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FM
Former Member

Shuman was impressive in New York

By Stabroek News On In Letters to the Editor |

https://www.stabroeknews.com/2...ressive-in-new-york/

Dear Editor,

I was most impressed with a discourse given by Liberty and Justice Party leader Lenox Shuman on Saturday afternoon in Richmond Hill, Queens. It was the first time I heard Mr. Shuman give a live political speech. His remarks and body language, pitch and delivery were all good and the hallmarks of a decent politician, a man of integrity and decency.

He was very articulate, well-spoken, learned, knowledgeable on issues, direct, forceful, clear, concise, sharp, grammatically correct, coherent, balanced, versatile, quick-witted and eloquent in his remarks. It seemed to me that Shuman had a very sound educational background and was someone who read a lot because he was familiar with economics and political terms. He also displayed background knowledge in sociology (race relations) and anthropology (of Amerindian communities. And he is well versed in Guyana’s history and geography.  And Shuman had an attractive voice. It makes you want to listen to him unlike some politicians whose voice you would prefer not to hear – boring.

Shuman was so different from other Guyanese politicians I heard in Guyana and in the diaspora. He did not say what he thought people wanted to hear to fool them as career politicians do. But he spoke from the heart of what he sees as the most critical problems in Guyana and how they should be addressed. He did not bury the race problem under the carpet, and in fact said racism and corruption are the two elephants (biggest problems) that he feels are holding back Guyana’s development. Unlike other politicians who tend to avoid addressing these two intractable problems, Shuman addressed them head-on. And he charged both major parties with playing the race card and condoning corruption and of violating the constitution. If given a chance, he will stamp out corruption and take measures to end race politics. He will adhere to the tenets of the constitution. And he supports major constitutional reform.

He talked about the problems facing indigenous communities. He showed how marginalized and neglected are Amerindian communities, and he offered some ideas how to tackle this problem – building cheap accessible infrastructure to link the hinterland with the coast and creating jobs for them. He noted that Amerindians and East Indians have the highest poverty rate in Guyana with East Indians constituting the largest number of Guyanese living in poverty. He said the government should not have closed the sugar estates until there were alternatives to provide jobs for those who would be unemployed. He also chastised the PPP for not taking measures to modernize GuySuCo and or adopting creative measures to save the industry and or providing lands to the sugar workers to engage in agro industries. He supports land reforms to help former sugar workers get into agro industries. He feels the private sector should be empowered to address major problems facing the country. He also said that government has no business in running businesses. Government should facilitate business (with appropriate infrastructure) and not compete with business or get into business. He suggested ideas of employment creation and on enabling the poorer classes to own small businesses.

Shuman gave a lot of food for thought on why Guyanese should vote for him. He describes himself and his party as a true balance of power. And he has committed that he will never betray voters unlike another party that promised to be a balance of power force but betrayed those who supported it.

As someone pointed out, at no time were there scuffles or arguments in the room unlike when other parties held political meetings. Shuman listened to all views and he respected all opinions. He answered all questions. He censored or silenced no one. The audience was allowed to engage him. There was a give and take. No one was put out the room. The audience was impressed with his presence with some pointing out that he is not the typical run-of-the-mill politician who seeks to deceive listeners. Some in the audience like his plan for Guyana and like the idea of his party or other minor parties denying the two behemoths a majority in parliament. They like the idea of minor parties serving as a balance of power and expressed their disappointment that the AFC has betrayed the spirit of the idea of a balance of power. They invited Shuman to return to New York for a follow up exchange and some committed to raising funds for him.

Yours faithfully,

Dr. Vishnu Bisram

 

Replies sorted oldest to newest

this is the money paragraph i am endeavoring to parse in the letter to SN by the fake PPP ‘pollster’:

“He [Shuman] noted that Amerindians and East Indians have the highest poverty rate in Guyana with East Indians constituting the largest number of Guyanese living in poverty.”

let’s discuss . . . let’s discuss

hmmmm?

FM
ronan posted:

this is the money paragraph i am endeavoring to parse in the letter to SN by the fake PPP ‘pollster’:

“He [Shuman] noted that Amerindians and East Indians have the highest poverty rate in Guyana with East Indians constituting the largest number of Guyanese living in poverty.”

let’s discuss . . . let’s discuss

hmmmm?

Are there stats we can look at?

Where is the evidence for those comments?

De bannas does do some fake polls...maybe he got that from a poll??

V
VishMahabir posted:
ronan posted:

this is the money paragraph i am endeavoring to parse in the letter to SN by the fake PPP ‘pollster’:

“He [Shuman] noted that Amerindians and East Indians have the highest poverty rate in Guyana with East Indians constituting the largest number of Guyanese living in poverty.”

let’s discuss . . . let’s discuss

hmmmm?

