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Originally Posted by Chief:

They should allowed the people to vote and then form the Government.

Chief, a post-election coalition is not allowed under the Constitution. However your point may be that the individual parties at this juncture is greater than a combined one. That is really the question I've asked myself from the time I heard of the possible pre-election coalition. will the AFC's strength be whittled away by an electorate that still thinks binary - blackman party and coolieman party?

Kari
Originally Posted by Chief:

It is what it is right now so let's put every effort to ger a new government come May 11th.

 

Who is the PPP candidate for pRIME mINISTER

Let's hope that we get one that put the people's and nation's interests first. I feel the people who voted for the AFC voted on issues and not race. This alliance is for democracy and national unity; changes to the Constitution should be their primary focus on their campaign trail.

Mitwah
Originally Posted by Kari:
Originally Posted by Chief:

They should allowed the people to vote and then form the Government.

Chief, a post-election coalition is not allowed under the Constitution. However your point may be that the individual parties at this juncture is greater than a combined one. That is really the question I've asked myself from the time I heard of the possible pre-election coalition. will the AFC's strength be whittled away by an electorate that still thinks binary - blackman party and coolieman party?

Agreed, and its not often that I agree with you.

FM
Originally Posted by Mitwah:
Originally Posted by Chief:

It is what it is right now so let's put every effort to ger a new government come May 11th.

 

Who is the PPP candidate for pRIME mINISTER

Let's hope that we get one that put the people's and nation's interests first. I feel the people who voted for the AFC voted on issues and not race. This alliance is for democracy and national unity; changes to the Constitution should be their primary focus on their campaign trail.

Since the 60's people have not voted on issues, but race.

How does the AFC/APNU in 2015 convince them to vote differently.

Dem betta design a good campaign strategy.     

Tola
Originally Posted by caribny:
Originally Posted by Kari:
Originally Posted by Chief:

They should allowed the people to vote and then form the Government.

Chief, a post-election coalition is not allowed under the Constitution. However your point may be that the individual parties at this juncture is greater than a combined one. That is really the question I've asked myself from the time I heard of the possible pre-election coalition. will the AFC's strength be whittled away by an electorate that still thinks binary - blackman party and coolieman party?

Agreed, and its not often that I agree with you.

I don't agree. Don't you guys think the voters in Guyana would like to see the racial differences be squashed? This is the time to show it can be done. Rather than fighting it, embrace the dam thing.

cain
Originally Posted by cain:
 

I don't agree. Don't you guys think the voters in Guyana would like to see the racial differences be squashed? This is the time to show it can be done. Rather than fighting it, embrace the dam thing.

Mention that to Guyanese audiences and they clap, and then go and vote race again.

 

They aren't voting hatreds.  They are voting FEARS and until the root causes of these fears are addressed this is what they will do.

 

So how does Nagamootoo now tell Indians that they must vote for Granger as the president?  They have feared the PNC all their lives, and many times Nagamootoo himself would have told them how bad  the PNC was.

 

So what now?  Did APNU drastically change from the time when Nagamotoo refused to address the first protest against proroguing?

 

Too many mixed signals and then you wonder why the electorate will be confused.

FM
Last edited by Former Member
Originally Posted by caribny:
Originally Posted by cain:
 

I don't agree. Don't you guys think the voters in Guyana would like to see the racial differences be squashed? This is the time to show it can be done. Rather than fighting it, embrace the dam thing.

Mention that to Guyanese audiences and they clap, and then go and vote race again.

 

They aren't voting hatreds.  They are voting FEARS and until the root causes of these fears are addressed this is what they will do.

 

So how does Nagamootoo now tell Indians that they must vote for Granger as the president?  They have feared the PNC all their lives, and many times Nagamootoo himself would have told them how bad  the PNC was.

 

So what now?  Did APNU drastically change from the time when Nagamotoo refused to address the first protest against proroguing?

 

Too many mixed signals and then you wonder why the electorate will be confused.

In the three months to election time it is possible for the PPP to have more scandals, this in itself could tip the scale.

cain
Originally Posted by caribny:
Originally Posted by cain:
 

I don't agree. Don't you guys think the voters in Guyana would like to see the racial differences be squashed? This is the time to show it can be done. Rather than fighting it, embrace the dam thing.

Mention that to Guyanese audiences and they clap, and then go and vote race again.

 

They aren't voting hatreds.  They are voting FEARS and until the root causes of these fears are addressed this is what they will do.

 

So how does Nagamootoo now tell Indians that they must vote for Granger as the president?  They have feared the PNC all their lives, and many times Nagamootoo himself would have told them how bad  the PNC was.

 

So what now?  Did APNU drastically change from the time when Nagamotoo refused to address the first protest against proroguing?

