topplng of Morsi.

Mr.T

Morsi and the brotherhood chose the electorial path to power  I hope they continue to use this political process and do not start to rely on the gun and bomb as a way to power.

FM
Originally Posted by Mr.T:

Using the democratic process to install authoritarian rule is a common practice. Morsi did just that. Using foreign rebels to overrun a government like in Syria is OK in the eyes of these same people who are shouting about the topplng of Morsi.

The US, Saudi and Qatar supports the military intervention.  The latter two are the architects of the Syrian terrorist invasion, hood-winked by the USA, of course.

FM

I really think that Morsi's main fault was taking a leaf out of Bush/Blair/Netanyaho's book.   Morsi tried to create a feeling of victimization and hysteria, first unleashing an imaginary jihad on Syria, Egypt’s historical ally and one-time partner in the short-lived United Arab Republic.

His second ploy was a threat of war against Ethiopia based on half-baked rumors that their huge hydroelectric dam would interfere with the flow of the Nile.

The real role of Morsi was to isolate Egypt, turn it into the laughing stock of the Middle East, castrate its military and create base of operations for certain foreign intelligence agencies.

Now he has himself become the laughstock of his neighbours. Assad with his monumental problems must be smiling.

 

Morsi was a world class thug. Set him loose and Egypt will be another Iraq.

 

.

FM
Originally Posted by Danyael:
 

However, it is the only invention we have that expresses the ideals of individual power and best meet them.

 

 

Therefore we cannot in good conscience agree with the forceful removal of a democratically elected official. If you agree, then you are contradicting your own statement.

FM
Originally Posted by Vish M:

This forum is about Guyana and Guyanese issues??

 

Please advise otherwise

Bai, Guyanese deh all ova de world so there is a good chance that from anywhere in the world, you will have stories about Guyanese.

FM
Originally Posted by Vish M:

This forum is about Guyana and Guyanese issues??

 

Please advise otherwise

It has always included Political Discussions on issues anywhere in the world. There is no stipulation that it has to be about Guyana or Guyanese issues.

Mars
Originally Posted by Vish M:

well if "GOD" says so then "it is so" 

I didn't make it so.

 

Go read the Forum Directory page and the way it describes the Political Forum - "A discussion of political issues concerning Guyana and the World"

Mars
Originally Posted by ksazma:
Originally Posted by Danyael:
 

However, it is the only invention we have that expresses the ideals of individual power and best meet them.

 

 

Therefore we cannot in good conscience agree with the forceful removal of a democratically elected official. If you agree, then you are contradicting your own statement.

If democracy is the willing conferring of authority to govern ( with reservations of rights to citizens to non injury and no assault on liberty) then governments are hired hands not divine implantation. The authority extends only so far as governments do not exceed their mandate as per the covenant between them and their people. This agreement is their "constitution" or legacy of traditionally accepted practices. There is no prohibition to removal of any government by force if a people deems it just.

FM
Originally Posted by ksazma:
Originally Posted by Mr.T:

 

In any case, Sharia Law and Islamic State have nothing to do with democracy.

Please elaborate. Thanks.

divine authority and individual choice ( a secular creation) are at opposite sides of the spectrum. The former assumes that authority to govern come per god's holy book and democracy is grounded in natural rights, ie the presumption that the individual is sovereign ( inclusive of their right to believe in a god or decide what gods to believe in or not)

 

Divine authority is sublimated into the authority of an electorate presumed to be plural and participating of their own free  will in the selection of a leader via some defined electoral process. Here I mean religious laws can inform a democracy but a democracy cannot exist being subservient to religious laws.

FM
Thank you for the info
 
 
 
Originally Posted by God:
Originally Posted by Vish M:

well if "GOD" says so then "it is so" 

I didn't make it so.

 

Go read the Forum Directory page and the way it describes the Political Forum - "A discussion of political issues concerning Guyana and the World"

Vish M
Originally Posted by Danyael:
Originally Posted by ksazma:
Originally Posted by Danyael:
 

However, it is the only invention we have that expresses the ideals of individual power and best meet them.

 

 

Therefore we cannot in good conscience agree with the forceful removal of a democratically elected official. If you agree, then you are contradicting your own statement.