Are there stats we can look at?

Where is the evidence for those comments?

De bannas does do some fake polls...maybe he got that from a poll??

banna, last i check, black Guyanese doan own much land or businesses, and they were/are not recipients of the country’s ‘patrimony’ assets from any Gov’t like some people we know

bai, all dem masses of poor-ass black people in Guyana the PPP tribals mekkin a living pouring scorn pan and laughing at are now scrambling around with fire stick looking for this magnificent ‘pan tap’ economic prosperity they ‘possess’ that Bisram juss wave he pen (wand?) and discover

smfh

FM
Last edited by Former Member
ronan posted:
VishMahabir posted:
ronan posted:

this is the money paragraph i am endeavoring to parse in the letter to SN by the fake PPP ‘pollster’:

“He [Shuman] noted that Amerindians and East Indians have the highest poverty rate in Guyana with East Indians constituting the largest number of Guyanese living in poverty.”

let’s discuss . . . let’s discuss

hmmmm?

Are there stats we can look at?

Where is the evidence for those comments?

De bannas does do some fake polls...maybe he got that from a poll??

banna, last i check, black Guyanese doan own much land or businesses, and they were/are not recipients of the country’s ‘patrimony’ assets from any Gov’t like some people we know

bai, all dem masses of poor-ass black people in Guyana the PPP tribals mekkin a living pouring scorn pan and laughing at are now scrambling around with fire stick looking for this magnificent ‘pan tap’ economic prosperity they ‘possess’ that Bisram juss wave he pen (wand?) and discover

smfh

The last you checked?  You skunk left Guyana in 1973.  PNC gave many Blacks land in the 70s/80s. Many Blacks sold their land to Indian farmers. So today, their kids have none and ayuh blame the PPP!

Banna, gwan suh!

Ayuh play Ayuh tune and dance 💃 yuhself!

FM
Baseman posted:
ronan posted:

bai, all dem masses of poor-ass black people in Guyana the PPP tribals mekkin a living pouring scorn pan and laughing at are now scrambling around with fire stick looking for this magnificent ‘pan tap’ economic prosperity they ‘possess’ that Bisram juss wave he pen (wand?) and discover

smfh

PNC gave many Blacks land in the 70s/80s. Many Blacks sold their land to Indian farmers. So today, their kids have none

your ignar polemic notwithstanding,

i fail to understand why you insist on making my point for me and looking the fool

you seem confused

call a friend

FM
Last edited by Former Member
ronan posted:
Baseman posted:
ronan posted:

bai, all dem masses of poor-ass black people in Guyana the PPP tribals mekkin a living pouring scorn pan and laughing at are now scrambling around with fire stick looking for this magnificent ‘pan tap’ economic prosperity they ‘possess’ that Bisram juss wave he pen (wand?) and discover

smfh

PNC gave many Blacks land in the 70s/80s. Many Blacks sold their land to Indian farmers. So today, their kids have none

your ignar polemic notwithstanding,

i fail to understand why you insist on making my point for me and looking the fool

you seem confused

call a friend

Yes, I agree, every 25 or so years, give out land. I actually agree with that!  Give to anyone who has none or was not given in the past 20 years!  That will solve the issue.

FM
Baseman posted:
ronan posted:
Baseman posted:
ronan posted:

bai, all dem masses of poor-ass black people in Guyana the PPP tribals mekkin a living pouring scorn pan and laughing at are now scrambling around with fire stick looking for this magnificent ‘pan tap’ economic prosperity they ‘possess’ that Bisram juss wave he pen (wand?) and discover

smfh

PNC gave many Blacks land in the 70s/80s. Many Blacks sold their land to Indian farmers. So today, their kids have none

your ignar polemic notwithstanding,

i fail to understand why you insist on making my point for me and looking the fool

you seem confused

call a friend

Yes, I agree, every 25 or so years, give out land. I actually agree with that!  Give to anyone who has none or was not given in the past 20 years!  That will solve the issue.

i have no idea what you are “agreeing” with

this thread is about Bisram (Shuman?) telling the world that Black people rule the economic roost in Guyana and Indos are at the bottom, behind Amerindians . . . sorta

how absurd!

even more absurd is you contorting yourself into a tight idiot knot to avoid acknowledging the obvious

smfh

FM
ronan posted:
Baseman posted:
ronan posted:

bai, all dem masses of poor-ass black people in Guyana the PPP tribals mekkin a living pouring scorn pan and laughing at are now scrambling around with fire stick looking for this magnificent ‘pan tap’ economic prosperity they ‘possess’ that Bisram juss wave he pen (wand?) and discover

smfh

PNC gave many Blacks land in the 70s/80s. Many Blacks sold their land to Indian farmers. So today, their kids have none

your ignar polemic notwithstanding,

i fail to understand why you insist on making my point for me and looking the fool

you seem confused

call a friend

LMFAO . Of late Baseman seem lil bipolar. He on both sides of de same issue arguing wid heself sometimes lol.