 

Too many mixed signals and then you wonder why the electorate will be confused.

so . . . since the people are still nursing racial injuries generations old, you would have APNU/AFC do nothing but absorb PPP blows for the next 5 years and arrive at the exact same spot

 

brilliant!

FM
Last edited by Former Member

Bad decision for AFC and APNU to form this coalition and for AFC to acquiesce the presidential candidate's position to the APNU.

 

As many have said already this coalition basically takes away that third party option and takes it back to the same old PPP vs PNC. In this time of distrust between the two main races in Gy, minority government is good. 

 

At least if the AFC had the presidential candidate's position the 18-35 age group who mostly wants noting to do with the racial politics would have still had a reason to vote, but now I expect them to stay away from voting in large numbers.

 

PPP will win because of that and also the fact that blacks tend to stay away from polling more than Indos because when PNC was in power they did nothing for them anyway, whereas Indos see there is a resurgence in the rice industry which was almost killed under the PNC. On account of this Indos in the rice industry have seen some kind of income increase under the PPP.

 

I posted a few days ago that the elections will be decided by the 18-35 yr demographic and still feel so in that they will now stay away and hand a majority victory to the PPP who will then have a free reign as opposed to now in a minority government.

 

With the outside chance that the APNU/AFC coalition wins a majority the corruption will continue because the PNC will call the shots. That is why the viable third party option was so important. 

FM
Originally Posted by cain:
 

In the three months to election time it is possible for the PPP to have more scandals, this in itself could tip the scale.

Now if the AFC was independent, many upset with these scandals, but terrified of the PNC, would have voted AFC.

 

But now that AFC=PNC and the PPP is perfectly correct when they say this, I wonder who will these people support.  The party who they have always supported, but now who disappoints them, or the one that they have lived in fear of for the entirety of their lives.

 

I really cannot contemplate a scenario for large numbers of Africans voting for Ramotar, and to think that large numbers of Indians will support Granger is equally ludicrous.

FM
Originally Posted by politikalamity:

Bad decision for AFC and APNU to form this coalition and for AFC to acquiesce the presidential candidate's position to the APNU.

 

As many have said already this coalition basically takes away that third party option and takes it back to the same old PPP vs PNC. In this time of distrust between the two main races in Gy, minority government is good. 

 

At least if the AFC had the presidential candidate's position the 18-35 age group who mostly wants noting to do with the racial politics would have still had a reason to vote, but now I expect them to stay away from voting in large numbers.

 

PPP will win because of that and also the fact that blacks tend to stay away from polling more than Indos because when PNC was in power they did nothing for them anyway, whereas Indos see there is a resurgence in the rice industry which was almost killed under the PNC. On account of this Indos in the rice industry have seen some kind of income increase under the PPP.

 

I posted a few days ago that the elections will be decided by the 18-35 yr demographic and still feel so in that they will now stay away and hand a majority victory to the PPP who will then have a free reign as opposed to now in a minority government.

 

With the outside chance that the APNU/AFC coalition wins a majority the corruption will continue because the PNC will call the shots. That is why the viable third party option was so important. 

And yet another person who I agree with, and have almost never in the past.

 

The AFC has crucified itself on Nagamootoo's ambition and its a pity that AFC fanatics cannot see this.

 

But the bed is made, so the AFC will now have a battle to survive and remain relevant. If they lose that Region 5 and 6 vote they will be reduced to being like the WPA.  A party of well meaning but naÃŊve and impractical people.

FM
Originally Posted by caribny:
Now if the AFC was independent, many upset with these scandals, but terrified of the PNC, would have voted AFC.

 

But now that AFC=PNC and the PPP is perfectly correct when they say this, I wonder who will these people support.  The party who they have always supported, but now who disappoints them, or the one that they have lived in fear of for the entirety of their lives.

 

I really cannot contemplate a scenario for large numbers of Africans voting for Ramotar, and to think that large numbers of Indians will support Granger is equally ludicrous.

dude, the calculation (including yours) is that, in a 3-way race, the PPP would win a reduced plurality and we will be back to struggling with the poisoned fruits of the Burnham constitution which gives 100% of the power to a 40% party

 

NICIL, no PPC, national asset giveaways unchecked, etc., as per usual

 

what's so freakin hard for u to understand about that?

FM
Last edited by Former Member
Originally Posted by redux:
 

so . . . since the people are still nursing racial injuries generations old, you would have APNU/AFC do nothing but absorb PPP blows for the next 5 years and arrive at the exact same spot

 

brilliant!

  What neither APNU nor the AFC did was to go out and win support amongst the people once they took control of the parliament.  They remained distant, aloof and irrelevant, and of course there is the issue of gun shots at the PNC Congress which the PPP will definitely highlight.