If democracy is the willing conferring of authority to govern ( with reservations of rights to citizens to non injury and no assault on liberty) then governments are hired hands not divine implantation. The authority extends only so far as governments do not exceed their mandate as per the covenant between them and their people. This agreement is their "constitution" or legacy of traditionally accepted practices. There is no prohibition to removal of any government by force if a people deems it just.

Would you then determine that since the people wanted to have Obama removed in 2010, force should also be an option?

FM
Originally Posted by Danyael:
Originally Posted by ksazma:
Originally Posted by Mr.T:

 

In any case, Sharia Law and Islamic State have nothing to do with democracy.

Please elaborate. Thanks.

divine authority and individual choice ( a secular creation) are at opposite sides of the spectrum. The former assumes that authority to govern come per god's holy book and democracy is grounded in natural rights, ie the presumption that the individual is sovereign ( inclusive of their right to believe in a god or decide what gods to believe in or not)

 

Divine authority is sublimated into the authority of an electorate presumed to be plural and participating of their own free  will in the selection of a leader via some defined electoral process. Here I mean religious laws can inform a democracy but a democracy cannot exist being subservient to religious laws.

Exactly why I asked for an elaboration. Your input here clearly shows a gross lack of understanding of shariah. There is nothing religious about shariah. Shariah means laws and they are not based on religions precepts. But grieve not for you are not the only one who make that grave mistake.

FM
Originally Posted by Danyael:
Originally Posted by ksazma:
Originally Posted by Mr.T:

 

In any case, Sharia Law and Islamic State have nothing to do with democracy.

Please elaborate. Thanks.

divine authority and individual choice ( a secular creation) are at opposite sides of the spectrum. The former assumes that authority to govern come per god's holy book and democracy is grounded in natural rights, ie the presumption that the individual is sovereign ( inclusive of their right to believe in a god or decide what gods to believe in or not)

 

Divine authority is sublimated into the authority of an electorate presumed to be plural and participating of their own free  will in the selection of a leader via some defined electoral process. Here I mean religious laws can inform a democracy but a democracy cannot exist being subservient to religious laws.

Let's see if we can do a precis here and use some simple language.

 

divine authority and individual choice ( a secular creation) are at opposite sides of the spectrum

 

Religion and State are opposite to each other.

 

 

 

the individual is sovereign

 

Individual rights matter

 

 

sublimated into the authority

 

Oh shyte...this one lil hard. I'll give it a try - the people have a God-given right to elect their own leaders.

 

 

religious laws can inform a democracy

 

Democracy can have some groundings in the Holy Books

 

 

ROTFLMAO.....

Kari
Originally Posted by ksazma:
Originally Posted by Danyael:
Originally Posted by ksazma:
Originally Posted by Danyael:
 

However, it is the only invention we have that expresses the ideals of individual power and best meet them.

 

 

Therefore we cannot in good conscience agree with the forceful removal of a democratically elected official. If you agree, then you are contradicting your own statement.

If democracy is the willing conferring of authority to govern ( with reservations of rights to citizens to non injury and no assault on liberty) then governments are hired hands not divine implantation. The authority extends only so far as governments do not exceed their mandate as per the covenant between them and their people. This agreement is their "constitution" or legacy of traditionally accepted practices. There is no prohibition to removal of any government by force if a people deems it just.

Would you then determine that since the people wanted to have Obama removed in 2010, force should also be an option?

I said, there is no prohibition to the removal of any democratically elected government if they exceed the authority of what the people freely give up. The hypothetical to Obama is spurious.

 

In Guyana, the idea that no one can question the authority of the PPP is not an authority given by any precepts of democracy. On that account the people can seek redress in the courts and if the courts is stymied by the constitution then they may seek through a change in the constitution.

 

If the possibility of doing that does not exist given onerous rules to over come and the PPP still maintain they can act in god mode then  they would have broken a requirement to be fair. Let me be clear,; the people have a superior right ( right to remove him by force)to any president and his government that acts like an elected dictator.

FM
Last edited by Former Member
Originally Posted by ksazma:
Originally Posted by Danyael:
Originally Posted by ksazma:
Originally Posted by Mr.T:

 

In any case, Sharia Law and Islamic State have nothing to do with democracy.

