Almost two weeks-No word from President yet on Gecom nominees.

Topics

Django

September 6,2017

Almost two weeks since he submitted a third list of nominees for the position of Chairman of the Guyana Elections Commission (Gecom), Opposition Leader Bharrat Jagdeo is still awaiting word on President David Granger’s decision.

“Nothing yet,” Jagdeo said, when contacted for an update by Stabroek News.

Last week Thursday, Granger had said that he was “critically” examining the third list and a decision should not be expected before yesterday, since he had to discuss the list with Cabinet. “I don’t make these decisions without advice and I will discuss this matter with my colleagues. It certainly will not be before the next Cabinet meeting, which will be held on Tuesday (next),” he said.

Cabinet met yesterday but there was no word from the government on if the matter was discussed.

Jagdeo’s newest list comprises Joe Singh, a retired Guyana Defence Force Major General who previously held the post of Gecom Chairman; former long-serving magistrate Krisndat Persaud; attorneys Teni Housty and Sanjeev Datadin; pilot and biodiversity advocate Annette Arjoon-Martins; and Adventist pastor and agriculturalist Onesi La Fleur. Singh is heavily favoured, sources say.

The post has been vacant since February, when long-serving chairman Dr. Steve Surujbally resigned. Surujbally held that position for 15 years.

The President had rejected Jagdeo’s two previous lists.

Article 161 (2) of the Constitution states: “Subject to the provisions of paragraph (4), the Chairman of the Elections Commission shall be a person who holds or who has held office as a judge of a court having unlimited jurisdiction in civil and criminal matters in some part of the Commonwealth or a court having jurisdiction in appeals from any such court or who is qualified to be appointed as any such judge, or any other fit and proper person, to be appointed by the President from a list of six persons, not unacceptable to the President, submitted by the Leader of the Opposition after meaningful consultation with the non-governmental political parties represented in the National Assembly.”

The nominees on Jagdeo’s first list, submitted in December last year, were Major General (ret’d) Norman McLean; Attorney and Chartered Accountant Christopher Ram; Business Executive Ramesh Dookhoo; Governance and Conflict Resolution Specialist Lawrence Lachmansingh; Indian Rights Activist Ryhaan Shah; and History Professor Dr James Rose.

After Granger rejected the first list, Jagdeo nominated former appellate judge B S Roy, former High Court Justice William Ramlal, former magistrate and now practising attorney Oneidge Walrond-Allicock, attorneys Kashir Khan and Nadia Sagar and former Guyana Defence Force Captain and businessman Gerald Gouveia for the post.

At a subsequent meeting, Granger and Jagdeo agreed on the submission of a third list.

In a press statement about the third submission, Jagdeo referred to the previous rejections as well as a subsequent meeting with the President at State House on June 12, 2017, where it was agreed that a high-level exploratory committee would be established to ensure a selection if a third list was rejected. He explained that though the committee was never activated by the government, he went ahead with “… elaborate and protracted consultations which lasted several weeks with various stakeholders.”

Jagdeo said that during this process, he solicited views and sought nominations in efforts to ensure that six names who satisfy the requirements contemplated by Article 161(2) of the Constitution were submitted to the president.

Replies sorted oldest to newest

Former Member

What's a couple of days more before the third disappointment?

9/6/1710:53 AM

NehruBig Mouth Member

GADAHA gone Ah PASTURE TO bRAY!!!!!!!!

9/6/1711:12 AM

Former Member

A long wait means that Brigadier Granger is not ready for Major General Joe Singh. Too big to handle. Not malleable. Plain and simple.

9/6/1711:52 AM

Bibi HaniffaGNI Queen

I don't understand why Jagdeo teking this man seriously. I woulda give him three names from the first list and three from the second list, wid a lil note that says - Hey, two can play that game!!

9/6/171:16 PM

Former Member

Granger is acting like fool he should make his decision know we do not need a next ppp style government in power

9/6/171:27 PM

Former Member

Granger's first term in office after 23 years of PPP rule is to set the foundation for PNC to reign indefinitely. The delaying tactic meant no love for the PPP, but himself and his party.

9/6/173:30 PM

MitwahSenior Member

How long did the fake Dacta teck to come up wid de list?

9/6/173:47 PM

DjangoAdmin

Prince posted:
Granger's first term in office after 23 years of PPP rule is to set the foundation for PNC to reign indefinitely. The delaying tactic meant no love for the PPP, but himself and his party.

Bhai,

wha wrang with you "PNC" willn't be anchored in there forever they can't win on their own,wan two term with the Coalition yes,the people will decide their faith,this time na lang time.

9/6/173:51 PM

Former Member

Django posted:
Prince posted:
Granger's first term in office after 23 years of PPP rule is to set the foundation for PNC to reign indefinitely. The delaying tactic meant no love for the PPP, but himself and his party.
Bhai,
wha wrang with you PNC willn't be anchored in there forever,wan two term yes,the people will decide their faith,this time na lang time.

Who decided the PNC faith in 2015, the people or Washington, DC?

9/6/173:55 PM

DjangoAdmin

Prince posted:
Django posted:
Prince posted:
Granger's first term in office after 23 years of PPP rule is to set the foundation for PNC to reign indefinitely. The delaying tactic meant no love for the PPP, but himself and his party.
Bhai,
wha wrang with you PNC willn't be anchored in there forever,wan two term yes,the people will decide their faith,this time na lang time.
Who decided the PNC faith in 2015, the people or Washington, DC?

The current Government is an "Multi Party Coalition".

9/6/173:58 PM

Former Member

Django posted:
Prince posted:
Django posted:
Prince posted:
Granger's first term in office after 23 years of PPP rule is to set the foundation for PNC to reign indefinitely. The delaying tactic meant no love for the PPP, but himself and his party.
Bhai,
wha wrang with you PNC willn't be anchored in there forever,wan two term yes,the people will decide their faith,this time na lang time.
Who decided the PNC faith in 2015, the people or Washington, DC?
The current Government is an "Multi Party Coalition".

I didn't ask you that question, Django.

9/6/174:02 PM

NehruBig Mouth Member

Django posted:
Prince posted:
Django posted:
Prince posted:
Granger's first term in office after 23 years of PPP rule is to set the foundation for PNC to reign indefinitely. The delaying tactic meant no love for the PPP, but himself and his party.
Bhai,
wha wrang with you PNC willn't be anchored in there forever,wan two term yes,the people will decide their faith,this time na lang time.
Who decided the PNC faith in 2015, the people or Washington, DC?
The current Government is an "Multi Party Coalition".

Oh, It was you who bought the Brooklyn Bridge. Stupidee Bill.

9/6/174:04 PM

DjangoAdmin

Nehru posted:
Django posted:
Prince posted:
Django posted:
Prince posted:
Granger's first term in office after 23 years of PPP rule is to set the foundation for PNC to reign indefinitely. The delaying tactic meant no love for the PPP, but himself and his party.
Bhai,
wha wrang with you PNC willn't be anchored in there forever,wan two term yes,the people will decide their faith,this time na lang time.
Who decided the PNC faith in 2015, the people or Washington, DC?
The current Government is an "Multi Party Coalition".
Oh, It was you who bought the Brooklyn Bridge. Stupidee Bill.

Bhai,

the cap fits,look in the mirror.

9/6/174:08 PM

GTAnglerSenior Member

Django posted:
Nehru posted:
Django posted:
Prince posted:
Django posted:
Prince posted:
Granger's first term in office after 23 years of PPP rule is to set the foundation for PNC to reign indefinitely. The delaying tactic meant no love for the PPP, but himself and his party.
Bhai,
wha wrang with you PNC willn't be anchored in there forever,wan two term yes,the people will decide their faith,this time na lang time.
Who decided the PNC faith in 2015, the people or Washington, DC?
The current Government is an "Multi Party Coalition".
Oh, It was you who bought the Brooklyn Bridge. Stupidee Bill.
Bhai,
the cap fits,look in the mirror.

He'll probably scare himself to death....

