Imran posted:

This guy claims that Indians need to see themselves as Guyanese yet his post are racist and full of hatred against Indians.

Caribny why don't you start living by example... remove the hate that is clouding your vision. 

His concept of Guyanese, means that Indians should act like the Afros and adapt their culture, which he recognizes as the only "Guyanese" culture. I submit that the Indian culture is as much Guyanese as those of the Afros. 

caribny posted:

GTAngler posted:

Maybe that was why Burnham took the money the Indian government sent, I think it was for indians who wanted to move back to India, and built the cultural centre.

Your basic Indocentric nature blinds you to the truth. YOUR ancestors were brought to Guyana financed by taxes levied on the former slaves. The funds that Burnam took were funds that the British had set aside to finance the return of indentures to India. 

That money was the taxes that these black people paid and that impoverished them because it resulted in their inability to maintain proper drainage and irrigation in their villages and to acquire more lands as their village populations grew.

That money did NOT belong only to Indians!  But of course your Indocentric nature doesn't permit you to understand this fact.

I see no relevance to slavery in that discussion and I draw attention to the fact that you are hardly one to talk. Many people in India lied to people and got them into a system which had some features that resembled slavery, which is why it was eventually ended.  They told them about paradise in Demerara and when they got there they got malaria and a system where they were lashed if they left the estates without permission, or if they refused to work when they were sick.

http://www.guyana.org/features...story/chapter65.html

Indian immigration continued to be financed by the Government into the 1860s. Much of this financing was raised through loans obtained in Great Britain, by advances from the British Government, and from the general revenue of the Colony. But this system created financial problems and in 1864 a decision was taken by the British Guiana Government to create an Immigration Fund to finance the cost of immigration. This Fund was draw from general revenue, duties levied on estates' supplies, indenture and re-indenture fees paid by planters, fees paid for renewal of certificates of exemption from labour, and fees for the registration of Indian marriages. The amount paid into this Fund grew significantly with each succeeding year.

By 1869, about 30,000 Indians had become qualified for return passages. The estimated cost of these passages was over a quarter of a million dollars which was an expense the Government could not easily bear. Further, repatriation to India was depleting the plantation of the labour force while the Government was losing money by paying for the return trip. To prevent the reduction of this work force, the Government promoted the idea of granting land to the Indians instead of the return passage.

This idea was originally proposed by the Immigration General, James Crosby, but Indians had not made a decision to settle permanently in Guyana. It was not until 1877 that they began to seek permission from the Government to purchase abandoned estates. In 1880, the Government purchased Huist Dieren, an abandoned estate in Essequibo, and divided it into lots which were offered to some Indian families in exchange for the return passages to India.

In 1882, the new Governor, Sir Henry Irving, halted this scheme since he felt it was costing the Government too much to purchase the land. He devised a scheme by which lands owned by the Government (i.e., Crown lands) were to be sold at cheap prices to Indians. However, such purchases did not mean that the Indians were surrendering their right to their return passages. Many Indians liked Irving's policy and very soon Indian settlements were formed at Cotton Tree (West Berbice), Brighton (Corentyne) and Maria's Lodge (Essequibo), among other areas.

But Irving's plan did not receive full support from the planter class, and after he completed his term and departed from Guyana in 1894, the original plan of giving land to Indians in exchange for the return passages was re-introduced. Under this arrangement, the Indians were to be selected by the Government for lands in some settlements to be created. It was as a result of this change that Helena (East Demerara), Bush Lot (West Berbice) and Whim (Corentyne) were purchased by the Government and house lots and farm plots were given to selected Indian families in 1897.

Carib, read the above.

bump

where is the brother Carib.

Rass bai, jangy put cribby in he place.  Caribj is a compulsive liar when it comes to making up false information about Indians. 

Drugb posted:

Rass bai, jangy put cribby in he place.  Caribj is a compulsive liar when it comes to making up false information about Indians. 

The resident investigator will chack any one who make up stories.

Django posted:

caribny posted:

GTAngler posted:

Maybe that was why Burnham took the money the Indian government sent, I think it was for indians who wanted to move back to India, and built the cultural centre.