FM

This whole ting wid Bisram is to create narrative fuh Rat Man and he friends who busy squealing about corruption by the coalition, and that black man getting rich by teefing state assets.

Funny to watch all the indian tribalists hay jump pan Bisram band wagon about "poor Indians" while at de same time cussing black man and extolling the virtues of "rich" Indians in Guyana.

These people have no fking shame.

FM
ronan posted:
Baseman posted:
ronan posted:
Baseman posted:
ronan posted:

bai, all dem masses of poor-ass black people in Guyana the PPP tribals mekkin a living pouring scorn pan and laughing at are now scrambling around with fire stick looking for this magnificent ‘pan tap’ economic prosperity they ‘possess’ that Bisram juss wave he pen (wand?) and discover

smfh

PNC gave many Blacks land in the 70s/80s. Many Blacks sold their land to Indian farmers. So today, their kids have none

your ignar polemic notwithstanding,

i fail to understand why you insist on making my point for me and looking the fool

you seem confused

call a friend

Yes, I agree, every 25 or so years, give out land. I actually agree with that!  Give to anyone who has none or was not given in the past 20 years!  That will solve the issue.

i have no idea what you are “agreeing” with

this thread is about Bisram (Shuman?) telling the world that Black people rule the economic roost in Guyana and Indos are at the bottom, behind Amerindians . . . sorta

how absurd!

even more absurd is you contorting yourself into a tight idiot knot to avoid acknowledging the obvious

smfh

You surely are low wattage. Shuman said none of the above. He said  that Indians constitute he largest number of people in poverty. This can be deduced given 4 in 10 of every Guyanese experience deep poverty with the highest rates of poverty in rural areas where Indians live deprived of consistent electricity, water supply etc  and where the money they earn is entirely dependent on husbandry. With sugar dead that for the Berbice area means they are in deep crap.

The reality is there are more impoverished Indians than the entire population of Amerindians. The number I see most often is that Amerindians are  around 60K of the population. Shuman also knows well  some 70 percent of our people are in extreme poverty with region 8 ( some 11k) living in almost 100 percent extreme poverty 

You are selling crap also that indians were given lands en mass. The few villages where this happened was in lieu of the planters not having to spend the money to repatriate them; monies already deducted from their earnings. On the berbice coast today, most indians do not own more than their house and the lot where it sits. 

Lands are consolidated in the hands of a few. That the face of the rich include a majority of indians does not  mean Indians are rich. It goes without saying that  many indians like to live in the reflected glow of success of  kind and brag on it as if it is an imprimatur of who they are in general. These basic  fact may have confused you

BTW, Ceres and Bishop were given some 200 acres of land each by the PNC that makes them richer ( land wise) in the courentyne than 90 percent of the Indians living there!

FM
Last edited by Former Member
Iguana posted:

This whole ting wid Bisram is to create narrative fuh Rat Man and he friends who busy squealing about corruption by the coalition, and that black man getting rich by teefing state assets.

Funny to watch all the indian tribalists hay jump pan Bisram band wagon about "poor Indians" while at de same time cussing black man and extolling the virtues of "rich" Indians in Guyana.

These people have no fking shame.

No one needs to jump on any wagon. Clive Thomas among others ( Somdat and Gampat) also produced data shredding the myth of the rich Indian. There are lots of data on poverty in general and the reality that 40% of people in general are in extreme poverty ( living on less than 1.25 US a day) should be sobering. 

Guyana is no paradise, It is one of the poorest places on the planet despite our abundance of natural resources. Chalk that up to squabbles of the kind  we have presently where the reality of who is poor consumes useless energy and keep the racist fires lit ( which keeps us poor)

FM
Last edited by Former Member
Stormborn posted:
Iguana posted:

This whole ting wid Bisram is to create narrative fuh Rat Man and he friends who busy squealing about corruption by the coalition, and that black man getting rich by teefing state assets.

Funny to watch all the indian tribalists hay jump pan Bisram band wagon about "poor Indians" while at de same time cussing black man and extolling the virtues of "rich" Indians in Guyana.

These people have no fking shame.

No one needs to jump on any wagon. Clive Thomas among others ( Somdat and Gampat) also produced data shredding the myth of the rich Indian. There are lots of data on poverty in general and the reality that 40% of people in general are in extreme poverty ( living on less than 1.25 US a day) should be sobering. 