9/6/174:13 PM

NehruBig Mouth Member

Both of you are DUMB to the bone so nothing will get through your thick heads fill with FILTH.

9/6/174:14 PM

GTAnglerSenior Member

Nehru posted:
Both of you are DUMB to the bone so nothing will get through your thick heads fill with FILTH.

Tek it easy........sarry ah call yuh ugly.

9/6/174:18 PM

Bibi HaniffaGNI Queen

Prince posted:
Django posted:
Prince posted:
Granger's first term in office after 23 years of PPP rule is to set the foundation for PNC to reign indefinitely. The delaying tactic meant no love for the PPP, but himself and his party.
Bhai,
wha wrang with you PNC willn't be anchored in there forever,wan two term yes,the people will decide their faith,this time na lang time.
Who decided the PNC faith in 2015, the people or Washington, DC?

In 1964 the PPP was ousted because they became friends with Cuba. In 2015 the PPP was ousted because they became friends with Venezuela.

[Advice to PPP: Don't become friends with any leftist country and you rule for life.]

9/6/174:19 PM

NehruBig Mouth Member

GTAngler posted:
Nehru posted:
Both of you are DUMB to the bone so nothing will get through your thick heads fill with FILTH.
Tek it easy........sarry ah call yuh ugly.

You sorry for calling me ugly. Are you stupid, girly or both?? Stupidee Bill fuh real.

9/6/174:20 PM

DjangoAdmin

GTAngler posted:
Nehru posted:
Both of you are DUMB to the bone so nothing will get through your thick heads fill with FILTH.
Tek it easy........sarry ah call yuh ugly.

9/6/174:21 PM

MarsSenior Member

Bibi Haniffa posted:
Prince posted:
Django posted:
Prince posted:
Granger's first term in office after 23 years of PPP rule is to set the foundation for PNC to reign indefinitely. The delaying tactic meant no love for the PPP, but himself and his party.
Bhai,
wha wrang with you PNC willn't be anchored in there forever,wan two term yes,the people will decide their faith,this time na lang time.
Who decided the PNC faith in 2015, the people or Washington, DC?
In 1964 the PPP was ousted because they became friends with Cuba. In 2015 the PPP was ousted because they became friends with Venezuela.
[Advice to PPP: Don't become friends with any leftist country and you rule for life.]

The PPP wasn't ousted in 2015 for being friends with Venezuela. That's a load of balderdash that you people peddle to excuse your shortcomings. They were ousted because people got fed up of their corrupt and murderous ways and voted them out. The writing was on the wall since 2011 when you failed to get a majority of the electorate. Guyanese people sit and take shit from their governments for a long time but after a time it's only so much they can take.

9/6/174:24 PM

GTAnglerSenior Member

Nehru posted:
GTAngler posted:
Nehru posted:
Both of you are DUMB to the bone so nothing will get through your thick heads fill with FILTH.
Tek it easy........sarry ah call yuh ugly.
You sorry for calling me ugly. Are you stupid, girly or both?? Stupidee Bill fuh real.

Well you took offence when I said that you'd PROBABLY scare yourself if you looked in a mirror insinuating that you might not be pleasant to the eye. The fact that it seems to really bother you tells me I was right.

9/6/174:25 PM

NehruBig Mouth Member

I took offense??? I simply described two Stupidee Bills who were born with FILTH in their heads. Facts Baby Facts!!!

9/6/174:28 PM

GTAnglerSenior Member

Nehru posted:
I took offense??? I simply described two Stupidee Bills who were born with FILTH in their heads. Facts Baby Facts!!!

Ah tell yuh I ent pun that itation. Don't call me baby......

9/6/174:29 PM

Bibi HaniffaGNI Queen

Mars posted:
Bibi Haniffa posted:
Prince posted:
Django posted:
Prince posted:
Granger's first term in office after 23 years of PPP rule is to set the foundation for PNC to reign indefinitely. The delaying tactic meant no love for the PPP, but himself and his party.
Bhai,
wha wrang with you PNC willn't be anchored in there forever,wan two term yes,the people will decide their faith,this time na lang time.
Who decided the PNC faith in 2015, the people or Washington, DC?
In 1964 the PPP was ousted because they became friends with Cuba. In 2015 the PPP was ousted because they became friends with Venezuela.
[Advice to PPP: Don't become friends with any leftist country and you rule for life.]
The PPP wasn't ousted in 2015 for being friends with Venezuela. That's a load of balderdash that you people peddle to excuse your shortcomings. They were ousted because people got fed up of their corrupt and murderous ways and voted them out. The writing was on the wall since 2011 when you failed to get a majority of the electorate. Guyanese people sit and take shit from their governments for a long time but after a time it's only so much they can take.

The PNC can never ever win any free and fair election against the PPP. 1964 and 2015 were both coalitions orchestrated by Massa Joe! As soon as the coalition govt took power in 2015, dem Brooklyn boys and girls were lining up in front of the Venezuelan embassy singing - not one curass, not a blade ah grass.

9/6/174:32 PM

MarsSenior Member

Bibi Haniffa posted:
Mars posted:
Bibi Haniffa posted:
Prince posted:
Django posted:
Prince posted:
Granger's first term in office after 23 years of PPP rule is to set the foundation for PNC to reign indefinitely. The delaying tactic meant no love for the PPP, but himself and his party.
Bhai,
wha wrang with you PNC willn't be anchored in there forever,wan two term yes,the people will decide their faith,this time na lang time.
Who decided the PNC faith in 2015, the people or Washington, DC?
In 1964 the PPP was ousted because they became friends with Cuba. In 2015 the PPP was ousted because they became friends with Venezuela.
[Advice to PPP: Don't become friends with any leftist country and you rule for life.]
The PPP wasn't ousted in 2015 for being friends with Venezuela. That's a load of balderdash that you people peddle to excuse your shortcomings. They were ousted because people got fed up of their corrupt and murderous ways and voted them out. The writing was on the wall since 2011 when you failed to get a majority of the electorate. Guyanese people sit and take shit from their governments for a long time but after a time it's only so much they can take.
The PNC can never ever win any free and fair election against the PPP. 1964 and 2015 were both coalitions orchestrated by Massa Joe! As soon as the coalition govt took power in 2015, dem Brooklyn boys and girls were lining up in front of the Venezuelan embassy singing - not one curass, not a blade of grass.

The PNC has a smaller base than the PPP so of course it's difficult for them to win on their own. However, the PPP no longer has a majority of the electorate under their spell to follow them blindly so a coalition of the other parties is evenly matched against the PPP. It has nothing to do with any Massa. Take your licks like a man, regroup and come back without your corruptocrats and maybe you can win again. 2015 just happened to be the year that Exxon announced that they found oil off Guyana's coast. The Venezuelans want to own that oil and three quarters of Guyana so they ramped up their claims to Guyana's territory and resources. The Brooklyn people were doing their duty as patriotic Guyana to oppose Venezuela's aggressive behavior against Guyana. It's a pity that the PPP are behaving like traitors and want to sleep with the enemy. Yes, Venezuelans are no friends to Guyana. They want to take what we own by hook or by crook.

9/6/174:41 PM

MitwahSenior Member

Bibi Haniffa posted:
Prince posted:
Django posted:
Prince posted:
Granger's first term in office after 23 years of PPP rule is to set the foundation for PNC to reign indefinitely. The delaying tactic meant no love for the PPP, but himself and his party.
Bhai,
wha wrang with you PNC willn't be anchored in there forever,wan two term yes,the people will decide their faith,this time na lang time.
Who decided the PNC faith in 2015, the people or Washington, DC?
In 1964 the PPP was ousted because they became friends with Cuba. In 2015 the PPP was ousted because they became friends with Venezuela.
[Advice to PPP: Don't become friends with any leftist country and you rule for life.]

Your Country will keep the PPP out of power again for the oil.