Your basic Indocentric nature blinds you to the truth. YOUR ancestors were brought to Guyana financed by taxes levied on the former slaves. The funds that Burnam took were funds that the British had set aside to finance the return of indentures to India. 

That money was the taxes that these black people paid and that impoverished them because it resulted in their inability to maintain proper drainage and irrigation in their villages and to acquire more lands as their village populations grew.

That money did NOT belong only to Indians!  But of course your Indocentric nature doesn't permit you to understand this fact.

I see no relevance to slavery in that discussion and I draw attention to the fact that you are hardly one to talk. Many people in India lied to people and got them into a system which had some features that resembled slavery, which is why it was eventually ended.  They told them about paradise in Demerara and when they got there they got malaria and a system where they were lashed if they left the estates without permission, or if they refused to work when they were sick.

http://www.guyana.org/features...story/chapter65.html

Indian immigration continued to be financed by the Government into the 1860s. Much of this financing was raised through loans obtained in Great Britain, by advances from the British Government, and from the general revenue of the Colony. But this system created financial problems and in 1864 a decision was taken by the British Guiana Government to create an Immigration Fund to finance the cost of immigration. This Fund was draw from general revenue, duties levied on estates' supplies, indenture and re-indenture fees paid by planters, fees paid for renewal of certificates of exemption from labour, and fees for the registration of Indian marriages. The amount paid into this Fund grew significantly with each succeeding year.

By 1869, about 30,000 Indians had become qualified for return passages. The estimated cost of these passages was over a quarter of a million dollars which was an expense the Government could not easily bear. Further, repatriation to India was depleting the plantation of the labour force while the Government was losing money by paying for the return trip. To prevent the reduction of this work force, the Government promoted the idea of granting land to the Indians instead of the return passage.

This idea was originally proposed by the Immigration General, James Crosby, but Indians had not made a decision to settle permanently in Guyana. It was not until 1877 that they began to seek permission from the Government to purchase abandoned estates. In 1880, the Government purchased Huist Dieren, an abandoned estate in Essequibo, and divided it into lots which were offered to some Indian families in exchange for the return passages to India.

In 1882, the new Governor, Sir Henry Irving, halted this scheme since he felt it was costing the Government too much to purchase the land. He devised a scheme by which lands owned by the Government (i.e., Crown lands) were to be sold at cheap prices to Indians. However, such purchases did not mean that the Indians were surrendering their right to their return passages. Many Indians liked Irving's policy and very soon Indian settlements were formed at Cotton Tree (West Berbice), Brighton (Corentyne) and Maria's Lodge (Essequibo), among other areas.

But Irving's plan did not receive full support from the planter class, and after he completed his term and departed from Guyana in 1894, the original plan of giving land to Indians in exchange for the return passages was re-introduced. Under this arrangement, the Indians were to be selected by the Government for lands in some settlements to be created. It was as a result of this change that Helena (East Demerara), Bush Lot (West Berbice) and Whim (Corentyne) were purchased by the Government and house lots and farm plots were given to selected Indian families in 1897.

---

 

Carib, read the above.

Good morning  Fact Checker.

GTAngler posted:

 

Good morning  Fact Checker.

You are welcome bhaiya.

GTAngler posted:

. Anyone who doesn't agree with you must be against you. Independent and free thinking is forbidden. PNC anyone????

And you suggest that I agree with you that,

1.  The violence and abuse in the 60s was only blacks attacking Indians.

2. The only abusive language between the two groups from black directed towards Indians.

3. The fact that Indians dominate rice and sugar should be a factor in the level of assistance that they receive. When I suggest that they be treated as the blacks in bauxite were you squeal.  This because you know full well how blacks were treated and demand better treatment from Indians.

4. Then you lie about the funds that Burnham used for the Cultural Center screaming that it "belonged" to Indians. 

Well sorry if you think that I should endorse your Indo centric outlook. I cannot and will not do this.  Now go howl with your Indo KKK buddies that caribny is a racist because he doesn't support Indian racism or ethnocentric attitudes.

Django posted:

 

http://www.guyana.org/features...story/chapter65.html

Indian immigration continued to be financed by the Government into the 1860s. Much of this financing was raised through loans obtained in Great Britain,

Carib, read the above.