Guyana is no paradise, It is one of the poorest places on the planet despite our abundance of natural resources. Chalk that up to squabbles of the kind  we have presently where the reality of who is poor consumes useless energy and keep the racist fires lit ( which keeps us poor)

your 'rebuttal' lashing "the myth of the rich Indian" isan opportunistic straw man pulled out of your ass to shift attention away from the main point being made in iguana's first paragraph

the "squabbles" here you hilariously pretending to float above while slyly turning over and oxygenating the embers of "racist fires" EQUAL the malign efforts of Guyana's most famous fake 'pollster'

you remain, when all is said and done, a disgusting, DISHONEST little man, a preening, pretentious wannabe 'intellectual' with much to be modest about, always with a ready lie, on the margins, ever on the lookout for lil attention

g'wan suh

FM
Stormborn posted:

Shuman said none of the above. He said  that Indians constitute he largest number of people in poverty. This can be deduced given 4 in 10 of every Guyanese experience deep poverty with the highest rates of poverty in rural areas where Indians live deprived of consistent electricity, water supply etc  and where the money they earn is entirely dependent on husbandry. With sugar dead that for the Berbice area means they are in deep crap.

The reality is there are more impoverished Indians than the entire population of Amerindians. The number I see most often is that Amerindians are  around 60K of the population. Shuman also knows well  some 70 percent of our people are in extreme poverty with region 8 ( some 11k) living in almost 100 percent extreme poverty

well, i don't know what Shuman said; i point to what Bisram said that he said . . . feel free to support Bisram in his renderings but please at least try be forthright in telling us what you are doing

now señor straw man, "deduced" here is an interesting rubric with acres of empty space available to accommodate the political scampman, the race baiting demagogue armed with a 'statistics' of no real mathematics . . . owing much to a lawyered turn of phrase, mumbo-jumbo, invidious 'sociology' and, most important, a careful AVOIDANCE of mentioning/considering the "poverty" condition of the elephant in the room - the Black/mixed people of Guyana - EQUAL in numbers to the East Indian population

that's where MY "deduced" comes in . . . it's called a corollary

FM

Widespread poverty exists among all groups.  Indians have their equal share, as such the larger absolute numbers. 

PPPites deny because it exposes the failure of the PPP that after 23 years 40% still live in abject poverty.  PNCites deny it because it does not support their mantra that the PPP only took care of Indians and left Blacks. 

Now the PNC going down the same path. 

Guyana remains poor because of this attitude. Neither the PNC nor PPP are held accountable.  Their support base is still intact come hell or high water!

FM
Stormborn posted:

You are selling crap also that indians were given lands en mass. The few villages where this happened was in lieu of the planters not having to spend the money to repatriate them; monies already deducted from their earnings. On the berbice coast today, most indians do not own more than their house and the lot where it sits. 

Lands are consolidated in the hands of a few. That the face of the rich include a majority of indians does not  mean Indians are rich. It goes without saying that  many indians like to live in the reflected glow of success of  kind and brag on it as if it is an imprimatur of who they are in general. These basic  fact may have confused you

BTW, Ceres and Bishop were given some 200 acres of land each by the PNC that makes them richer ( land wise) in the courentyne than 90 percent of the Indians living there!

not sure where you do your 'shopping' señor straw man, but where exactly did i post that "[I]ndians were given lands en mass"?

liard much?

and sharpen up banna, "patrimony assets" are properly BIG strategic things like oil fields, impossibly large strategic land accumulation (not talking about house lots), broadcast spectrum, Amaila Falls gambit, etc . . . and we know who those individuals being gifted are

we are talking about a GROUND FLOOR criminal concentration of unearned wealth gifted to corrupt INDIVIDUALS who happen to be Indo-Guyanese . . . don't take my word for it, Ralph Ramkarran has, in the past, written quite eloquently on the Freedom House shenanigans that doubled for economic planning during the go-go years

oil money will make that shyte look like tiddlywinks if PPP wins the upcoming elections

and, let me be even more clear sir . . . you pointing to the masses of landless and poor Indians who are poor and landless just like their Afro counterparts DOES NOT disappear the fact that the East Indian political economy is (big picture/long term) advantaged by these corrupt acts of Jagdeo's PPP and the non-East Indian disadvantaged

i am not in the business of averting my eyes or a fool to be 'comforted' by a showing that the corruption produced a few "jobs" for Afro-Guyanese

further, i consider it an insult to the intelligence of ALL Guyanese you holding up 200 acres of land (each) supposedly 'given' (not sure what that means) to "Ceres and Bishop" as somehow 'equivalent' to the SYSTEMIC transfer of Guyana's wealth to a crew of Jagdeo's Indo cronies during a decade and a half of PPP tiefman rule

labbaesque

smfh

FM
Last edited by Former Member
Baseman posted:

Widespread poverty exists among all groups.  Indians have their equal share, as such the larger absolute numbers. 