9/6/174:48 PM

GTAnglerSenior Member

Mars posted:
Bibi Haniffa posted:
Mars posted:
Bibi Haniffa posted:
Prince posted:
Django posted:
Prince posted:
Granger's first term in office after 23 years of PPP rule is to set the foundation for PNC to reign indefinitely. The delaying tactic meant no love for the PPP, but himself and his party.
Bhai,
wha wrang with you PNC willn't be anchored in there forever,wan two term yes,the people will decide their faith,this time na lang time.
Who decided the PNC faith in 2015, the people or Washington, DC?
In 1964 the PPP was ousted because they became friends with Cuba. In 2015 the PPP was ousted because they became friends with Venezuela.
[Advice to PPP: Don't become friends with any leftist country and you rule for life.]
The PPP wasn't ousted in 2015 for being friends with Venezuela. That's a load of balderdash that you people peddle to excuse your shortcomings. They were ousted because people got fed up of their corrupt and murderous ways and voted them out. The writing was on the wall since 2011 when you failed to get a majority of the electorate. Guyanese people sit and take shit from their governments for a long time but after a time it's only so much they can take.
The PNC can never ever win any free and fair election against the PPP. 1964 and 2015 were both coalitions orchestrated by Massa Joe! As soon as the coalition govt took power in 2015, dem Brooklyn boys and girls were lining up in front of the Venezuelan embassy singing - not one curass, not a blade of grass.
The PNC has a smaller base than the PPP so of course it's difficult for them to win on their own. However, the PPP no longer has a majority of the electorate under their spell to follow them blindly so a coalition of the other parties is evenly matched against the PPP. It has nothing to do with any Massa. Take your licks like a man, regroup and come back without your corruptocrats and maybe you can win again. 2015 just happened to be the year that Exxon announced that they found oil off Guyana's coast. The Venezuelans want to own that oil and three quarters of Guyana so they ramped up their claims to Guyana's territory and resources. The Brooklyn people were doing their duty as patriotic Guyana to oppose Venezuela's aggressive behavior against Guyana. It's a pity that the PPP are behaving like traitors and want to sleep with the enemy. Yes, Venezuelans are no friends to Guyana. They want to take what we own by hook or by crook.

On point.

9/6/174:48 PM

Bibi HaniffaGNI Queen

Mars posted:
Bibi Haniffa posted:
Mars posted:
Bibi Haniffa posted:
Prince posted:
Django posted:
Prince posted:
Granger's first term in office after 23 years of PPP rule is to set the foundation for PNC to reign indefinitely. The delaying tactic meant no love for the PPP, but himself and his party.
Bhai,
wha wrang with you PNC willn't be anchored in there forever,wan two term yes,the people will decide their faith,this time na lang time.
Who decided the PNC faith in 2015, the people or Washington, DC?
In 1964 the PPP was ousted because they became friends with Cuba. In 2015 the PPP was ousted because they became friends with Venezuela.
[Advice to PPP: Don't become friends with any leftist country and you rule for life.]
The PPP wasn't ousted in 2015 for being friends with Venezuela. That's a load of balderdash that you people peddle to excuse your shortcomings. They were ousted because people got fed up of their corrupt and murderous ways and voted them out. The writing was on the wall since 2011 when you failed to get a majority of the electorate. Guyanese people sit and take shit from their governments for a long time but after a time it's only so much they can take.
The PNC can never ever win any free and fair election against the PPP. 1964 and 2015 were both coalitions orchestrated by Massa Joe! As soon as the coalition govt took power in 2015, dem Brooklyn boys and girls were lining up in front of the Venezuelan embassy singing - not one curass, not a blade of grass.
The PNC has a smaller base than the PPP so of course it's difficult for them to win on their own. However, the PPP no longer has a majority of the electorate under their spell to follow them blindly so a coalition of the other parties is evenly matched against the PPP. It has nothing to do with any Massa. Take your licks like a man, regroup and come back without your corruptocrats and maybe you can win again. 2015 just happened to be the year that Exxon announced that they found oil off Guyana's coast. The Venezuelans want to own that oil and three quarters of Guyana so they ramped up their claims to Guyana's territory and resources. The Brooklyn people were doing their duty as patriotic Guyana to oppose Venezuela's aggressive behavior against Guyana. It's a pity that the PPP are behaving like traitors and want to sleep with the enemy. Yes, Venezuelans are no friends to Guyana. They want to take what we own by hook or by crook.2015 just happened to be the year that Exxon announced that they found oil off Guyana's coast.

"2015 just happened to be the year that Exxon announced that they found oil off Guyana's coast." Strange coincidence that???

And if Venezuela wanted to take Guyana by hook or by crook it would not have been a 200 year old story. Dem woulda use dem hook and crook and today you woulda been hablando espanol ahora!

9/6/174:50 PM

MarsSenior Member

Bibi Haniffa posted:
Mars posted:
Bibi Haniffa posted:
Mars posted:
Bibi Haniffa posted:
Prince posted:
Django posted:
Prince posted:
Granger's first term in office after 23 years of PPP rule is to set the foundation for PNC to reign indefinitely. The delaying tactic meant no love for the PPP, but himself and his party.
Bhai,
wha wrang with you PNC willn't be anchored in there forever,wan two term yes,the people will decide their faith,this time na lang time.
Who decided the PNC faith in 2015, the people or Washington, DC?
In 1964 the PPP was ousted because they became friends with Cuba. In 2015 the PPP was ousted because they became friends with Venezuela.
[Advice to PPP: Don't become friends with any leftist country and you rule for life.]
The PPP wasn't ousted in 2015 for being friends with Venezuela. That's a load of balderdash that you people peddle to excuse your shortcomings. They were ousted because people got fed up of their corrupt and murderous ways and voted them out. The writing was on the wall since 2011 when you failed to get a majority of the electorate. Guyanese people sit and take shit from their governments for a long time but after a time it's only so much they can take.
The PNC can never ever win any free and fair election against the PPP. 1964 and 2015 were both coalitions orchestrated by Massa Joe! As soon as the coalition govt took power in 2015, dem Brooklyn boys and girls were lining up in front of the Venezuelan embassy singing - not one curass, not a blade of grass.
The PNC has a smaller base than the PPP so of course it's difficult for them to win on their own. However, the PPP no longer has a majority of the electorate under their spell to follow them blindly so a coalition of the other parties is evenly matched against the PPP. It has nothing to do with any Massa. Take your licks like a man, regroup and come back without your corruptocrats and maybe you can win again. 2015 just happened to be the year that Exxon announced that they found oil off Guyana's coast. The Venezuelans want to own that oil and three quarters of Guyana so they ramped up their claims to Guyana's territory and resources. The Brooklyn people were doing their duty as patriotic Guyana to oppose Venezuela's aggressive behavior against Guyana. It's a pity that the PPP are behaving like traitors and want to sleep with the enemy. Yes, Venezuelans are no friends to Guyana. They want to take what we own by hook or by crook.2015 just happened to be the year that Exxon announced that they found oil off Guyana's coast.
"2015 just happened to be the year that Exxon announced that they found oil off Guyana's coast." Strange coincidence that???
And if Venezuela wanted to take Guyana by hook or by crook it would not have been a 200 year old story. Dem woulda use dem hook and crook and today you would been hablando espanol!

They are using by hook and by crook to take most of what belongs to us. If we weren't fighting them diplomatically in the international arena, they would probably be there already. We can't depend on y'all rotten ropes in the PPP who would sell out our country to Venezuela just for spite because you got your ass whopped at the polls. We must fight the good fight and not let the bullies invade and take what belongs to us. Not a blade of grass!

9/6/174:56 PM

Bibi HaniffaGNI Queen

What did Venezuela take from Guyana? And by the way The Schomburgk Line proves that land belongs to Venezuela but the superpower of the day got the Tribunal in 1899 to rule in their favor. Then British Prime Minister, Robert Gascoyne-Cecil was the powerhouse of the world. Churchill later made his famous statement - the sun never set on the British empire. Read yuh history bannas!

