you are and should be relieved that this is the exception to the rule

So now I'm happy when so-called Islamic terrorists butcher innocent people?

RiffRaff posted:

Bibi Haniffa posted:

Nehru keeps his gold chain.  He is Iranian.

He is German Iranian...18 yr old...with a beef against Turks...he was born in Germany...he has a problem with immigrants...

Dang, you people in your zest to to blame Muslims, will go to all lengths

Europe has changed. It was not because of neo nazi who were there since time immemorial. The nations state of the region were changed since the external borders of the region were breached and a mass movement of people from war torn Islamic states descended on them.

When soldiers come from war zones they are transformed. Adrenaline constantly pumped into their bodies transform their sympathetic nervous system and they are in a constant state of fight or flight. It takes many years of therapy to bring them back.

These people are like war shocked soldiers. They have seen cruelty in all its forms and  suffered deprivations beyond the limits of most humans. They are dispossessed and many have walked some 2 thousand miles to get to Europe often at the mercy of their own. And many realize they are now the backward others in the minds of Europeans.

When they get there and realize it is not the paradise they envision. People do not like them, the culture is different, the language different and they cannot get the full attention to bring them down from the paranoid state most of them are in.

Then there is the background narrative of what caused their dispossession ...western heathens. Only a tiny fragment of these damaged people have to go contrary and we have the perfect combustible human completely alienated from those that surrounds him/her. Give that individual a jihadi faith and pop goes the weasel.

RiffRaff posted:

 

I still waiting for an answer how exactly can us peaceful Muslims stop these crazies from killing...if intelligence agencies cannot stop them, we who have no such capability can stop them?

You know what.  That is NOT my problem.  That is YOUR problem, because as the image of Muslims is damaged they scape goat the ones like you.   In fact more Muslims are killed than non Muslims.

Only Muslims can figure out how to stop these lunatics from killing in the name of Islam.

RiffRaff posted:

 

We have been saying that they don't belong to Islam....does that mean that they have a home in Islam? Can I stop you from being brainwashed and killing people?

This is you poking your head in the sands.  These people perceive themselves to be part of Islam, and will insist that their beliefs represent a true Islam.  They act out of a mistaken belief that they are waging a holy war against infidels, including Muslims like you who think that their behavior is abhorrent.

When you claim that they aren't part of Islam you merely show how deep in denial that Muslims have a serious problem about how a minority amongst them are capturing Islam for their own sordid purposes. 

There is a huge difference between Saddam, who happened to be a Muslim, but whose crimes weren't justified based on religion from bin Laden whose entire being is based on his perceptions of Islam.

caribny posted:

RiffRaff posted:

 

I still waiting for an answer how exactly can us peaceful Muslims stop these crazies from killing...if intelligence agencies cannot stop them, we who have no such capability can stop them?

You know what.  That is NOT my problem.  That is YOUR problem, because as the image of Muslims is damaged they scape goat the ones like you.   In fact more Muslims are killed than non Muslims.

Only Muslims can figure out how to stop these lunatics from killing in the name of Islam.

You seem to be only one making this a problem for someone else, whereas the rest of mankind see this just as a problem. You're just lazy passing the buck. Evertyone here says they don't encourage this sort of thing and they cannot speak for their neighbor's actions. but no, you must select innocent Muslims and say they bury their heads in the sands. What you're really saying is ALL Muslims encourage this terror and they're all guilty. Be a man and admit this, period.

So the ditz still hasn't apologized for her anti-Muslim outrage. Typical. She comes and throws a molotov cocktail here and run her irresponsible behind to hide. No shame with Bibibski HaKnifeA

From Reuters

A German-Iranian teenager who killed nine people and then himself in Munich had undergone psychiatric treatment and was in all probability a lone gunman who had no Islamist militant ties, police said on Saturday.

The 18-year-old, who was born and raised locally, opened fire near a busy shopping mall on Friday, triggering a lockdown in the Bavarian capital in the third act of violence against civilians in Western Europe - and the second in southern Germany - in eight days.

Seven of his victims were themselves teenagers, police said, and Bavarian state crime office president Robert Heimberger said the gunman was carrying more than 300 bullets in his backpack and pistol when he was later found dead of a gunshot wound.