Please elaborate. Thanks.

divine authority and individual choice ( a secular creation) are at opposite sides of the spectrum. The former assumes that authority to govern come per god's holy book and democracy is grounded in natural rights, ie the presumption that the individual is sovereign ( inclusive of their right to believe in a god or decide what gods to believe in or not)

 

Divine authority is sublimated into the authority of an electorate presumed to be plural and participating of their own free  will in the selection of a leader via some defined electoral process. Here I mean religious laws can inform a democracy but a democracy cannot exist being subservient to religious laws.

Exactly why I asked for an elaboration. Your input here clearly shows a gross lack of understanding of shariah. There is nothing religious about shariah. Shariah means laws and they are not based on religions precepts. But grieve not for you are not the only one who make that grave mistake.

 Lets not quibble. I am speaking of modern emergence of Sharia no less than I speak of modern Western jurisprudence.  A preponderance of scholars believe the law cannot be counter to god. Very few believe that god has allowed man to generate new rules according to his own wisdom or as they say in Islam his own effort.

 

Normative jurisprudence in all modern Islamic majority states may not have a fixed, all encompassing model to be be afforded the definite article when speaking of law ( ie the law as you used it) but in all cases  these legal formulations exist in subordination  to religious interpretation of divine dictum.

FM
Last edited by Former Member
Originally Posted by Pointblank:

Danyael  Is te USA a Democracy?

I see it in action every day. You can pay the sophist and meander into a nihilist wasteland all you want; I will not follow you there.

FM
Originally Posted by Danyael:
Originally Posted by Pointblank:

Danyael  Is te USA a Democracy?

I see it in action every day. You can pay the sophist and meander into a nihilist wasteland all you want; I will not follow you there.

You know that the USA is not a Democracy. but you cannot bring yourself to admit that.

Pointblank
Originally Posted by Kari:
Originally Posted by Danyael:
Originally Posted by ksazma:
Originally Posted by Mr.T:

 

In any case, Sharia Law and Islamic State have nothing to do with democracy.

Please elaborate. Thanks.

divine authority and individual choice ( a secular creation) are at opposite sides of the spectrum. The former assumes that authority to govern come per god's holy book and democracy is grounded in natural rights, ie the presumption that the individual is sovereign ( inclusive of their right to believe in a god or decide what gods to believe in or not)

 

Divine authority is sublimated into the authority of an electorate presumed to be plural and participating of their own free  will in the selection of a leader via some defined electoral process. Here I mean religious laws can inform a democracy but a democracy cannot exist being subservient to religious laws.

Let's see if we can do a precis here and use some simple language.

 

divine authority and individual choice ( a secular creation) are at opposite sides of the spectrum

 

Religion and State are opposite to each other.

 

 

 

the individual is sovereign

 

Individual rights matter

 

 

sublimated into the authority

 

Oh shyte...this one lil hard. I'll give it a try - the people have a God-given right to elect their own leaders.

 

 

religious laws can inform a democracy

 

Democracy can have some groundings in the Holy Books

 

 

ROTFLMAO.....

 You need remedial comprehension of the English language. The state is seen as a corporate entity enclosing religious and secular systems as plural beliefs in the western world. It is distilled nonsense to speak of "Religion" and "State" as opposite poles.  The operant terms were religious and secular thought.

 

I also never said anyone had a god given right. I said, everyone had a natural right and that presumption is the ground for legal rights in the western secular tradition. Religious rights defer ( sublimate) to natural rights in creation of our legal systems. It does not mean they tradition does not have influence. After all, Calvinisy Covenantalism is said to be the fountain head of federalism.

 

Shitty summaries are mainly due to ignorant of the subject matter.

FM
Originally Posted by Pointblank:
Originally Posted by Danyael:
Originally Posted by Pointblank:

Danyael  Is te USA a Democracy?

I see it in action every day. You can pay the sophist and meander into a nihilist wasteland all you want; I will not follow you there.

You know that the USA is not a Democracy. but you cannot bring yourself to admit that.

 It is good to know you can think for me these days...is that not the reality elsewhere when we have to look to selected elders as official interpreters of the script? Again, emphatically and definitely no. I think the US is a vibrant democracy,

FM
Originally Posted by Danyael:
 You need remedial comprehension of the English language. The state is seen as a corporate entity enclosing religious and secular systems as plural beliefs in the western world. It is distilled nonsense to speak of "Religion" and "State" as opposite poles.  The operant terms were religious and secular thought.