9/6/175:07 PM

Bibi HaniffaGNI Queen

"The Venezuelan government showed almost immediate disapproval with the 1899 Arbitral Award. As early as October 7, 1899 Venezuela voiced her condemnation of the Award, and demanded the renegotiation of her eastern border with British Guiana: that day, Venezuelan Foreign Minister José Andrade made clear that the Arbitral Award was the product of political collusion and it should not be adhered to by Venezuela. After numerous bilateral diplomatic attempts failed to convince Great Britain of her seriousness to nullify the award, Venezuela denounced it before the first assembly of the United Nations, in 1945.^"

9/6/175:14 PM

MarsSenior Member

Bibi Haniffa posted:
"The Venezuelan government showed almost immediate disapproval with the 1899 Arbitral Award. As early as October 7, 1899 Venezuela voiced her condemnation of the Award, and demanded the renegotiation of her eastern border with British Guiana: that day, Venezuelan Foreign Minister José Andrade made clear that the Arbitral Award was the product of political collusion and it should not be adhered to by Venezuela. After numerous bilateral diplomatic attempts failed to convince Great Britain of her seriousness to nullify the award, Venezuela denounced it before the first assembly of the United Nations, in 1945.^"

What nonsense are you bringing up now that there is proof of the land belonging to Venezuela? That's one good reason why you people should be left to languish in the opposition. You traitors will sell out our country to Madburro and his henchmen. Venezuela accepted the 1899 award as final for many decades until some jackass brought up a Nancy story in the 1940's claiming that there was collusion between the judges in 1899. Even in the face of that allegation, Venezuela accepted the 1899 ruling as binding until 1962. Look go and read your history. Even PPP stalwart Mr. Ishmael knows better than you traitors who are willing to hand over the country to Venezuela.

http://www.coha.org/guyana-ven...itral-award-of-1899/

Excerpts from the article -

The tribunal and the award

The arbitral tribunal was finally set up in 1898 and began to receive written submissions from Venezuela and Great Britain. Oral presentations were made by the legal team on each side from June to September 1899 and finally, on October 3, the tribunal announced its award by upholding Great Britain’s ownership of most of the claimed territory west of the Essequibo River but denying the British entitlement to the upper Cuyuni basin and an area of land on the eastern bank near the mouth of the Orinoco River. Thus ended the dispute which had existed since 1840.

The territory awarded to the British (on behalf of colonial British Guiana) included a 4,000 square-mile block south of the Pakaraima Mountains bordered by the Cotinga River on the west, the Takutu River on the south and the Ireng River on the east and north. (This portion of territory, originally claimed by Venezuela in its case before the arbitral tribunal, was awarded to Brazil on June 6, 1904, following another arbitration conducted by the King of Italy after the Brazilian government claimed ownership based on historical occupation. When Venezuela in 1962 renewed its claim to the territory west of the Essequibo River on its alleged grounds that the 1899 award was null and void, that nation did not make any claim—and has never since made any—to that section of territory awarded to Brazil.)

Both Venezuela and Great Britain accepted the award of the tribunal and, in keeping with it, a mixed boundary commission appointed jointly by the two countries, carried out a survey and demarcation, between 1901 and 1905, of the boundary as stipulated by the award with an adjustment based on the British Guiana-Brazilian arbitration award.

The resulting boundary line was set out on a map signed by the boundary commissioners in Georgetown, British Guiana, on January 7, 1905. A separate agreement signed three days later by the commissioners stipulated: “That they regard this agreement as having a perfectly official character with respect to the acts and rights of both governments in the territory demarcated. . .” [Agreement Between the British and Venezuelan Boundary Commissioners with Regard to the Map of the Boundary, January 10, 1905]

Twenty-six years later, in 1931, a boundary commission made up of representatives from Great Britain, Venezuela and Brazil made special astronomical, geodesical and topographical observations on Mount Roraima so as to fix the specific point where the boundaries of Brazil, Venezuela and British Guiana should meet. Diplomatic notes were exchanged among the three nations on October 7 and November 3, 1932, by which they expressed agreement on the specific location of the tri-junction meeting point of the boundaries. A concrete pyramid marker was soon after erected there. The matter of the border was then considered permanently settled.

Significantly, by its rejection of the 1899 arbitral award, Venezuela has also unilaterally thrown out its own tripartite agreement of 1932 with Brazil that the peak of Mount Roraima forms the meeting point of the boundaries between those countries and Guyana.

Venezuela’s renewed claim

It was clear that Venezuela had accepted the 1899 award as a final settlement of the border dispute. Even as late as 1941, the Venezuelan minister of foreign affairs, Esteban Gil Borges, agreed that the frontier with British Guiana was well defined and was a closed issue.

Indeed in that year, Borges told the British representative in Caracas that his government was definitely of the opinion that the boundary question was a chose jugeé, that the Venezuelan‑British Guiana frontier was final and well defined, and that the author of articles in the Venezuelan press about that time, questioning the 1899 award, “had obviously never had access to the archives of his ministry.” [Guyana Journal, Vol. 1, No. 2, December 1968]

9/6/176:49 PM

DjangoAdmin

It's unbelievable some Guyanese can be come traitors,just because their party is out of power.

9/6/177:28 PM

Former Member

Mars posted:
Bibi Haniffa posted:
"The Venezuelan government showed almost immediate disapproval with the 1899 Arbitral Award. As early as October 7, 1899 Venezuela voiced her condemnation of the Award, and demanded the renegotiation of her eastern border with British Guiana: that day, Venezuelan Foreign Minister José Andrade made clear that the Arbitral Award was the product of political collusion and it should not be adhered to by Venezuela. After numerous bilateral diplomatic attempts failed to convince Great Britain of her seriousness to nullify the award, Venezuela denounced it before the first assembly of the United Nations, in 1945.^"
What nonsense are you bringing up now that there is proof of the land belonging to Venezuela? That's one good reason why you people should be left to languish in the opposition. You traitors will sell out our country to Madburro and his henchmen. Venezuela accepted the 1899 award as final for many decades until some jackass brought up a Nancy story in the 1940's claiming that there was collusion between the judges in 1899. Even in the face of that allegation, Venezuela accepted the 1899 ruling as binding until 1962. Look go and read your history. Even PPP stalwart Mr. Ishmael knows better than you traitors who are willing to hand over the country to Venezuela.
http://www.coha.org/guyana-ven...itral-award-of-1899/
Excerpts from the article -
The tribunal and the award
The arbitral tribunal was finally set up in 1898 and began to receive written submissions from Venezuela and Great Britain. Oral presentations were made by the legal team on each side from June to September 1899 and finally, on October 3, the tribunal announced its award by upholding Great Britain’s ownership of most of the claimed territory west of the Essequibo River but denying the British entitlement to the upper Cuyuni basin and an area of land on the eastern bank near the mouth of the Orinoco River. Thus ended the dispute which had existed since 1840.
The territory awarded to the British (on behalf of colonial British Guiana) included a 4,000 square-mile block south of the Pakaraima Mountains bordered by the Cotinga River on the west, the Takutu River on the south and the Ireng River on the east and north. (This portion of territory, originally claimed by Venezuela in its case before the arbitral tribunal, was awarded to Brazil on June 6, 1904, following another arbitration conducted by the King of Italy after the Brazilian government claimed ownership based on historical occupation. When Venezuela in 1962 renewed its claim to the territory west of the Essequibo River on its alleged grounds that the 1899 award was null and void, that nation did not make any claim—and has never since made any—to that section of territory awarded to Brazil.)
Both Venezuela and Great Britain accepted the award of the tribunal and, in keeping with it, a mixed boundary commission appointed jointly by the two countries, carried out a survey and demarcation, between 1901 and 1905, of the boundary as stipulated by the award with an adjustment based on the British Guiana-Brazilian arbitration award.
The resulting boundary line was set out on a map signed by the boundary commissioners in Georgetown, British Guiana, on January 7, 1905. A separate agreement signed three days later by the commissioners stipulated: “That they regard this agreement as having a perfectly official character with respect to the acts and rights of both governments in the territory demarcated. . .” [Agreement Between the British and Venezuelan Boundary Commissioners with Regard to the Map of the Boundary, January 10, 1905]
Twenty-six years later, in 1931, a boundary commission made up of representatives from Great Britain, Venezuela and Brazil made special astronomical, geodesical and topographical observations on Mount Roraima so as to fix the specific point where the boundaries of Brazil, Venezuela and British Guiana should meet. Diplomatic notes were exchanged among the three nations on October 7 and November 3, 1932, by which they expressed agreement on the specific location of the tri-junction meeting point of the boundaries. A concrete pyramid marker was soon after erected there. The matter of the border was then considered permanently settled.
Significantly, by its rejection of the 1899 arbitral award, Venezuela has also unilaterally thrown out its own tripartite agreement of 1932 with Brazil that the peak of Mount Roraima forms the meeting point of the boundaries between those countries and Guyana.
Venezuela’s renewed claim
It was clear that Venezuela had accepted the 1899 award as a final settlement of the border dispute. Even as late as 1941, the Venezuelan minister of foreign affairs, Esteban Gil Borges, agreed that the frontier with British Guiana was well defined and was a closed issue.
Indeed in that year, Borges told the British representative in Caracas that his government was definitely of the opinion that the boundary question was a chose jugeé, that the Venezuelan‑British Guiana frontier was final and well defined, and that the author of articles in the Venezuelan press about that time, questioning the 1899 award, “had obviously never had access to the archives of his ministry.” [Guyana Journal, Vol. 1, No. 2, December 1968]