PPPites deny because it exposes the failure of the PPP that after 23 years 40% still live in abject poverty.  PNCites deny it because it does not support their mantra that the PPP only took care of Indians and left Blacks.

tell us, what percentage of Afro/mixed Guyanese falls beneath the magic 'threshold' measuring 40% of Indos living in "abject poverty"?

if you don't know, then you need to shut up

FM
Last edited by Former Member
ronan posted:
Stormborn posted:
Iguana posted:

This whole ting wid Bisram is to create narrative fuh Rat Man and he friends who busy squealing about corruption by the coalition, and that black man getting rich by teefing state assets.

Funny to watch all the indian tribalists hay jump pan Bisram band wagon about "poor Indians" while at de same time cussing black man and extolling the virtues of "rich" Indians in Guyana.

These people have no fking shame.

No one needs to jump on any wagon. Clive Thomas among others ( Somdat and Gampat) also produced data shredding the myth of the rich Indian. There are lots of data on poverty in general and the reality that 40% of people in general are in extreme poverty ( living on less than 1.25 US a day) should be sobering. 

Guyana is no paradise, It is one of the poorest places on the planet despite our abundance of natural resources. Chalk that up to squabbles of the kind  we have presently where the reality of who is poor consumes useless energy and keep the racist fires lit ( which keeps us poor)

your 'rebuttal' lashing "the myth of the rich Indian" isan opportunistic straw man pulled out of your ass to shift attention away from the main point being made in iguana's first paragraph

the "squabbles" here you hilariously pretending to float above while slyly turning over and oxygenating the embers of "racist fires" EQUAL the malign efforts of Guyana's most famous fake 'pollster'

you remain, when all is said and done, a disgusting, DISHONEST little man, a preening, pretentious wannabe 'intellectual' with much to be modest about, always with a ready lie, on the margins, ever on the lookout for lil attention

g'wan suh

You find the facts uncomfortable so you presume it is to dissimulate. Unfortunately, unlike you I am not habituated to lesser values. The reality is that the majority of Indians like the Majority of all Guyanese live in grinding poverty. The average is around 1.75 dollars a day. 

When all is said and done, you are here to sell and idea that Indians are the predatory tribe sucking the life from the nation's blood stream and so responsible for all the nations malignancies.  Well, you need not be informed that racial values animate all aspects of our social and political life and these "habits" are the curse of the society itself.

Politically, the struggle of partisan shills like you is to control the narrative by planting small bits of disinformation into the social and political themes to motivate your  tribe to mobilize to grab the state. These "stories" are all about the project to capture the state as a prize for ones ethnic tribe.

The reality that Indians are as poor and crablike like Africans does not fit into your "story". And the majority live on the fringes of starvation is not my story but the statistical evidence told by every one measuring what happens in our society. 

FM
Stormborn posted:
ronan posted:
Stormborn posted:
Iguana posted:

This whole ting wid Bisram is to create narrative fuh Rat Man and he friends who busy squealing about corruption by the coalition, and that black man getting rich by teefing state assets.

Funny to watch all the indian tribalists hay jump pan Bisram band wagon about "poor Indians" while at de same time cussing black man and extolling the virtues of "rich" Indians in Guyana.

These people have no fking shame.

No one needs to jump on any wagon. Clive Thomas among others ( Somdat and Gampat) also produced data shredding the myth of the rich Indian. There are lots of data on poverty in general and the reality that 40% of people in general are in extreme poverty ( living on less than 1.25 US a day) should be sobering. 

Guyana is no paradise, It is one of the poorest places on the planet despite our abundance of natural resources. Chalk that up to squabbles of the kind  we have presently where the reality of who is poor consumes useless energy and keep the racist fires lit ( which keeps us poor)

your 'rebuttal' lashing "the myth of the rich Indian" is an opportunistic straw man pulled out of your ass to shift attention away from the main point being made in iguana's first paragraph

the "squabbles" here you hilariously pretending to float above while slyly turning over and oxygenating the embers of "racist fires" EQUAL the malign efforts of Guyana's most famous fake 'pollster'

you remain, when all is said and done, a disgusting, DISHONEST little man, a preening, pretentious wannabe 'intellectual' with much to be modest about, always with a ready lie, on the margins, ever on the lookout for lil attention

g'wan suh

When all is said and done, you are here to sell and idea that Indians are the predatory tribe sucking the life from the nation's blood stream and so responsible for all the nations malignancies. 

ahmmm . . . the angry ignorance bouncing around in your head, now deposited here thru your ass is not a proper substitute for rebuttal

next

FM
ronan posted:
Stormborn posted:

You are selling crap also that indians were given lands en mass. The few villages where this happened was in lieu of the planters not having to spend the money to repatriate them; monies already deducted from their earnings. On the berbice coast today, most indians do not own more than their house and the lot where it sits. 