Following a police search of the attacker's room, where a book on teenage shooting sprees was discovered, Munich police chief Hubertus Andrae all but ruled out an Islamist militant link in the attack, in which a further 27 people were wounded - including some hurt when panic spread.

"Based on the searches, there are no indications whatsoever that there is a connection to Islamic State" or to the issue of refugees, he told a news conference.

I see CNN has chosen to leave unsubstantiatedv quotes about alluh akbar in its reporting.

here is the London Mirror newspaper:

Updated 14:02, 23 Jul 2016
By Natalie Evans , Alex Wellman , Gemma Mullin

The shooter, named locally as 18-year-old Ali David Sonboly, killed himself after the spree during which he was armed with a handgun and 300 rounds of amunition

A "deranged" teenage gunman shot nine people dead and injured a further 27 in a shopping mall massacre in Munich.

Ali David Sonboly, 18, struck in the area around the Olympia-Einkaufszentrum (OEZ) shopping mall on Friday afternoon.

He apparently lured victims to a McDonald's by hacking into a young woman's Facebook account and promising free food.

Armed with a 9mm Glock and 300 rounds of ammunition, Sonboly then loaded his gun in the toilet before opening fire on helpless young people.

Seven of nine dead victims were teens, including three aged just 14.

Minutes later, chilling video footage showed Sonboly shooting at terrified members of the public outside the restaurant.

He fled police who fired at him and missed, before shooting himself in the head nearby.

Police said Sonboly was obsessed with mass killings and had a book in his bag entitled "why students kill".

The shooting happened on the fifth anniversary of Anders Breivik's massacre in Norway.

Is this still a terrorist attack?

Abu Jihad posted:

Is this still a terrorist attack?

Ask Nehru, Bibi, Baseman  and the other cheer leaders.

Kari posted:

caribny posted:

RiffRaff posted:

 

I still waiting for an answer how exactly can us peaceful Muslims stop these crazies from killing...if intelligence agencies cannot stop them, we who have no such capability can stop them?

You know what.  That is NOT my problem.  That is YOUR problem, because as the image of Muslims is damaged they scape goat the ones like you.   In fact more Muslims are killed than non Muslims.

Only Muslims can figure out how to stop these lunatics from killing in the name of Islam.

You seem to be only one making this a problem for someone else, whereas the rest of mankind see this just as a problem. You're just lazy passing the buck. Evertyone here says they don't encourage this sort of thing and they cannot speak for their neighbor's actions. but no, you must select innocent Muslims and say they bury their heads in the sands. What you're really saying is ALL Muslims encourage this terror and they're all guilty. Be a man and admit this, period.

Caribj is  making a point that you miss because of your commitment to the idea that Muslims are a peaceful people. That may be the practice and intent but there is ample evidence that something is happening in the Muslim community that causes it to fracture and disintegrate with some fragments becoming morbidly anti life.

I also as an atheist see other dysfunctions. The immediate and contemptible response to people like me without the understanding that we come from  a deep and philosophically sound foundation based on interrogating human circumstance that resides in the heart  of every valid human belief system. That lack of tolerance is woefully absent in the Muslim community because there is no custom of interrogating the faith as one sees in Christianity and Judaism.

There is legacy of criticism of doctrine as in the talmud where the common man can read and grasp understanding. The myth is the Koran is pure and simple and sufficiently so that it alone provides that understanding. That is bunk. It is nullified by the fact that  there many mullahs rise from the weeds claiming official status as interpreters  of the faith and  are confusing the hell out of adherents. Worse the cause adherents to become fanatical regurgitation of Quranic verses to substantiate everything and think that alone is acceptable to others not of the faith.

I therefore can see why Caribj say the faith has a responsibility to itself for creating a summoning creed above and beyond theology and ritual that is not religion specific and  invites Muslims to accept others on their own terms.

Kari posted:

 

You seem to be only one making this a problem for someone else,

Mankind is saying that Muslims need to deal with their problem.  Evidently you are hard of hearing, or are just in deep denial.

Honor killing.   Is that something that non Muslims can solve?

Fatwahs, and jihads.  Is that something that non Muslims can solve?

So someone draws insulting images of Mohammed.  Is that a death sentence?  Why this anger?