I don't want to sound unpatriotic, but Bibi does have a point. The Venezuelans view the 1899 as being strong armed by the then superpowers, UK, Russia, etc in the "Concert of Europe" which preceded the League of Nations. The US sided with the Venez however, the US was not the big power back then!

With the rise of the US, the Venez saw an opportunity to revive/reopen the issue and exploited the new world order in the run up to independence. The PNC, wanting to out-do the PPP and take Guyana independence, accepted an amendment to the 1899 award in the independence document creating an opening for a Venez hook. This was done against the objection of the UK and the PPP/Jagan. Jagan warned it creates a major compromise to Guyana's sovereignty, but the the PNC [traitors] wanted power so bad.

So, let's say the PPP made some tactical mistakes, but the PNC made one major strategic [potentially existential] blunder for which the nation will continue to pay a heavy price, relegating it to perpetual poverty and left to the mercy of the much larger Venez! Had the PNC held the PPP line, it could have delayed independence, but the Venez would have been denied a [arguably] legal basis for their claim.

How you you measure treachery?

9/6/177:51 PM

MarsSenior Member

ba$eman posted:
Mars posted:
Bibi Haniffa posted:
"The Venezuelan government showed almost immediate disapproval with the 1899 Arbitral Award. As early as October 7, 1899 Venezuela voiced her condemnation of the Award, and demanded the renegotiation of her eastern border with British Guiana: that day, Venezuelan Foreign Minister José Andrade made clear that the Arbitral Award was the product of political collusion and it should not be adhered to by Venezuela. After numerous bilateral diplomatic attempts failed to convince Great Britain of her seriousness to nullify the award, Venezuela denounced it before the first assembly of the United Nations, in 1945.^"
What nonsense are you bringing up now that there is proof of the land belonging to Venezuela? That's one good reason why you people should be left to languish in the opposition. You traitors will sell out our country to Madburro and his henchmen. Venezuela accepted the 1899 award as final for many decades until some jackass brought up a Nancy story in the 1940's claiming that there was collusion between the judges in 1899. Even in the face of that allegation, Venezuela accepted the 1899 ruling as binding until 1962. Look go and read your history. Even PPP stalwart Mr. Ishmael knows better than you traitors who are willing to hand over the country to Venezuela.
http://www.coha.org/guyana-ven...itral-award-of-1899/
Excerpts from the article -
The tribunal and the award
The arbitral tribunal was finally set up in 1898 and began to receive written submissions from Venezuela and Great Britain. Oral presentations were made by the legal team on each side from June to September 1899 and finally, on October 3, the tribunal announced its award by upholding Great Britain’s ownership of most of the claimed territory west of the Essequibo River but denying the British entitlement to the upper Cuyuni basin and an area of land on the eastern bank near the mouth of the Orinoco River. Thus ended the dispute which had existed since 1840.
The territory awarded to the British (on behalf of colonial British Guiana) included a 4,000 square-mile block south of the Pakaraima Mountains bordered by the Cotinga River on the west, the Takutu River on the south and the Ireng River on the east and north. (This portion of territory, originally claimed by Venezuela in its case before the arbitral tribunal, was awarded to Brazil on June 6, 1904, following another arbitration conducted by the King of Italy after the Brazilian government claimed ownership based on historical occupation. When Venezuela in 1962 renewed its claim to the territory west of the Essequibo River on its alleged grounds that the 1899 award was null and void, that nation did not make any claim—and has never since made any—to that section of territory awarded to Brazil.)
Both Venezuela and Great Britain accepted the award of the tribunal and, in keeping with it, a mixed boundary commission appointed jointly by the two countries, carried out a survey and demarcation, between 1901 and 1905, of the boundary as stipulated by the award with an adjustment based on the British Guiana-Brazilian arbitration award.
The resulting boundary line was set out on a map signed by the boundary commissioners in Georgetown, British Guiana, on January 7, 1905. A separate agreement signed three days later by the commissioners stipulated: “That they regard this agreement as having a perfectly official character with respect to the acts and rights of both governments in the territory demarcated. . .” [Agreement Between the British and Venezuelan Boundary Commissioners with Regard to the Map of the Boundary, January 10, 1905]
Twenty-six years later, in 1931, a boundary commission made up of representatives from Great Britain, Venezuela and Brazil made special astronomical, geodesical and topographical observations on Mount Roraima so as to fix the specific point where the boundaries of Brazil, Venezuela and British Guiana should meet. Diplomatic notes were exchanged among the three nations on October 7 and November 3, 1932, by which they expressed agreement on the specific location of the tri-junction meeting point of the boundaries. A concrete pyramid marker was soon after erected there. The matter of the border was then considered permanently settled.
Significantly, by its rejection of the 1899 arbitral award, Venezuela has also unilaterally thrown out its own tripartite agreement of 1932 with Brazil that the peak of Mount Roraima forms the meeting point of the boundaries between those countries and Guyana.
Venezuela’s renewed claim
It was clear that Venezuela had accepted the 1899 award as a final settlement of the border dispute. Even as late as 1941, the Venezuelan minister of foreign affairs, Esteban Gil Borges, agreed that the frontier with British Guiana was well defined and was a closed issue.
Indeed in that year, Borges told the British representative in Caracas that his government was definitely of the opinion that the boundary question was a chose jugeé, that the Venezuelan‑British Guiana frontier was final and well defined, and that the author of articles in the Venezuelan press about that time, questioning the 1899 award, “had obviously never had access to the archives of his ministry.” [Guyana Journal, Vol. 1, No. 2, December 1968]

I don't want to sound unpatriotic, but Bibi does have a point. The Venezuelans view the 1899 as being strong armed by the then superpowers, UK, Russia, etc in the "Concert of Europe" which preceded the League of Nations. The US sided with the Venez however, the US was not the big power back then!
With the rise of the US, the Venez saw an opportunity to revive/reopen the issue and exploited the new world order in the run up to independence. The PNC, wanting to out-do the PPP and take Guyana independence, accepted an amendment to the 1899 award in the independence document creating an opening for a Venez hook. This was done against the objection of the UK and the PPP/Jagan. Jagan warned it creates a major compromise to Guyana's sovereignty, but the the PNC [traitors] wanted power so bad.
So, let's say the PPP made some tactical mistakes, but the PNC made one major strategic [potentially existential] blunder for which the nation will continue to pay a heavy price, relegating it to perpetual poverty and left to the mercy of the much larger Venez! Had the PNC held the PPP line, it could have delayed independence, but the Venez would have been denied a [arguably] legal basis for their claim.
How you you measure treachery?