 

I also never said anyone had a god given right. I said, everyone had a natural right and that presumption is the ground for legal rights in the western secular tradition. Religious rights defer ( sublimate) to natural rights in creation of our legal systems. It does not mean they tradition does not have influence. After all, Calvinisy Covenantalism is said to be the fountain head of federalism.

 

Shitty summaries are mainly due to ignorant of the subject matter.

entity enclosing religious and secular systems as plural beliefs

 

 

distilled nonsense

 

 

The operant terms

 

- A GNI gem....

 

Calvinisy Covenantalism

 

- GNI Hall of Fame stuff....

Kari
Originally Posted by Kari:
Originally Posted by Danyael:
 You need remedial comprehension of the English language. The state is seen as a corporate entity enclosing religious and secular systems as plural beliefs in the western world. It is distilled nonsense to speak of "Religion" and "State" as opposite poles.  The operant terms were religious and secular thought.

 

I also never said anyone had a god given right. I said, everyone had a natural right and that presumption is the ground for legal rights in the western secular tradition. Religious rights defer ( sublimate) to natural rights in creation of our legal systems. It does not mean they tradition does not have influence. After all, Calvinisy Covenantalism is said to be the fountain head of federalism.

 

Shitty summaries are mainly due to ignorant of the subject matter.

entity enclosing religious and secular systems as plural beliefs

 

 

distilled nonsense

 

 

The operant terms

 

- A GNI gem....

 

Calvinisy Covenantalism

 

- GNI Hall of Fame stuff....

I would be happy to say i am part of your education but alas that is not true since as the willfully ignorant you stand your ground and grin like a clown as usual. Others of more discerning constitution will use their google fu to inform themselves on areas they find new. In any event, these are terms and ideas any high school graduate worth their salt should be familiar with.

 

You should know fully well the last sentence was "Calvinist". This is a forum an I do little spell checking. Now keep on laughing but do not be surprised if you are laughing alone and at yourself.

 

FM
Originally Posted by Danyael:
Originally Posted by Pointblank:
Originally Posted by Danyael:
Originally Posted by Pointblank:

Danyael  Is te USA a Democracy?

I see it in action every day. You can pay the sophist and meander into a nihilist wasteland all you want; I will not follow you there.

You know that the USA is not a Democracy. but you cannot bring yourself to admit that.

 It is good to know you can think for me these days...is that not the reality elsewhere when we have to look to selected elders as official interpreters of the script? Again, emphatically and definitely no. I think the US is a vibrant democracy,

go read read the US constitution

Pointblank
Originally Posted by Pointblank:
Originally Posted by Danyael:
Originally Posted by Pointblank:
Originally Posted by Danyael:
Originally Posted by Pointblank:

Danyael  Is te USA a Democracy?

I see it in action every day. You can pay the sophist and meander into a nihilist wasteland all you want; I will not follow you there.

You know that the USA is not a Democracy. but you cannot bring yourself to admit that.

 It is good to know you can think for me these days...is that not the reality elsewhere when we have to look to selected elders as official interpreters of the script? Again, emphatically and definitely no. I think the US is a vibrant democracy,

go read read the US constitution

That is the most ignorant of comebacks...what of it that makes it undemocratic? Further, there are state constitutions also 50 of them!

FM
Originally Posted by Danyael:
Originally Posted by Pointblank:
Originally Posted by Danyael:
Originally Posted by Pointblank:
Originally Posted by Danyael:
Originally Posted by Pointblank:

Danyael  Is te USA a Democracy?

I see it in action every day. You can pay the sophist and meander into a nihilist wasteland all you want; I will not follow you there.

You know that the USA is not a Democracy. but you cannot bring yourself to admit that.

 It is good to know you can think for me these days...is that not the reality elsewhere when we have to look to selected elders as official interpreters of the script? Again, emphatically and definitely no. I think the US is a vibrant democracy,

go read read the US constitution

That is the most ignorant of comebacks...what of it that makes it undemocratic? Further, there are state constitutions also 50 of them!

Dont get technical The USA is a Republic. An you should know the difference.

To you the USA everything the Govt of the USA does no wrong

Pointblank
Originally Posted by Danyael:
Originally Posted by ksazma:
Originally Posted by Danyael:
Originally Posted by ksazma:
Originally Posted by Danyael:
 

However, it is the only invention we have that expresses the ideals of individual power and best meet them.