You need to admit that there are lunatics who use the Koran as inspiration.  Because its those behaviors that form the violence of the "lone wolf" syndrome that we have seen with increasing frequency.  Few of those people are tied to formal terrorist groups, yet they act.

Muslims have to figure out why that religion inspires so many to craziness.   Why don't we have people who are Hindus, Buddhist or Christian engaging in religious inspired violence to the same degree?  Because it should be clear to you by now that all of these acts aren't organized by ISIS.

Al Qaeda is virtually dead.  Yet events over the past couple of months should indicate that religious violence is far from over.  What is the normal response of the authorities. The lunatic involved in the killing wasn't on their radar.

Mali. Nigeria, Kenya, Indonesia, Philippines, again and again.  Points outside of the Middle East South Asia region.  Nations that have nothing to do with those who bombed Iraq.  People completely innocent of international conflicts being victimized.

There is a problem with how some interpret the Koran.  There are well organized systems to brainwash people.  ONLY Muslims can deal with that issue, because you certainly don't want others to interfere with your religion.

The fact still remains that the KILLER is Muslim and what he did is a Terrorist ACT.

kp posted:

The fact still remains that the KILLER is Muslim and what he did is a Terrorist ACT.

where is it stated the killer is a Muslim?

kp posted:

The fact still remains that the KILLER is Muslim and what he did is a Terrorist ACT.

With due respect to you.  In this case the killer happened to be a Muslim, and there is no evidence that his act was inspired by religion.

The issue isn't about every time a Muslim commits a criminal act.  The issue is when those acts are inspired by a warped interpretation of the Koran.

He could easily have been like the one who killed the MP in the UK a few months ago.  Or for that matter Matteen in Orlando.

But this gets back to why Muslims have to address what it is that exists among their adherents which inspires religiously inspired violence. This because every time some one, who happens to be Muslim does something, the remaining 1.5B will be blamed, even though this is clearly unfair in this particular case.

I haven't seen anything that says this fella is a Muslim...where you guys see this

RiffRaff posted:

I haven't seen anything that says this fella is a Muslim...where you guys see this

So do you now understand why you all have to fix your problem? Any one with a Middle Eastern connection will be assumed to be a Muslim, and will be assumed to be a terrorist.

Now tell us why the only religion which features numbers of people killing themselves over religion is Islam?  What inspires this?   This is what non Muslims don't understand.  Why Islam?  I don't even see Jews engaging in that behavior, and they evolve out of the same Semitic culture.

This is the question that Muslims have to be asking themselves.  The rest of us cannot help you with that.

You asking the wrong man...I have never being taught any of this stuff...and most Muslims I know have not being taught this way either

Lots of the stuff in the ME goes back to their tribal days, which existed before Islam

I could easily say that Police brutality against blacks is because blacks have a history of crime and blacks need to examine themselves and solve their problems. WHy do they act the way they do?

But I know that you cannot paint one set of people with a broad brush, and police brutality is real and wrong, and there is a large set of police who are plain out racists

RiffRaff posted:

You asking the wrong man...I have never being taught any of this stuff...

So if this topic doesn't interest you why then wonder why CNN doesn't cover every Muslim on Muslim terrorist act?

Clearly the topic will interest non Muslim people even less.

RiffRaff posted:

I could easily say that Police brutality against blacks is because blacks have a history of crime and blacks need to examine themselves and solve their problems. WHy do they act the way they do?

 

And yes blacks are concerned about high rates of crime in black communities.  If you don't know this then you don't know much.

But then these criminal blacks don't pull out the bible to justify their acts.  They rob because of criminal gain.  The way to deal with this is to have a criminal justice system which arrests criminals without harassing those who aren't.  This is what blacks, who live in high crime areas want.

The topic isn't about high rates of crime among poor Muslim societies. Parisian ghettoes are dangerous largely because of the actions of people of North African descent.  Baghdad is dangerous as well.

 Its about a religion which gives some the impression that they can disguise their acts under the disguise of the Koran.

Plus Riffraff this isn't about people claiming that Muslims are more evil then others, or that Islam is evil.

This is about a religion that is locked in a crisis, which has led to some to exploit it for their own ends. This about me saying that its in the interest of Muslims to find the root problem.