The 1899 award was accepted by Venezuela for forty five years. You don't come back after accepting the border for forty five years and then suddenly decide that you want more land than was settled for in the agreement. They were happy with the award because they also got a large swath of land in the deal. Land that they do not plan to relinquish but want to take ours. Y'all need to read Ishmael's article in full before you make false statements on this dispute. Here's the link - http://www.coha.org/guyana-ven...itral-award-of-1899/ . Read it. The UK were not against the 1966 Geneva Agreement. There were a party to the agreement and they had to resolve it before handing over Guyana for independence in 1966. The '66 agreement does not nullify the 1899 award. Again read Ishmael before you embarrass yourself because y'all certainly don't know what you're talking about. Ishmael - "Significantly, the wording of the November 1965 joint communiqué and the Geneva Agreement on this specific issue is identical. Obviously, this language specified that the parties should continue to investigation and research the issue to determine if there were any grounds to support nullity of the arbitral award of 1899.

Evidently, this could not mean that the United Kingdom, British Guiana and Venezuela had agreed that the border between British Guiana and Venezuela should be revised. All it allowed for was to facilitate an examination of documents in order to put the Venezuelan contention to rest.

Over the years, since 1966, Venezuela has spread the propaganda that the arbitral award is null and void. By doing so, Venezuela contradicts the terms of the Geneva Agreement. And more recently, it has been expressing the view that the “territorial dispute” is “inherited from British colonialism.” The view is patently false since the land boundary between Guyana and Venezuela was permanently and definitively delimited by the international arbitration on October 3, 1899."

9/6/178:19 PM

Former Member

Mars posted:
ba$eman posted:
Mars posted:
Bibi Haniffa posted:
"The Venezuelan government showed almost immediate disapproval with the 1899 Arbitral Award. As early as October 7, 1899 Venezuela voiced her condemnation of the Award, and demanded the renegotiation of her eastern border with British Guiana: that day, Venezuelan Foreign Minister José Andrade made clear that the Arbitral Award was the product of political collusion and it should not be adhered to by Venezuela. After numerous bilateral diplomatic attempts failed to convince Great Britain of her seriousness to nullify the award, Venezuela denounced it before the first assembly of the United Nations, in 1945.^"
What nonsense are you bringing up now that there is proof of the land belonging to Venezuela? That's one good reason why you people should be left to languish in the opposition. You traitors will sell out our country to Madburro and his henchmen. Venezuela accepted the 1899 award as final for many decades until some jackass brought up a Nancy story in the 1940's claiming that there was collusion between the judges in 1899. Even in the face of that allegation, Venezuela accepted the 1899 ruling as binding until 1962. Look go and read your history. Even PPP stalwart Mr. Ishmael knows better than you traitors who are willing to hand over the country to Venezuela.
http://www.coha.org/guyana-ven...itral-award-of-1899/
Excerpts from the article -
The tribunal and the award
The arbitral tribunal was finally set up in 1898 and began to receive written submissions from Venezuela and Great Britain. Oral presentations were made by the legal team on each side from June to September 1899 and finally, on October 3, the tribunal announced its award by upholding Great Britain’s ownership of most of the claimed territory west of the Essequibo River but denying the British entitlement to the upper Cuyuni basin and an area of land on the eastern bank near the mouth of the Orinoco River. Thus ended the dispute which had existed since 1840.
The territory awarded to the British (on behalf of colonial British Guiana) included a 4,000 square-mile block south of the Pakaraima Mountains bordered by the Cotinga River on the west, the Takutu River on the south and the Ireng River on the east and north. (This portion of territory, originally claimed by Venezuela in its case before the arbitral tribunal, was awarded to Brazil on June 6, 1904, following another arbitration conducted by the King of Italy after the Brazilian government claimed ownership based on historical occupation. When Venezuela in 1962 renewed its claim to the territory west of the Essequibo River on its alleged grounds that the 1899 award was null and void, that nation did not make any claim—and has never since made any—to that section of territory awarded to Brazil.)
Both Venezuela and Great Britain accepted the award of the tribunal and, in keeping with it, a mixed boundary commission appointed jointly by the two countries, carried out a survey and demarcation, between 1901 and 1905, of the boundary as stipulated by the award with an adjustment based on the British Guiana-Brazilian arbitration award.
The resulting boundary line was set out on a map signed by the boundary commissioners in Georgetown, British Guiana, on January 7, 1905. A separate agreement signed three days later by the commissioners stipulated: “That they regard this agreement as having a perfectly official character with respect to the acts and rights of both governments in the territory demarcated. . .” [Agreement Between the British and Venezuelan Boundary Commissioners with Regard to the Map of the Boundary, January 10, 1905]
Twenty-six years later, in 1931, a boundary commission made up of representatives from Great Britain, Venezuela and Brazil made special astronomical, geodesical and topographical observations on Mount Roraima so as to fix the specific point where the boundaries of Brazil, Venezuela and British Guiana should meet. Diplomatic notes were exchanged among the three nations on October 7 and November 3, 1932, by which they expressed agreement on the specific location of the tri-junction meeting point of the boundaries. A concrete pyramid marker was soon after erected there. The matter of the border was then considered permanently settled.
Significantly, by its rejection of the 1899 arbitral award, Venezuela has also unilaterally thrown out its own tripartite agreement of 1932 with Brazil that the peak of Mount Roraima forms the meeting point of the boundaries between those countries and Guyana.
Venezuela’s renewed claim
It was clear that Venezuela had accepted the 1899 award as a final settlement of the border dispute. Even as late as 1941, the Venezuelan minister of foreign affairs, Esteban Gil Borges, agreed that the frontier with British Guiana was well defined and was a closed issue.
Indeed in that year, Borges told the British representative in Caracas that his government was definitely of the opinion that the boundary question was a chose jugeé, that the Venezuelan‑British Guiana frontier was final and well defined, and that the author of articles in the Venezuelan press about that time, questioning the 1899 award, “had obviously never had access to the archives of his ministry.” [Guyana Journal, Vol. 1, No. 2, December 1968]

I don't want to sound unpatriotic, but Bibi does have a point. The Venezuelans view the 1899 as being strong armed by the then superpowers, UK, Russia, etc in the "Concert of Europe" which preceded the League of Nations. The US sided with the Venez however, the US was not the big power back then!
With the rise of the US, the Venez saw an opportunity to revive/reopen the issue and exploited the new world order in the run up to independence. The PNC, wanting to out-do the PPP and take Guyana independence, accepted an amendment to the 1899 award in the independence document creating an opening for a Venez hook. This was done against the objection of the UK and the PPP/Jagan. Jagan warned it creates a major compromise to Guyana's sovereignty, but the the PNC [traitors] wanted power so bad.
So, let's say the PPP made some tactical mistakes, but the PNC made one major strategic [potentially existential] blunder for which the nation will continue to pay a heavy price, relegating it to perpetual poverty and left to the mercy of the much larger Venez! Had the PNC held the PPP line, it could have delayed independence, but the Venez would have been denied a [arguably] legal basis for their claim.
How you you measure treachery?
The 1899 award was accepted by Venezuela for forty five years. You don't come back after accepting the border for forty five years and then suddenly decide that you want more land than was settled for in the agreement. They were happy with the award because they also got a large swath of land in the deal. Land that they do not plan to relinquish but want to take ours. Y'all need to read Ishmael's article in full before you make false statements on this dispute. Here's the link - http://www.coha.org/guyana-ven...itral-award-of-1899/ . Read it. The UK were not against the 1966 Geneva Agreement. There were a party to the agreement and they had to resolve it before handing over Guyana for independence in 1966. The '66 agreement does not nullify the 1899 award. Again read Ishmael before you embarrass yourself because y'all certainly don't know what you're talking about. Ishmael - "Significantly, the wording of the November 1965 joint communiqué and the Geneva Agreement on this specific issue is identical. Obviously, this language specified that the parties should continue to investigation and research the issue to determine if there were any grounds to support nullity of the arbitral award of 1899.
Evidently, this could not mean that the United Kingdom, British Guiana and Venezuela had agreed that the border between British Guiana and Venezuela should be revised. All it allowed for was to facilitate an examination of documents in order to put the Venezuelan contention to rest.
Over the years, since 1966, Venezuela has spread the propaganda that the arbitral award is null and void. By doing so, Venezuela contradicts the terms of the Geneva Agreement. And more recently, it has been expressing the view that the “territorial dispute” is “inherited from British colonialism.” The view is patently false since the land boundary between Guyana and Venezuela was permanently and definitively delimited by the international arbitration on October 3, 1899."