Lands are consolidated in the hands of a few. That the face of the rich include a majority of indians does not  mean Indians are rich. It goes without saying that  many indians like to live in the reflected glow of success of  kind and brag on it as if it is an imprimatur of who they are in general. These basic  fact may have confused you

BTW, Ceres and Bishop were given some 200 acres of land each by the PNC that makes them richer ( land wise) in the courentyne than 90 percent of the Indians living there!

not sure where you do your 'shopping' señor straw man, but where exactly did i post that "[I]ndians were given lands en mass"?

liard much?

and sharpen up banna, "patrimony assets" are properly BIG strategic things like oil fields, impossibly large strategic land accumulation (not talking about house lots), broadcast spectrum, Amaila Falls gambit, etc . . . and we know who those individuals being gifted are

we are talking about a GROUND FLOOR criminal concentration of unearned wealth gifted to corrupt INDIVIDUALS who happen to be Indo-Guyanese . . . don't take my word for it, Ralph Ramkarran has, in the past, written quite eloquently on the Freedom House shenanigans that doubled for economic planning during the go-go years

oil money will make that shyte look like tiddlywinks if PPP wins the upcoming elections

and, let me be even more clear sir . . . you pointing to the masses of landless and poor Indians who are poor and landless just like their Afro counterparts DOES NOT disappear the fact that the East Indian political economy is (big picture/long term) advantaged by these corrupt acts of Jagdeo's PPP and the non-East Indian disadvantaged

i am not in the business of averting my eyes or a fool to be 'comforted' by a showing that the corruption produced a few "jobs" for Afro-Guyanese

further, i consider it an insult to the intelligence of ALL Guyanese you holding up 200 acres of land (each) supposedly 'given' (not sure what that means) to "Ceres and Bishop" as somehow 'equivalent' to the SYSTEMIC transfer of Guyana's wealth to a crew of Jagdeo's Indo cronies during a decade and a half of PPP tiefman rule

labbaesque

smfh

You did not say they are given lands en mass. I am simply consolidating the thrust of your messaging that some are given of the nations patrimony while other were not. I am just reminding the precise message ought to be that Indians were in general left high and dry by the colonials  no less than any other group.

I do not care to discuss Jagdeo's political practiced that disadvantaged blacks. I spoke to that enough as I spoke of LFSB's dictatorship or the Present Granger's practice of racism on steroids. These are the curse of our society and against which I  rage constantly. Here I am specifically addressing you as a disinformation agent who facilitate what happens at the political level.  Our people in general live and will continue to live in abject poverty  if we channel our energies into the blame the group game. 

I do not give a damn where you insist you will not avert your eyes. I care about your lies above concerning what Shuman said. You are being your usual disingenuous self and twisting the story to malign the man. Indians are indeed the most of our numerous poor. It does not mean others, because they are fewer in numbers, suffer less. Amerindians, almost in their entirety, suffer extreme poverty. As a percentage of their population African and Indians  are similarly affected. Do not let the concentration of wealth in the hands of a few twist the reality.

FM
ronan posted:
 
 ahmmm . . . the angry ignorance bouncing around in your head, now deposited here thru your ass is not a proper substitute for rebuttal

next

It did not take long to begin comparing your head size as evidence of your superiority in argumentation. Poor you. 

FM
Stormborn posted:
ronan posted:
 
 ahmmm . . . the angry ignorance bouncing around in your head, now deposited here thru your ass is not a proper substitute for rebuttal

next

It did not take long to begin comparing your head size as evidence of your superiority in argumentation. Poor you. 

lol

FM
ronan posted:
Baseman posted:

Widespread poverty exists among all groups.  Indians have their equal share, as such the larger absolute numbers. 

PPPites deny because it exposes the failure of the PPP that after 23 years 40% still live in abject poverty.  PNCites deny it because it does not support their mantra that the PPP only took care of Indians and left Blacks.

tell us, what percentage of Afro/mixed Guyanese falls beneath the magic 'threshold' measuring 40% of Indos living in "abject poverty"?

if you don't know, then you need to shut up

I do not have to tell you. Read for yourself Clive Thomas has a whole thesis on the subject. And since you do know then why the hell do you not use what you know to refute what I supposedly said in error. I am waiting....