Funded by a LOAN. Now where did you think that the funds that were used to repay the loans were repaid. The sugar planters did NOT pay taxes and received tax waivers on items that the rest of the population, at the time largely former slaves paid.

The money did NOT belong to Indians!  Revenues were raised from duties on items used by the general population and on taxes on the type of activities engaged by the masses.

The black population was a tremendously over taxed group and taxation was very REGRESSIVE!  This was the reason for the infamous "Buxton people stop train"!

I invite you and others to itemize what compensation or assistance did the former slaves get from the government, even as they were heavily taxed!  NOTHING!

Burnham was RIGHT to take away the money and GTAngler and his fellow racists can jump, scream, squeal and grunt that Indians are better than blacks so are owed favors not accorded to blacks.

Drugb posted:

Rass bai, jangy put cribby in he place.  Caribj is a compulsive liar

I get my information from Walter Rodney's analysis of the history of 19th century British Guiana. You get it from a PPP propagandist!

caribny posted:

Drugb posted:

Rass bai, jangy put cribby in he place.  Caribj is a compulsive liar

I get my information from Walter Rodney's analysis of the history of 19th century British Guiana. You get it from a PPP propagandist!

No wonder,  the blind leading the blind.

Nothing scares me more than the anti-koolie racists some of whom now rule Guyana. The anti-koolie ideology is deeply rooted. So the al brown Guyanai squad on GNI can keep dreaming about ruling a people who have fought for centuries to be ruled by their own.

Drugb posted:

!

No wonder,  the blind leading the blind.

It takes a jackass like druggie to claim that Rodney was a man ignorant of Guyanese history.  The man is a LEADING authority on the history of 19th century Guyana.

Prashad posted:

Nothing scares me more than the anti-koolie racists some of whom now rule Guyana. The anti-koolie ideology is deeply rooted. So the al brown Guyanai squad on GNI can keep dreaming about ruling a people who have fought for centuries to be ruled by their own.

Here he goes babbling in his corner, teeth clattering in fear and dreaming of New Indesh where he wouldn't have to fear a creole woman.

caribny posted:

Drugb posted:

!

No wonder,  the blind leading the blind.

It takes a jackass like druggie to claim that Rodney was a man ignorant of Guyanese history.  The man is a LEADING authority on the history of 19th century Guyana.

I meant to say the dead leading the blind. Rodney was very Afrocentric and biased in favor of Blacks. He may be a hero in your eyes but I am indifferent to his body of work. 

Drugb posted:

. Rodney was very Afrocentric and biased in favor of Blacks. He may be a hero in your eyes but I am indifferent to his body of work. 

Yes the SAME man who stood up to an African dictator and was killed as a result.

Further confirmation that you are an idiot.  You don't have a minimal clue as to what Guyanese history is.

caribny posted:

Drugb posted:

. Rodney was very Afrocentric and biased in favor of Blacks. He may be a hero in your eyes but I am indifferent to his body of work. 

Yes the SAME man who stood up to an African dictator and was killed as a result.

Further confirmation that you are an idiot.  You don't have a minimal clue as to what Guyanese history is.

The last time I checked, he blew himself up with a bomb that he was about to plant.  At least this is what your beloved PNC claims. He was trying to become the second coming of Burnham with his radical pan africanist ideals.  Another man who wasted his life in pursuit of power. 

Drugb posted:

caribny posted:

Drugb posted:

. Rodney was very Afrocentric and biased in favor of Blacks. He may be a hero in your eyes but I am indifferent to his body of work. 

Yes the SAME man who stood up to an African dictator and was killed as a result.

Further confirmation that you are an idiot.  You don't have a minimal clue as to what Guyanese history is.

The last time I checked, he blew himself up with a bomb that he was about to plant.  At least this is what your beloved PNC claims. He was trying to become the second coming of Burnham with his radical pan africanist ideals.  Another man who wasted his life in pursuit of power. 

You can't be serious. Absolute rubbish!!! You are either being intentionally mischievous or you are stupid and ignorant.