In that case, why is it necessary to take the matter to the international court for resolution? If it's legal, it's legal! Clearly, there is an opening the Venez and international community view as legit, thus the referral to the international court!

9/6/178:25 PM

MarsSenior Member

ba$eman posted:
Mars posted:
ba$eman posted:
Mars posted:
Bibi Haniffa posted:
"The Venezuelan government showed almost immediate disapproval with the 1899 Arbitral Award. As early as October 7, 1899 Venezuela voiced her condemnation of the Award, and demanded the renegotiation of her eastern border with British Guiana: that day, Venezuelan Foreign Minister José Andrade made clear that the Arbitral Award was the product of political collusion and it should not be adhered to by Venezuela. After numerous bilateral diplomatic attempts failed to convince Great Britain of her seriousness to nullify the award, Venezuela denounced it before the first assembly of the United Nations, in 1945.^"
What nonsense are you bringing up now that there is proof of the land belonging to Venezuela? That's one good reason why you people should be left to languish in the opposition. You traitors will sell out our country to Madburro and his henchmen. Venezuela accepted the 1899 award as final for many decades until some jackass brought up a Nancy story in the 1940's claiming that there was collusion between the judges in 1899. Even in the face of that allegation, Venezuela accepted the 1899 ruling as binding until 1962. Look go and read your history. Even PPP stalwart Mr. Ishmael knows better than you traitors who are willing to hand over the country to Venezuela.
http://www.coha.org/guyana-ven...itral-award-of-1899/
Excerpts from the article -
The tribunal and the award
The arbitral tribunal was finally set up in 1898 and began to receive written submissions from Venezuela and Great Britain. Oral presentations were made by the legal team on each side from June to September 1899 and finally, on October 3, the tribunal announced its award by upholding Great Britain’s ownership of most of the claimed territory west of the Essequibo River but denying the British entitlement to the upper Cuyuni basin and an area of land on the eastern bank near the mouth of the Orinoco River. Thus ended the dispute which had existed since 1840.
The territory awarded to the British (on behalf of colonial British Guiana) included a 4,000 square-mile block south of the Pakaraima Mountains bordered by the Cotinga River on the west, the Takutu River on the south and the Ireng River on the east and north. (This portion of territory, originally claimed by Venezuela in its case before the arbitral tribunal, was awarded to Brazil on June 6, 1904, following another arbitration conducted by the King of Italy after the Brazilian government claimed ownership based on historical occupation. When Venezuela in 1962 renewed its claim to the territory west of the Essequibo River on its alleged grounds that the 1899 award was null and void, that nation did not make any claim—and has never since made any—to that section of territory awarded to Brazil.)
Both Venezuela and Great Britain accepted the award of the tribunal and, in keeping with it, a mixed boundary commission appointed jointly by the two countries, carried out a survey and demarcation, between 1901 and 1905, of the boundary as stipulated by the award with an adjustment based on the British Guiana-Brazilian arbitration award.
The resulting boundary line was set out on a map signed by the boundary commissioners in Georgetown, British Guiana, on January 7, 1905. A separate agreement signed three days later by the commissioners stipulated: “That they regard this agreement as having a perfectly official character with respect to the acts and rights of both governments in the territory demarcated. . .” [Agreement Between the British and Venezuelan Boundary Commissioners with Regard to the Map of the Boundary, January 10, 1905]
Twenty-six years later, in 1931, a boundary commission made up of representatives from Great Britain, Venezuela and Brazil made special astronomical, geodesical and topographical observations on Mount Roraima so as to fix the specific point where the boundaries of Brazil, Venezuela and British Guiana should meet. Diplomatic notes were exchanged among the three nations on October 7 and November 3, 1932, by which they expressed agreement on the specific location of the tri-junction meeting point of the boundaries. A concrete pyramid marker was soon after erected there. The matter of the border was then considered permanently settled.
Significantly, by its rejection of the 1899 arbitral award, Venezuela has also unilaterally thrown out its own tripartite agreement of 1932 with Brazil that the peak of Mount Roraima forms the meeting point of the boundaries between those countries and Guyana.
Venezuela’s renewed claim
It was clear that Venezuela had accepted the 1899 award as a final settlement of the border dispute. Even as late as 1941, the Venezuelan minister of foreign affairs, Esteban Gil Borges, agreed that the frontier with British Guiana was well defined and was a closed issue.
Indeed in that year, Borges told the British representative in Caracas that his government was definitely of the opinion that the boundary question was a chose jugeé, that the Venezuelan‑British Guiana frontier was final and well defined, and that the author of articles in the Venezuelan press about that time, questioning the 1899 award, “had obviously never had access to the archives of his ministry.” [Guyana Journal, Vol. 1, No. 2, December 1968]

I don't want to sound unpatriotic, but Bibi does have a point. The Venezuelans view the 1899 as being strong armed by the then superpowers, UK, Russia, etc in the "Concert of Europe" which preceded the League of Nations. The US sided with the Venez however, the US was not the big power back then!
With the rise of the US, the Venez saw an opportunity to revive/reopen the issue and exploited the new world order in the run up to independence. The PNC, wanting to out-do the PPP and take Guyana independence, accepted an amendment to the 1899 award in the independence document creating an opening for a Venez hook. This was done against the objection of the UK and the PPP/Jagan. Jagan warned it creates a major compromise to Guyana's sovereignty, but the the PNC [traitors] wanted power so bad.
So, let's say the PPP made some tactical mistakes, but the PNC made one major strategic [potentially existential] blunder for which the nation will continue to pay a heavy price, relegating it to perpetual poverty and left to the mercy of the much larger Venez! Had the PNC held the PPP line, it could have delayed independence, but the Venez would have been denied a [arguably] legal basis for their claim.
How you you measure treachery?
The 1899 award was accepted by Venezuela for forty five years. You don't come back after accepting the border for forty five years and then suddenly decide that you want more land than was settled for in the agreement. They were happy with the award because they also got a large swath of land in the deal. Land that they do not plan to relinquish but want to take ours. Y'all need to read Ishmael's article in full before you make false statements on this dispute. Here's the link - http://www.coha.org/guyana-ven...itral-award-of-1899/ . Read it. The UK were not against the 1966 Geneva Agreement. There were a party to the agreement and they had to resolve it before handing over Guyana for independence in 1966. The '66 agreement does not nullify the 1899 award. Again read Ishmael before you embarrass yourself because y'all certainly don't know what you're talking about. Ishmael - "Significantly, the wording of the November 1965 joint communiqué and the Geneva Agreement on this specific issue is identical. Obviously, this language specified that the parties should continue to investigation and research the issue to determine if there were any grounds to support nullity of the arbitral award of 1899.
Evidently, this could not mean that the United Kingdom, British Guiana and Venezuela had agreed that the border between British Guiana and Venezuela should be revised. All it allowed for was to facilitate an examination of documents in order to put the Venezuelan contention to rest.
Over the years, since 1966, Venezuela has spread the propaganda that the arbitral award is null and void. By doing so, Venezuela contradicts the terms of the Geneva Agreement. And more recently, it has been expressing the view that the “territorial dispute” is “inherited from British colonialism.” The view is patently false since the land boundary between Guyana and Venezuela was permanently and definitively delimited by the international arbitration on October 3, 1899."

In that case, why is it necessary to take the matter to the international court for resolution? If it's legal, it's legal! Clearly, there is an opening the Venez and international community view as legit, thus the referral to the international court!

