Cool...if that is what you say to yourself.

People like to use Islam and Muslim intermittently when the two are not synonymous in any way. I chuckle whenever I read the term Islamist when referring to ISIS and other terrorists. If I were to break down the word Islamist, I would get nothing other than Peaceist (obviously not a real word). Now how can anyone have a problem with the term peace-ist? For whatever reason, they don't seem to realize that 'Muslim terrorist', 'Muslim extremist' or 'Muslim fanatic' are more appropriate terms.

It is not what I am saying to myself but what I am saying to you.

Stornborn,

It seems as though you have step upon a few "corns"

The pack is out hunting

The pack is out hunting.....and Storm stepped on a few corns......Vish, this is loaded with emotional content. It suggests that Chief, Kzaaz and myself are gunning for Stormy and ipso facto he is right and we are wrong.. You have just joined the fray by being on the side of Stormy and thus support the Iraq invasion, and support the notion that the hideous acts of a few extremists who abuse the religion of Islam mean that Islam is evil and all Muslims are evil.

Thank you for your contribution.

HMMMMM! VERY INTERESTING THREAD.

Rev

Why dont Chief and others come out bluntly as they should and CONDEMN the ACTIONS of Muslims which are NOT permitted in a civilized society RATHER than try to justify their ACTIONS??????????????

Again, I have never and particularly so in this thread, confused Muslims with Islam.

I do declare that there is no damn pure Islam practiced anywhere except in the mind of those who declare they are practicing pure Islam. There is no sect on the planet that has the right and exact directive of he Koran except that they say they do.

ISIS claims they are practicing pure Islam. They are according to their declared purpose, creating a Caliphate. My point is these are Muslims and you saying that they are not does not make them not Muslims in their mind. To excuse what they do simply as being poor interpreters of text would imply the text is confusing or that these are poor scholars in general.

I most certainly do not believe they are poor scholars or that they do not think they do the Muslim thing. I simply say the book itself is open to interpretations and that produces malignant fellows like these.

Now, of course as Christians would protest so Muslims protest...it cannot be of the book! Well, I really do not care. These people call themselves Muslims so I call them Muslims. I also call them toxic people who cannot be allowed to live.  You fight it out among yourselves why you think the fight but it is not about america. It is about their own confusion as to what makes for a proper human.

There is a whole Sura on what to do with and how to treat non believers. You may say that there is no literal translation for a jizyah  as a dhimmi tax but it was interpret as such and has a history of practice as such. I am not concerned with what you believe. I am concerned that in every translation I read it is called a tax on idolaters.....(9:29) is specifically what I am talking about and you can go to Yusufali or Pickthal and examine how they translate it.

Again, if scholars translate it as a tax and there is a history present and past of entire segments of Muslims who practice their faith on that interpretation ie it is a tax then so it is.

I am not emotional, are you? If so why? I have a right to say that I believe all religion is bullcrap and this idea of a pure one by some pure dogma is the beginning of the excrement being dispensed by religious peopel.

I am also saying that the fellows calling themselves ISIS believe themselves to be religious.  They call themselves Muslims, insist the follow the true tenets of the faith and believe in every way they are justified in what they are doing. They are at the same time fanatics who do great evil in expressing the politics of their faith. Given that what should I call them if not Fanatical and evil representations of politics by Muslims?  I do not care if they are of pure or impure Islam per your interpretation as i do not believe there can be pure Islam or Christianity or whatever except in the minds of people believing that. The very concept of purity of faith and there is some standard reference to it is nonsense. It is what reflects from the book by any who read it

Why am I wrong and you fellows right? Sunnis and Shias are at the heart of the matter. They did not fall into those divisions by geography but by faith or interpretation of their faith. These are the fellows fighting! None of them like america if the truth be told so the excuse that they fight because of Bush or Chaney is pure nonsense. They fight because that is what they have been doing from the day mohamed died.

Kari,

You seem surprise by Vishnu confession. 

Stop being an ass - Chief and others never justified the actions of ISIS.

And you believe that, right?

Stormy, why are you such an ass? Why are you replying to a response to Vish that his statement has an emotional content - a euphemism for a "dog whistle" or "coded sentence"?

And why are you using this to continue to peddle that ISIS is Islamic?

mAYBE SOMEONE BEING AN ASS AND IT IS NOT ME. cHIEF said bUSH CAUSE WHAT IS HAPPENING now. iF THAT IS NOT TRYING TO JUSTIFY THEN I DONT KNOW WHAT ELSE TO SAY!!1

Actually Chief, I know Vish does not mean what I interpret his contribution on this thread to be. I merely want him to come out and knock Stormy for how he describes the Islamic religion and to acknowledge that you, Kzaaz and I are outraged that ISIS hijacks our religion to commit hideous murderous acts.

Vish uses coded language in my mind to say we "offend" Stormy - and by implication heVish, sides with Stormy. And we knopw what Stormy is saying in his thred - Bush was right to invade Iraq; Bush's invasion has no impact in creating these Jihadi fiends; and that Islam is what ISIS says it is.

Vish is squarely in Stromy's camp until he comes out and denounces Stormy and what he's saying in this thread. I call upon him to do so now.

Vish's heart is not as bad as that post suggests. I now need him to speak on the right side of history.

Pavi. here's a little English Comprehension lesson.