Why were many Indians recipient of scholarships if they were second class citizens and marginalised?  Look, Guyanese of all colour and stripes suffered under the Burnham regime.  So to assert that Indians were second class citizens and were the only victims is incorrect.  

FC posted:

Why were many Indians recipient of scholarships if they were second class citizens and marginalised?  Look, Guyanese of all colour and stripes suffered under the Burnham regime.  So to assert that Indians were second class citizens and were the only victims is incorrect.  

This goes to show that you did not grow up in Guyana or your are not an Indian.  The prevailing sentiment at the time was that we were 2nd class citizens.  You can argue that the sentiment was misplaced but nevertheless it was there. 

FC posted:

You can't be serious. Absolute rubbish!!! You are either being intentionally mischievous or you are stupid and ignorant.

You have got to be joking, did you not read the prognosis of your beloved PNC regarding the Rodney COI? 

Rodney was a pan africanist, this is documented, go look it up. 

Drugb posted:

 

The last time I checked, he blew himself up with a bomb that he was about to plant.   

Hmmm. Interesting that you peddle Burnham's propaganda. Apparently the PTSD that you continue to suffer from makes you too intimidated to tell the truth of that era.

FC posted:

Why were many Indians recipient of scholarships if they were second class citizens and marginalised?  Look, Guyanese of all colour and stripes suffered under the Burnham regime.  So to assert that Indians were second class citizens and were the only victims is incorrect.  

Guyanese of all types suffered under Burnham as they did in fact suffer under Jagdeo/Ramotar.  However the Indians had the added stress of being singled out for additional humiliation during the Burnham era just as were blacks under Jagdeo especially.  I was fully aware of this as I saw how Indians who I knew were treated at the time.

The part that is interesting is that I can admit to the marginalization of grass roots Indians under the Burnham era, and will not debate against those who might claim that it is happening again. The Indo KKK set however cannot be equally honest at assessing how blacks were excluded and humiliated during the Jagdeo/Ramotar era.

Prashad posted:

Nothing scares me more than the anti-koolie racists some of whom now rule Guyana. The anti-koolie ideology is deeply rooted. So the al brown Guyanai squad on GNI can keep dreaming about ruling a people who have fought for centuries to be ruled by their own.

Prashad, why don't you shut your yap ! You are not intelligent enough or even remotely au fait with what is being discussed but still persist with your garbage/nonsense 'al brown' and 'Guyanai' ! There are no such words, you idiot !! Go back to your toilet cleaning/dishwashing duties !! 

Keffer al brown Guyani I don't need to argue with you. There are other means of dealing with you. So continue with your nonsense.

Prashad posted:

Keffer al brown Guyani I don't need to argue with you. There are other means of dealing with you. So continue with your nonsense.

Just go away; don't you understand ? Scram ! You are an idiot; completely out of your stupid league !

Keffer posted:

Prashad posted:

Keffer al brown Guyani I don't need to argue with you. There are other means of dealing with you. So continue with your nonsense.

Just go away; don't you understand ? Scram ! You are an idiot; completely out of your stupid league !

When I come to Ontario I will be visiting you peacefully. 

caribny posted:

  

 

Guyanese of all types suffered under Burnham as they did in fact suffer under Jagdeo/Ramotar.  However the Indians had the added stress of being singled out for additional humiliation during the Burnham era just as were blacks under Jagdeo especially.  I was fully aware of this as I saw how Indians who I knew were treated at the time.

The part that is interesting is that I can admit to the marginalization of grass roots Indians under the Burnham era, and will not debate against those who might claim that it is happening again. The Indo KKK set however cannot be equally honest at assessing how blacks were excluded and humiliated during the Jagdeo/Ramotar era.

You keep selling this story of how Blacks were marginalized under the PPP. However these are lies, in fact Blacks still held the bulk of the public service jobs. They still bullied the Indians, burned raped and robbed them daily. Let us not forget the days of mo fiah slow fiah disguised as protests. If you did a head count of Black leadership in the government agencies under the PPP you see that it was at least 10 times more than Indians under the PNC.  I suspect that you think that if you keep repeating a lie often enough it will eventually become considered fact, but that is where I come in, to remind the others that you are a liar.