To end this nonsense once and for all before Venezuela decides to invade Guyana. The 1966 agreement was not to nullify the 1899 award but just to investigate the validity of Venezuela's claims. The UK and Guyana agreed to that and they are honoring that agreement first through the UN and the International Court if necessary. I'm taking bets that this will be resolved in Guyana's favor.

9/6/178:34 PM

Former Member

Mars posted:
ba$eman posted:
Mars posted:
ba$eman posted:
Mars posted:
Bibi Haniffa posted:
"The Venezuelan government showed almost immediate disapproval with the 1899 Arbitral Award. As early as October 7, 1899 Venezuela voiced her condemnation of the Award, and demanded the renegotiation of her eastern border with British Guiana: that day, Venezuelan Foreign Minister José Andrade made clear that the Arbitral Award was the product of political collusion and it should not be adhered to by Venezuela. After numerous bilateral diplomatic attempts failed to convince Great Britain of her seriousness to nullify the award, Venezuela denounced it before the first assembly of the United Nations, in 1945.^"
What nonsense are you bringing up now that there is proof of the land belonging to Venezuela? That's one good reason why you people should be left to languish in the opposition. You traitors will sell out our country to Madburro and his henchmen. Venezuela accepted the 1899 award as final for many decades until some jackass brought up a Nancy story in the 1940's claiming that there was collusion between the judges in 1899. Even in the face of that allegation, Venezuela accepted the 1899 ruling as binding until 1962. Look go and read your history. Even PPP stalwart Mr. Ishmael knows better than you traitors who are willing to hand over the country to Venezuela.
http://www.coha.org/guyana-ven...itral-award-of-1899/
Excerpts from the article -
The tribunal and the award
The arbitral tribunal was finally set up in 1898 and began to receive written submissions from Venezuela and Great Britain. Oral presentations were made by the legal team on each side from June to September 1899 and finally, on October 3, the tribunal announced its award by upholding Great Britain’s ownership of most of the claimed territory west of the Essequibo River but denying the British entitlement to the upper Cuyuni basin and an area of land on the eastern bank near the mouth of the Orinoco River. Thus ended the dispute which had existed since 1840.
The territory awarded to the British (on behalf of colonial British Guiana) included a 4,000 square-mile block south of the Pakaraima Mountains bordered by the Cotinga River on the west, the Takutu River on the south and the Ireng River on the east and north. (This portion of territory, originally claimed by Venezuela in its case before the arbitral tribunal, was awarded to Brazil on June 6, 1904, following another arbitration conducted by the King of Italy after the Brazilian government claimed ownership based on historical occupation. When Venezuela in 1962 renewed its claim to the territory west of the Essequibo River on its alleged grounds that the 1899 award was null and void, that nation did not make any claim—and has never since made any—to that section of territory awarded to Brazil.)
Both Venezuela and Great Britain accepted the award of the tribunal and, in keeping with it, a mixed boundary commission appointed jointly by the two countries, carried out a survey and demarcation, between 1901 and 1905, of the boundary as stipulated by the award with an adjustment based on the British Guiana-Brazilian arbitration award.
The resulting boundary line was set out on a map signed by the boundary commissioners in Georgetown, British Guiana, on January 7, 1905. A separate agreement signed three days later by the commissioners stipulated: “That they regard this agreement as having a perfectly official character with respect to the acts and rights of both governments in the territory demarcated. . .” [Agreement Between the British and Venezuelan Boundary Commissioners with Regard to the Map of the Boundary, January 10, 1905]
Twenty-six years later, in 1931, a boundary commission made up of representatives from Great Britain, Venezuela and Brazil made special astronomical, geodesical and topographical observations on Mount Roraima so as to fix the specific point where the boundaries of Brazil, Venezuela and British Guiana should meet. Diplomatic notes were exchanged among the three nations on October 7 and November 3, 1932, by which they expressed agreement on the specific location of the tri-junction meeting point of the boundaries. A concrete pyramid marker was soon after erected there. The matter of the border was then considered permanently settled.
Significantly, by its rejection of the 1899 arbitral award, Venezuela has also unilaterally thrown out its own tripartite agreement of 1932 with Brazil that the peak of Mount Roraima forms the meeting point of the boundaries between those countries and Guyana.
Venezuela’s renewed claim
It was clear that Venezuela had accepted the 1899 award as a final settlement of the border dispute. Even as late as 1941, the Venezuelan minister of foreign affairs, Esteban Gil Borges, agreed that the frontier with British Guiana was well defined and was a closed issue.
Indeed in that year, Borges told the British representative in Caracas that his government was definitely of the opinion that the boundary question was a chose jugeé, that the Venezuelan‑British Guiana frontier was final and well defined, and that the author of articles in the Venezuelan press about that time, questioning the 1899 award, “had obviously never had access to the archives of his ministry.” [Guyana Journal, Vol. 1, No. 2, December 1968]

I don't want to sound unpatriotic, but Bibi does have a point. The Venezuelans view the 1899 as being strong armed by the then superpowers, UK, Russia, etc in the "Concert of Europe" which preceded the League of Nations. The US sided with the Venez however, the US was not the big power back then!
With the rise of the US, the Venez saw an opportunity to revive/reopen the issue and exploited the new world order in the run up to independence. The PNC, wanting to out-do the PPP and take Guyana independence, accepted an amendment to the 1899 award in the independence document creating an opening for a Venez hook. This was done against the objection of the UK and the PPP/Jagan. Jagan warned it creates a major compromise to Guyana's sovereignty, but the the PNC [traitors] wanted power so bad.
So, let's say the PPP made some tactical mistakes, but the PNC made one major strategic [potentially existential] blunder for which the nation will continue to pay a heavy price, relegating it to perpetual poverty and left to the mercy of the much larger Venez! Had the PNC held the PPP line, it could have delayed independence, but the Venez would have been denied a [arguably] legal basis for their claim.
How you you measure treachery?
The 1899 award was accepted by Venezuela for forty five years. You don't come back after accepting the border for forty five years and then suddenly decide that you want more land than was settled for in the agreement. They were happy with the award because they also got a large swath of land in the deal. Land that they do not plan to relinquish but want to take ours. Y'all need to read Ishmael's article in full before you make false statements on this dispute. Here's the link - http://www.coha.org/guyana-ven...itral-award-of-1899/ . Read it. The UK were not against the 1966 Geneva Agreement. There were a party to the agreement and they had to resolve it before handing over Guyana for independence in 1966. The '66 agreement does not nullify the 1899 award. Again read Ishmael before you embarrass yourself because y'all certainly don't know what you're talking about. Ishmael - "Significantly, the wording of the November 1965 joint communiqué and the Geneva Agreement on this specific issue is identical. Obviously, this language specified that the parties should continue to investigation and research the issue to determine if there were any grounds to support nullity of the arbitral award of 1899.
Evidently, this could not mean that the United Kingdom, British Guiana and Venezuela had agreed that the border between British Guiana and Venezuela should be revised. All it allowed for was to facilitate an examination of documents in order to put the Venezuelan contention to rest.
Over the years, since 1966, Venezuela has spread the propaganda that the arbitral award is null and void. By doing so, Venezuela contradicts the terms of the Geneva Agreement. And more recently, it has been expressing the view that the “territorial dispute” is “inherited from British colonialism.” The view is patently false since the land boundary between Guyana and Venezuela was permanently and definitively delimited by the international arbitration on October 3, 1899."

In that case, why is it necessary to take the matter to the international court for resolution? If it's legal, it's legal! Clearly, there is an opening the Venez and international community view as legit, thus the referral to the international court!
... The 1966 agreement was not to nullify the 1899 award but just to investigate the validity of Venezuela's claims.... .

So we have come full circle. You remind me of a manager at my office. She immediately disagree, then give a long-winded convoluted argument, and then come back to your original position and then say, yes see, I told you so!!

Cut to the chase banna!

Here you go...enjoy!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kK62tfoCmuQ

9/6/178:51 PM