You will note that no credible black person justifies the police shootings. Those involved were killed and 99.999% said good riddance.

Bibi Haniffa posted:

Over one million refugees entered Germany over the last year.  At least 70% of those had no passport.   Angela Merkel is a slacker.  She thinks she is the head of the European Union.  

You are a SICK FOOL to blame  ONE MILLION PEOPLE for the actions of a few .

BTW HE IS GERMAN BORN AND RAISED SO YOUR STATEMENT HOLDS NO WATER.

BUT AS USUAL YOU HAVE TO EXPOSE YOUR BIGOTRY AGAINST MUSLIMS.

MANY OF THE "REFUGEES" ARE NOT MUSLIMS BUT CHRISTIANS BUT YOU CANNOT SEE PAST THAT AS YOU SEE EVERYONE FROM THE MIDDLE EASE AS MUSLIMS.

ONLY ABOUT 20% OF ARABS ARE MUSLIMS

Pointblank posted:

 

ONLY ABOUT 20% OF ARABS ARE MUSLIMS

Now where did you make up that fact. Christian populations in most Arab lands are small as Muslims are highly intolerant towards religious minorities.

ONLY ABOUT 20% OF ARABS ARE MUSLIMS

Where did you get this information, obvious not fact. That percentage is the reverse 80% of Arabs are Muslims, many Arab countries does not allow other religions to be practiced.

The shooter, named locally as 18-year-old Ali David Sonboly

 Someone with that name and of Iranian background, tell me what religion would he be??? Jew,Christian, Hindu????

RiffRaff posted:

I could easily say that Police brutality against blacks is because blacks have a history of crime and blacks need to examine themselves and solve their problems. WHy do they act the way they do?

But I know that you cannot paint one set of people with a broad brush, and police brutality is real and wrong, and there is a large set of police who are plain out racists

black crime stats are horribly skewed due to over policing, onerous judicial process and recidivism given the disenfranchisement convicts face. Blacks are about ten times more likely to be stopped by police and when arrested over charged and before the courts under represented legally.

And one can address the social issues as inability to get loans and when the can the steering or red lining in the real estate market. Then there is the insubstantial government services from schools to health services.

Black problems are not ones they can directly change on their own input as we see in the philosophy of presenting ones religion for public consumption.  They need to over come racism and institutional racism. Muslim problems are  easily settled if the will exist to meet in a global conclave and make a declaration of faith  by presenting a committed front against distortions of a faith. This is an inter Muslim community problem

He was the son of Shiite Muslims from Iran, he is Muslim.

Stormborn posted:

RiffRaff posted:

I could easily say that Police brutality against blacks is because blacks have a history of crime and blacks need to examine themselves and solve their problems. WHy do they act the way they do?

But I know that you cannot paint one set of people with a broad brush, and police brutality is real and wrong, and there is a large set of police who are plain out racists

black crime stats are horribly skewed due to over policing, onerous judicial process and recidivism given the disenfranchisement convicts face. Blacks are about ten times more likely to be stopped by police and when arrested over charged and before the courts under represented legally.

And one can address the social issues as inability to get loans and when the can the steering or red lining in the real estate market. Then there is the insubstantial government services from schools to health services.

Black problems are not ones they can directly change on their own input as we see in the philosophy of presenting ones religion for public consumption.  They need to over come racism and institutional racism. Muslim problems are  easily settled if the will exist to meet in a global conclave and make a declaration of faith  by presenting a committed front against distortions of a faith. This is an inter Muslim community problem

 

Stormy, are you suggesting that it is easier for some Muslim or group of Muslims reach into every nook and cranny of the Muslim world with a message to curb the current problems plaguing the Muslim world than it for Americans to reach into every nook and cranny of America to solve the racism and institutional racism plaguing America?

Secondly, if I use your analogy that "black crime stats are horribly skewed due to over policing, onerous judicial process and recidivism given the disenfranchisement convicts face", then I would have to conclude that the Muslim world doesn't have a terrorism problem given that the incidents of crimes by blacks in America vastly outnumbered the incidents of terrorists although a terrorist attack gets wall to wall reporting and rightfully so.