• Bush did a wrong to invade Iraq (fooled by curveball Chalabi).
• Following this wrong, Bush compounded it by siding with Malaki who destroyed the Sunni Baath party
• The extremist Jihadis (AL Qaeda in Iraq now turned ISIS) seized on this to terrorize the Shiites and did the same in Syria against Assad's Alawites.

The above is what it means by Bush causing the ISIS rampage.

Now on to ISIS - where do you see Chief and others say they justify ISIS's action? Give me a comprehension license.

No where have I said ISIS is Islamic. I said they are Muslims. You and Kas and Chief said they are not "pure" Muslims.

This line of reasoning came from Chief insisting america is at fault for ISIS evil. I said no; it is legacy Muslim on Muslim violence. 

That ISIS has a clearly more evil bent is their own skew on how they can achieve their Caliphate which they claim is a global objective and not merely local. Jihad John who murdered Foley said the same thing.

I do not knock your religion. You have a "pure" religion by your own telling of it.

BTW, I think all religions are bullshit so do not say I am selecting Islam for special criticism. I am simply stating the fact that those fellows claim they are muslims so I call them muslims.

Chief is saying this is the result of Bush's war that Obama refuse to continue so today the chaos.

OBAMA had his views at the time of the Bush war. He did not think war was necessary. While not an isolationist Obama is bent on non interference except as he puts it, if american interests are at stake.

Any way you slice and dice it he will be in there with increasing boots on the ground.

Thank you. Now I dont have to explain to Kari

Kari was in order to correct you that I am in no way justifying the actions of the murderous ISIS.

Nehru is adopting the official Republican Party line on Obama's foreign policy; and like Chief said he has NOT retracted his statement that Chief supports ISIS. that last part makes him evil and as liar.

Nehru is just going along with so many  who feel that any rational disccusion  started by a muslim is support  for the bad guys because supposedly they are Muslims.

Well there is no Islamic book that says one must kill a christian or anyone else all because they are a non muslim.

Just returned from Jumah and the Imaam last dua was one acalling on Muslims to unite.

Chief, Was this your posting or someone used your handle. Now you and Kari run along with Al YUh evil selves so.

That's exactly  where I started and I made that statement for a purpose.

If it's beyond your comprehension, that I can understand.

As for you labelling Kari and me as being evil  that's okay too.  We have gone to lenghts to prove that the ISIS did not came from thin air.

Wiggle all you want it does not make a difference. The Public will judge A;l YUh . WICKED and EVIL!!!

Bhai Nehru,

I believe that the muslims on this board are staunch muslims. They defend Islam. ISIS is not a brand of Islam. I donot believe that Islam teaches violence. I must say that I am not a scholar of Islam; however, I grew up with a lot of muslim friends.

Skelly, You are not teaching me anything new!!!

Dat is like Caribj saying he has Indian friends.

I am a bit surprised and dissapointed that you came to this ridiculous conclusion about me and Kari are wicked. It will be nice  if you can state your reasons.

Unlike D2  who  went  at   lenght to make his  case   you   just came out of left field with this label.

No, what fullahs like him and jalil do is post the suffering of the Palestinians.  One thing for sure, never trust a fullah man.

This an anti-Muslim comment Baseman.  STOP it.

I don't say muslims agree with ISIS, but quietly many support extremism and cheer at victory.

Nehru, "another rasta take my place" is a figure of speech that in this context means that Bush whacks one set of extremists another set is around to take its place. This whack-a-mole phrase got you all in a tizzy, and I explained that Bush ripped Saddam away from a hold on 3 ethnic groups, protected one (the Kurds, even his father did with the no-fly zone), had a tenuous relationship with one that back-stabbed the USA (Maliki) and sent the other to puckatery (the Sunnis). That phrase was just to show the folly of Bush in Iraq and you ran with it to say Chief supports ISIS. You are singularly stupid, and you compound it with your anti-Muslim bias. Now run along and go wiggle your ass out of that bigotry, and your evident racism with the CaribJ references, you ****ing *******. You want me to come and bytch-slap yuh lil antiman. Let me know when yuh gon hang around the antiman bar at Liberty Ave.

Hey you bigoted antiman, shut yuh pattacake for a change, you constipated sk0nt.

Oh yes, i forgot stink our Kari-Mullah.

It is laughable when a Batty Boy like tyou refer to me as Antiman. And with regards to slap me, only when my hands are fasten in my Kakahole that will be possible.  I don't scare of SHIT like you!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I do not feel inclined to continue with this thread but this is essentially an incorrect statements. Let me prefece what I will say with a statemtnt avout humans in general. We are about fighting. It is in our essential nature. Therefore to say that any group is about peace is to commit that grop to anhiliation.

The Koran does have exhortations to violence...horrific violence....It is an Abrahamic religion and the stories it reflects on are stories of violence detailed in depth in the Bible.  Christians are deciples of the prince of peace and they have existed in violence from the beginning to now. Islam is born in violence and we do have muslims participating in violence even now.

ISIS is muslim....call them errant muslims or not but they are muslims taking their instructions as any from the Koran. They inrerpret the fulfilling of their religious quest to subjugate all non nuslims. Check what is happening in holland today. Muslims calling themselves ISIS is in the streets. Other European nations are planning extreme strategies to deal with what is expected in Belgium, France, Germany and England where these nutcases calling for mass conversion already exist. I am not listening to anyone who say these are just bad muslims. I want them to go our into the streets and stop them because it is the rest of us these idiots want to kill not the so called good muslims who already have cover.