FM
ronan posted:
Stormborn posted:
ronan posted:
 
 ahmmm . . . the angry ignorance bouncing around in your head, now deposited here thru your ass is not a proper substitute for rebuttal

next

It did not take long to begin comparing your head size as evidence of your superiority in argumentation. Poor you. 

lol

I guess you do have to snicker....like the real cripple in these matters. 

FM
Stormborn posted:
ronan posted:
Stormborn posted:
ronan posted:
 
 ahmmm . . . the angry ignorance bouncing around in your head, now deposited here thru your ass is not a proper substitute for rebuttal

next

It did not take long to begin comparing your head size as evidence of your superiority in argumentation. Poor you. 

lol

I guess you do have to snicker....like the real cripple in these matters. 

uh huh

FM
Stormborn posted:
ronan posted:
Stormborn posted:

You are selling crap also that indians were given lands en mass. The few villages where this happened was in lieu of the planters not having to spend the money to repatriate them; monies already deducted from their earnings. On the berbice coast today, most indians do not own more than their house and the lot where it sits. 

Lands are consolidated in the hands of a few. That the face of the rich include a majority of indians does not  mean Indians are rich. It goes without saying that  many indians like to live in the reflected glow of success of  kind and brag on it as if it is an imprimatur of who they are in general. These basic  fact may have confused you

BTW, Ceres and Bishop were given some 200 acres of land each by the PNC that makes them richer ( land wise) in the courentyne than 90 percent of the Indians living there!

not sure where you do your 'shopping' señor straw man, but where exactly did i post that "[I]ndians were given lands en mass"?

liard much?

and sharpen up banna, "patrimony assets" are properly BIG strategic things like oil fields, impossibly large strategic land accumulation (not talking about house lots), broadcast spectrum, Amaila Falls gambit, etc . . . and we know who those individuals being gifted are

we are talking about a GROUND FLOOR criminal concentration of unearned wealth gifted to corrupt INDIVIDUALS who happen to be Indo-Guyanese . . . don't take my word for it, Ralph Ramkarran has, in the past, written quite eloquently on the Freedom House shenanigans that doubled for economic planning during the go-go years

oil money will make that shyte look like tiddlywinks if PPP wins the upcoming elections

and, let me be even more clear sir . . . you pointing to the masses of landless and poor Indians who are poor and landless just like their Afro counterparts DOES NOT disappear the fact that the East Indian political economy is (big picture/long term) advantaged by these corrupt acts of Jagdeo's PPP and the non-East Indian disadvantaged

i am not in the business of averting my eyes or a fool to be 'comforted' by a showing that the corruption produced a few "jobs" for Afro-Guyanese

further, i consider it an insult to the intelligence of ALL Guyanese you holding up 200 acres of land (each) supposedly 'given' (not sure what that means) to "Ceres and Bishop" as somehow 'equivalent' to the SYSTEMIC transfer of Guyana's wealth to a crew of Jagdeo's Indo cronies during a decade and a half of PPP tiefman rule

labbaesque

smfh

You did not say they are given lands en mass. I am simply consolidating . . .

uh huh

FM
Stormborn posted:
ronan posted:
Baseman posted:

Widespread poverty exists among all groups.  Indians have their equal share, as such the larger absolute numbers. 

PPPites deny because it exposes the failure of the PPP that after 23 years 40% still live in abject poverty.  PNCites deny it because it does not support their mantra that the PPP only took care of Indians and left Blacks.

tell us, what percentage of Afro/mixed Guyanese falls beneath the magic 'threshold' measuring 40% of Indos living in "abject poverty"?

if you don't know, then you need to shut up

I do not have to tell you. Read for yourself Clive Thomas has a whole thesis on the subject. And since you do know then why the hell do you not use what you know to refute what I supposedly said in error. I am waiting....

waderass . . . stormborn = baseman?

oh sk0nt

FM
ronan posted:
 

You did not say they are given lands en mass. I am simply consolidating . . .

uh huh

I am not obliged to repeat your words. Words are the text but I care about the context from which you pretend they arise and the intended subtext that you wish to pass on.

Shuman did not say Indians are more poor than Amerindians or black people. That is you distorting to denigrate the man's grasp of our reality.

This is the  naked lie and the poison you wish to attribute to him "telling the world that Black people rule the economic roost in Guyana and Indos are at the bottom, behind Amerindians . . . sorta"

 

FM
ronan posted:
Stormborn posted:
ronan posted:
Baseman posted:

Widespread poverty exists among all groups.  Indians have their equal share, as such the larger absolute numbers. 