Stormborn posted:

Caribj is  making a point that you miss because of your commitment to the idea that Muslims are a peaceful people. That may be the practice and intent but there is ample evidence that something is happening in the Muslim community that causes it to fracture and disintegrate with some fragments becoming morbidly anti life.

That lack of tolerance is woefully absent in the Muslim community because there is no custom of interrogating the faith as one sees in Christianity and Judaism.

There is legacy of criticism of doctrine as in the talmud where the common man can read and grasp understanding. The myth is the Koran is pure and simple and sufficiently so that it alone provides that understanding. That is bunk. It is nullified by the fact that  there many mullahs rise from the weeds claiming official status as interpreters  of the faith and  are confusing the hell out of adherents. Worse the cause adherents to become fanatical regurgitation of Quranic verses to substantiate everything and think that alone is acceptable to others not of the faith.

I therefore can see why Caribj say the faith has a responsibility to itself for creating a summoning creed above and beyond theology and ritual that is not religion specific and  invites Muslims to accept others on their own terms.

Stormie,

.......your commitment to the idea that Muslims are a peaceful people.

Show me how you scientifically, by deductive reasoning, or by any methodology of knowledge, how this is not right. You're essentially saying that I should not be committed to the idea that Muslims are a peaceful people.

On this same score you have tailored the conversation that terrorism is right off the bat related to a religion, rather than a people. In other words you conflate Islam with Arabs (and a particular strain I might add). So you lay claim to a discussion I want no part of.

That lack of tolerance is woefully absent in the Muslim community because there is no custom of interrogating the faith as one sees in Christianity and Judaism.

Again Stormie, you're going to have to prove this statement as you made it. You do not know what goes on at sermons and after sermons about particular spaects of Islam and passages of the Quran are read to people who gather for Prayers or Reading. But you assert with God-like confidence that there is no interrogating (actually I like to use the term inquiry as the emotive meaning of interrogation is that something is not right and not only that something is missing).

The myth is the Koran is pure and simple and sufficiently so that it alone provides that understanding.

Not so. I do not know if Kzaazzz or others addressed this here in this thread or elsewhere, but two things: (i) something being pure and sufficient does not translate to the only understanding; (ii) that understanding is indeed the object of inquiry as society evolves. You're pretending that practice of Islam today is the same as it was in the 6th and 7th centuries. They drive cars today, they have iPhones and the Internet. They don't ride camels to work. [Reminds me of Obama telling Romney about the US military not needing more 17 the century rifles and carbines].

I therefore can see why Caribj say the faith has a responsibility to itself for creating a summoning creed above and beyond theology and ritual that is not religion specific and  invites Muslims to accept others on their own terms.

Even if I understand this painful concoction of words, you invoke that master of societal thinking CARIBNY to assert that Muslims must not treat their religion as the supreme center of the universe and accept others and their practices. Again, show me the empirical evidence, the science or the inference where Muslims (note - not a strain of Arabs) believe in the crap about the supremacy of their religion and way of life as above all others. You take the holy scriptures too literally when it comes to the Quran, but use nuance when it comes to the Talmud and the Bible. Nah suh?

caribny posted:

Kari posted:

 

You seem to be only one making this a problem for someone else,

Mankind is saying that Muslims need to deal with their problem.  Evidently you are hard of hearing, or are just in deep denial.

Honor killing.   Is that something that non Muslims can solve?

Fatwahs, and jihads.  Is that something that non Muslims can solve?

So someone draws insulting images of Mohammed.  Is that a death sentence?  Why this anger?

You need to admit that there are lunatics who use the Koran as inspiration.  Because its those behaviors that form the violence of the "lone wolf" syndrome that we have seen with increasing frequency.  Few of those people are tied to formal terrorist groups, yet they act.

Muslims have to figure out why that religion inspires so many to craziness.   Why don't we have people who are Hindus, Buddhist or Christian engaging in religious inspired violence to the same degree?  Because it should be clear to you by now that all of these acts aren't organized by ISIS.

Al Qaeda is virtually dead.  Yet events over the past couple of months should indicate that religious violence is far from over.  What is the normal response of the authorities. The lunatic involved in the killing wasn't on their radar.