 

 

Therefore we cannot in good conscience agree with the forceful removal of a democratically elected official. If you agree, then you are contradicting your own statement.

If democracy is the willing conferring of authority to govern ( with reservations of rights to citizens to non injury and no assault on liberty) then governments are hired hands not divine implantation. The authority extends only so far as governments do not exceed their mandate as per the covenant between them and their people. This agreement is their "constitution" or legacy of traditionally accepted practices. There is no prohibition to removal of any government by force if a people deems it just.

Would you then determine that since the people wanted to have Obama removed in 2010, force should also be an option?

I said, there is no prohibition to the removal of any democratically elected government if they exceed the authority of what the people freely give up. The hypothetical to Obama is spurious.

 

In Guyana, the idea that no one can question the authority of the PPP is not an authority given by any precepts of democracy. On that account the people can seek redress in the courts and if the courts is stymied by the constitution then they may seek through a change in the constitution.

 

If the possibility of doing that does not exist given onerous rules to over come and the PPP still maintain they can act in god mode then  they would have broken a requirement to be fair. Let me be clear,; the people have a superior right ( right to remove him by force)to any president and his government that acts like an elected dictator.

Nothing spurious my friend. Also the part about Guyana and the PPP does not apply from my viewpoint since I am a US citizen and the discussion is about Egypt. I used the US because of its qualities regarding law and order. The freedom we enjoy and the proper protocols employed here is what makes this country great. Therefore if they are good for us, we cannot impose the opposite method on others with good conscience. If we cannot stomach it we should not impose it on others no matter how non-human we may think they are.

FM
Originally Posted by Danyael:
Originally Posted by ksazma:
Originally Posted by Danyael:
Originally Posted by ksazma:
Originally Posted by Mr.T:

 

In any case, Sharia Law and Islamic State have nothing to do with democracy.

Please elaborate. Thanks.

divine authority and individual choice ( a secular creation) are at opposite sides of the spectrum. The former assumes that authority to govern come per god's holy book and democracy is grounded in natural rights, ie the presumption that the individual is sovereign ( inclusive of their right to believe in a god or decide what gods to believe in or not)

 

Divine authority is sublimated into the authority of an electorate presumed to be plural and participating of their own free  will in the selection of a leader via some defined electoral process. Here I mean religious laws can inform a democracy but a democracy cannot exist being subservient to religious laws.

Exactly why I asked for an elaboration. Your input here clearly shows a gross lack of understanding of shariah. There is nothing religious about shariah. Shariah means laws and they are not based on religions precepts. But grieve not for you are not the only one who make that grave mistake.

 Lets not quibble. I am speaking of modern emergence of Sharia no less than I speak of modern Western jurisprudence.  A preponderance of scholars believe the law cannot be counter to god. Very few believe that god has allowed man to generate new rules according to his own wisdom or as they say in Islam his own effort.

 

Normative jurisprudence in all modern Islamic majority states may not have a fixed, all encompassing model to be be afforded the definite article when speaking of law ( ie the law as you used it) but in all cases  these legal formulations exist in subordination  to religious interpretation of divine dictum.

An incorrect perspective from an incorrect premise. Shariah law is not about religious practices. All societies have laws which preserve them. The Muslim societies are no different. 

FM
Originally Posted by Pointblank:
Originally Posted by Danyael:
Originally Posted by Pointblank:
Originally Posted by Danyael:
Originally Posted by Pointblank:
Originally Posted by Danyael:
Originally Posted by Pointblank:

Danyael  Is te USA a Democracy?

I see it in action every day. You can pay the sophist and meander into a nihilist wasteland all you want; I will not follow you there.

You know that the USA is not a Democracy. but you cannot bring yourself to admit that.

 It is good to know you can think for me these days...is that not the reality elsewhere when we have to look to selected elders as official interpreters of the script? Again, emphatically and definitely no. I think the US is a vibrant democracy,

go read read the US constitution

That is the most ignorant of comebacks...what of it that makes it undemocratic? Further, there are state constitutions also 50 of them!

Dont get technical The USA is a Republic. An you should know the difference.

To you the USA everything the Govt of the USA does no wrong

huh, . . .  "difference" between wha?

 

too little knowledge can sometimes be more (mentally) destabilizing than none at all . . . smh

FM

Add Reply

×
×
×
×
×
Link copied to your clipboard.
×
×