PPPites deny because it exposes the failure of the PPP that after 23 years 40% still live in abject poverty.  PNCites deny it because it does not support their mantra that the PPP only took care of Indians and left Blacks.

tell us, what percentage of Afro/mixed Guyanese falls beneath the magic 'threshold' measuring 40% of Indos living in "abject poverty"?

if you don't know, then you need to shut up

I do not have to tell you. Read for yourself Clive Thomas has a whole thesis on the subject. And since you do know then why the hell do you not use what you know to refute what I supposedly said in error. I am waiting....

waderass . . . stormborn = baseman?

oh sk0nt

Dummy....you can if you are as smart as you claim that is a mistake

Baseman is a burgundy suit wearing Indo. I am not that flamboyant. 

FM
Last edited by Former Member
Stormborn posted:
ronan posted:
 

You did not say they are given lands en mass. I am simply consolidating . . .

uh huh

This is the  naked lie and the poison you wish to attribute to him "telling the world that Black people rule the economic roost in Guyana and Indos are at the bottom, behind Amerindians . . . sorta"

non sequitur as regards the "lands en mass" lie you trying to run away from

but yes, that is the corollary . . . if Bisram is citing him correctly

well, is Bisram citing Shuman correctly?

FM
ronan posted:
Baseman posted:
ronan posted:

bai, all dem masses of poor-ass black people in Guyana the PPP tribals mekkin a living pouring scorn pan and laughing at are now scrambling around with fire stick looking for this magnificent ‘pan tap’ economic prosperity they ‘possess’ that Bisram juss wave he pen (wand?) and discover

smfh

PNC gave many Blacks land in the 70s/80s. Many Blacks sold their land to Indian farmers. So today, their kids have none

your ignar polemic notwithstanding,

i fail to understand why you insist on making my point for me and looking the fool

you seem confused

call a friend

Gaibank only gave blacks loans which was never paid back. Dey gat patrimony alright, free money.

S
Stormborn posted:
ronan posted:
Stormborn posted:
ronan posted:
Baseman posted:

Widespread poverty exists among all groups.  Indians have their equal share, as such the larger absolute numbers. 

PPPites deny because it exposes the failure of the PPP that after 23 years 40% still live in abject poverty.  PNCites deny it because it does not support their mantra that the PPP only took care of Indians and left Blacks.

tell us, what percentage of Afro/mixed Guyanese falls beneath the magic 'threshold' measuring 40% of Indos living in "abject poverty"?

if you don't know, then you need to shut up

I do not have to tell you. Read for yourself Clive Thomas has a whole thesis on the subject. And since you do know then why the hell do you not use what you know to refute what I supposedly said in error. I am waiting....

waderass . . . stormborn = baseman?

oh sk0nt

Dummy....you can if you are as smart as you claim that is a mistake

banna, that is one hell of a "mistake"!

get help

FM
ronan posted:
Baseman posted:

Widespread poverty exists among all groups.  Indians have their equal share, as such the larger absolute numbers. 

PPPites deny because it exposes the failure of the PPP that after 23 years 40% still live in abject poverty.  PNCites deny it because it does not support their mantra that the PPP only took care of Indians and left Blacks.

tell us, what percentage of Afro/mixed Guyanese falls beneath the magic 'threshold' measuring 40% of Indos living in "abject poverty"?

if you don't know, then you need to shut up

Dumb fk, did I say 40% Indians or 40% Guyanese?   to your question Afros, I think 80% and if I believe it was 90% in 1992!

The wealth of the Putagee, Chinese and Amerindians made up the difference!

FM
ronan posted:

banna, that is one hell of a "mistake"!

get help

we are all not as smart as you are. If indeed help was necessary you would be the last one I would be taking advice from....Guess this thread has worn itself out.

FM
Baseman posted:
ronan posted:
Baseman posted:

Widespread poverty exists among all groups.  Indians have their equal share, as such the larger absolute numbers. 

PPPites deny because it exposes the failure of the PPP that after 23 years 40% still live in abject poverty.  PNCites deny it because it does not support their mantra that the PPP only took care of Indians and left Blacks.

tell us, what percentage of Afro/mixed Guyanese falls beneath the magic 'threshold' measuring 40% of Indos living in "abject poverty"?

if you don't know, then you need to shut up

Dumb fk, did I say 40% Indians or 40% Guyanese?   to your question Afros, I think 80% and if I believe it was 90% in 1992!

The wealth of the Putagee, Chinese and Amerindians made up the difference!

hmmmm . . .?

apologies for my mis-read

now, tell stormborn to to take his meds and stop posting as you

it's not a good fit

FM
Stormborn posted:
ronan posted:

banna, that is one hell of a "mistake"!

get help

Guess this thread has worn itself out.

nah . . . this thread needs to live

so people can see and know

you got some serious head issues banna

FM
Last edited by Former Member
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