Mali. Nigeria, Kenya, Indonesia, Philippines, again and again.  Points outside of the Middle East South Asia region.  Nations that have nothing to do with those who bombed Iraq.  People completely innocent of international conflicts being victimized.

There is a problem with how some interpret the Koran.  There are well organized systems to brainwash people.  ONLY Muslims can deal with that issue, because you certainly don't want others to interfere with your religion.

Honor killing.   Is that something that non Muslims can solve?

CARIBNY, where is honor killing an Islamic thing?

Fatwahs, and jihads.  Is that something that non Muslims can solve?

CARIBNY, where is fatwah that incites killing an Islamic thing? You obviously do not understand the term jihad and instead use the western understanding of murderers.

So someone draws insulting images of Mohammed.  Is that a death sentence?  Why this anger?

Where do you see Muslims expressing outrage at images of the Prophet to the extent of murder? Those killers who kill caroonists and painters are the exact people you call Jihadists. They are not Muslims.

You need to admit that there are lunatics who use the Koran as inspiration.

Oh, we've said this so many times but you choose not to listen to anything other than Muslims = kill, kill, kill. If a KKK guy kills Blacks in a church and says the Bible is his inspiration does that make the Bible an agent of killing?

Al Qaeda is virtually dead.  Yet events over the past couple of months should indicate that religious violence is far from over. 

Arab, not Islam. Political ideology, not religion. The tool is not the murderer. The gun is not the killer; the man who pulled the trigger of the gun is the murderer. Invoking Islam (deranged) does not make Islam the killer.

There is a problem with how some interpret the Koran.  There are well organized systems to brainwash people.  ONLY Muslims can deal with that issue, because you certainly don't want others to interfere with your religion.

There is a problem with how climate deniers interpret science. If some Arabs interpret a book one way that's different from others then boo hoo to them and not to the book.

You keep using Muslim problem like it's a broken record. Can't help you there fellah. They will come for you and you will keep saying it's a Muslim problem, instead of defending yourself.

kp posted:

ONLY ABOUT 20% OF ARABS ARE MUSLIMS

Where did you get this information, obvious not fact. That percentage is the reverse 80% of Arabs are Muslims, many Arab countries does not allow other religions to be practiced.

I believe that the percentage referred to here is about the refugees in Europe and not people living in Syria.

The UN states that there are over 4.2 million Syrians who fled their country and are officially refugees. Of this amount 3.4 million are in neighboring Arab countries and about 800,000 are in Europe. The US has less than 2,000.

I don't know the religious breakdown of the Syrians in Europe the majority being in Germany having traveled from Greece where their boats landed. But I have to think that the Christians, Yazidies, Menonite and even Alwaties (a Shiite offshoot of Islam) are a lot of those who fled, not to the neigjhboring Arab countries, but to Europe. Don't forget that refugees fled from areas that ISIS took over (so Sunnis would have lesser incentive to leave than people whom ISIS would enslave and murdered), and where Assad is bombing.

So I would not use the narrative that the overwhelming majority of Syrian refugees are Muslims. A great percentage are indeed Muslims, but there are a good number of non-Sunnis..

ksazma posted:

Stormborn posted:

RiffRaff posted:

I could easily say that Police brutality against blacks is because blacks have a history of crime and blacks need to examine themselves and solve their problems. WHy do they act the way they do?

But I know that you cannot paint one set of people with a broad brush, and police brutality is real and wrong, and there is a large set of police who are plain out racists

black crime stats are horribly skewed due to over policing, onerous judicial process and recidivism given the disenfranchisement convicts face. Blacks are about ten times more likely to be stopped by police and when arrested over charged and before the courts under represented legally.

And one can address the social issues as inability to get loans and when the can the steering or red lining in the real estate market. Then there is the insubstantial government services from schools to health services.

Black problems are not ones they can directly change on their own input as we see in the philosophy of presenting ones religion for public consumption.  They need to over come racism and institutional racism. Muslim problems are  easily settled if the will exist to meet in a global conclave and make a declaration of faith  by presenting a committed front against distortions of a faith. This is an inter Muslim community problem

 

Stormy, are you suggesting that it is easier for some Muslim or group of Muslims reach into every nook and cranny of the Muslim world with a message to curb the current problems plaguing the Muslim world than it for Americans to reach into every nook and cranny of America to solve the racism and institutional racism plaguing America?

Secondly, if I use your analogy that "black crime stats are horribly skewed due to over policing, onerous judicial process and recidivism given the disenfranchisement convicts face", then I would have to conclude that the Muslim world doesn't have a terrorism problem given that the incidents of crimes by blacks in America vastly outnumbered the incidents of terrorists although a terrorist attack gets wall to wall reporting and rightfully so.

 

No that is not what I am saying. Religion is diktat. It is written. It is expressed as interpretations. ISIS hijacked it because they can gull close to half a million people that what they believe is of the Koran. Were there a world body of Muslim scholars who can be authoritative then there would be some uniformity of interpretations.

Christianity has many of those and when modernity catches up encyclicals from the pope for example can be sent out to the parishes as instructive. Islam somehow never care to have such a body. Such a body could say what does it matter if anyone paints the prophet or burns the Koran. The Koran is facsimile and the real one is in the meaning of the words not any book.

If a mullah say beat your wide. The authority can say that is not permitted. etc. If a Rushdie writes a book critical of the religion then so be it. No mullah can say kill him. These are consensus bodies that could inform on the coherency of the law and prevent  misuse

ksazma posted:

Stormborn posted:

.

Stormy, are you suggesting that it is easier for some Muslim or group of Muslims .

Kaz what you suggested was enough.   Non Muslims cannot determine what people who represent themselves as Muslim clerics do.

Who is operating and funding those online sites that brainwash confused kids?  THAT is what Muslims have to be dealing with.

Kari posted:

.. A great percentage are indeed Muslims, but there are a good number of non-Sunnis..

You raise a good question. Any terrorist attacks by Christian Arabs outside of Lebanon?

kp posted:

RiffRaff posted:

Hey Carib

I am a Muslim, and I have never being taught to kill...why don't you base your opinion on what I say vs the ones who kill?

All Muslims are not killers, but recently the killings are done by Muslims. Peter pay for Paul and Paul Pays for all.

only the ones the media chose to highlight

caribny posted:

RiffRaff posted:

Nehru posted:

Shooting Children sitting down having a big Mac can only point to the brothers.

like the 26 in Sandy Hook?

Did any one hold up a bible and scream Jesus before they shot the kids?

Crime is one thing as is insanity, but what we are talking about are people who use their religion to justify their acts.

no one needs to hold up anything. Anytime something like this happens and the person has a Muslim name it is automatically deemed a terrorist act, when a non muslim does such act he is mentally challenged

Pointblank posted:

caribny posted:

RiffRaff posted:

Nehru posted:

Shooting Children sitting down having a big Mac can only point to the brothers.

like the 26 in Sandy Hook?

Did any one hold up a bible and scream Jesus before they shot the kids?

Crime is one thing as is insanity, but what we are talking about are people who use their religion to justify their acts.

no one needs to hold up anything. Anytime something like this happens and the person has a Muslim name it is automatically deemed a terrorist act, when a non muslim does such act he is mentally challenged

So you prefer to be called mentally challenged...

RiffRaff posted:

I haven't seen anything that says this fella is a Muslim...where you guys see this

IN THEIR BIGOTED MINDS!

caribny posted:

Plus Riffraff this isn't about people claiming that Muslims are more evil then others, or that Islam is evil.

This is about a religion that is locked in a crisis, which has led to some to exploit it for their own ends. This about me saying that its in the interest of Muslims to find the root problem.

You will note that no credible black person justifies the police shootings. Those involved were killed and 99.999% said good riddance.

RELIGION LOCKED IN CRISIS?

Is that is why the steady growth. If you spend time to actually study the religion and read the Holy Quran, you will stop running your mouth.

You more than anyone else loved to preach to non blacks that they do not know and cannot speak for blacks.

Now I am kindly inviting you to study Islam, after you invest that time, then I will like to hear from you, if Islam is a religion in crisis.

Pointblank posted:

.

no one needs to hold up anything. Anytime something like this happens and the person has a Muslim name it is automatically deemed a terrorist act, when a non muslim does such act he is mentally challenged

Please don't live in denial. It isn't helping you.  Religiously inspired violence is a problem within the Muslim world.  It is no longer an issue among others.