 

 

They could have educated the people about the issues, but no they stayed in parliament. So now Indians are told, oh the PNC isn't so bad after all, and yet you think that they will believe. 

 

As recently as a few months ago the PNC as so toxic that Nagamootoo and Ramjattan were too terrified to display racial unity so stayed away, and sent their blacks to speak to those black people instead.  More recently when the PPP leaked rumors that the AFC was in talks with APNU, the AFC denied this and stated that this would never happen.  Suddenly elections are called and the AFC sings a different tune.

 

So what message should the poor PPP supporters, who were told all their lives about how evil the PNC is.  Now it isn't so bad, its the PPP which is bad.

 

Pardon them if they will be confused!

 

FM
Originally Posted by redux:
 

dude, the calculation (including yours) is that, in a 3-way race, the PPP would win a reduced plurality and we will be back to struggling with the poisoned fruits of the Burnham constitution which gives 100% of the power to a 40% party

 

NICIL, no PPC, national asset giveaways unchecked, etc., as per usual

 

what's so freakin hard for u to understand about that?

I wonder why you didn't think that the APNU and the AFC could have gone out to the people through arranging public meetings educating the people just as Cheddi and Burnham used to do in the 50s.

 

Instead they let the PPP behave as if it controlled parliament.

 

Now you wail that all they could have done is set up some bogus agreement where Granger remains all powerful, but because he is "magnanimous" he outsources some of the work to the AFC. 

 

And then you don't think that those who voted for Nagamootoo when he DID NOT mention any plan of joining a PNC dominated union, will blindly support him again. When all their lives they lived in fear of the PNC, rationally or irrationally!

 

Nagamootoo will have to march the length and breadth of Guyana telling people why suddenly the PNC isn't bad now, and that they must support Granger, because he decided to.

 

It will be a long tough road, and I don't think that 3 months will cut it.

FM

Redux please let me know when you heard APNU say anything about changing the constitution.  Why would the PNC do so when it is their constitution and their goal has always been to once again enjoy the fruits of it?

 

2/3 of the MPs have to approve any changes.  There is no scenario where this will occur without BOTH the PPP and APNU being in agreement.

 

Please learn to think through issues clearly.

FM
Originally Posted by caribny:
Originally Posted by redux:
 

so . . . since the people are still nursing racial injuries generations old, you would have APNU/AFC do nothing but absorb PPP blows for the next 5 years and arrive at the exact same spot

 

brilliant!

  What neither APNU nor the AFC did was to go out and win support amongst the people once they took control of the parliament.  They remained distant, aloof and irrelevant, and of course there is the issue of gun shots at the PNC Congress which the PPP will definitely highlight.

 

 

They could have educated the people about the issues, but no they stayed in parliament. So now Indians are told, oh the PNC isn't so bad after all, and yet you think that they will believe. 

 

As recently as a few months ago the PNC as so toxic that Nagamootoo and Ramjattan were too terrified to display racial unity so stayed away, and sent their blacks to speak to those black people instead.  More recently when the PPP leaked rumors that the AFC was in talks with APNU, the AFC denied this and stated that this would never happen.  Suddenly elections are called and the AFC sings a different tune.

 

So what message should the poor PPP supporters, who were told all their lives about how evil the PNC is.  Now it isn't so bad, its the PPP which is bad.

 

Pardon them if they will be confused!

hey, you are all over the place bellowing about the unchangeable reality of the racial divide, so when you start mouthing that a few speeches by Nagamootoo to Afro Audiences would move the needle, u sound like a low-rent politician who forgot what day/audience it is

 

dude, we all are aware of what could have/should have been done . . . but we are now here and big people decisions have to be made

 

you are either in the game or not . . . what is your [relevant] point anyway?

FM
Originally Posted by cain:
Originally Posted by caribny:
Originally Posted by Kari:
Originally Posted by Chief:

They should allowed the people to vote and then form the Government.

Chief, a post-election coalition is not allowed under the Constitution. However your point may be that the individual parties at this juncture is greater than a combined one. That is really the question I've asked myself from the time I heard of the possible pre-election coalition. will the AFC's strength be whittled away by an electorate that still thinks binary - blackman party and coolieman party?

Agreed, and its not often that I agree with you.

I don't agree. Don't you guys think the voters in Guyana would like to see the racial differences be squashed? This is the time to show it can be done. Rather than fighting it, embrace the dam thing.

Especially the young voters who do not know Jagan and Burnham.

Chief
Originally Posted by caribny:
Originally Posted by Chief:
 

Especially the young voters who do not know Jagan and Burnham.

many young voters live their own reality today and race is still very much a part of life in Guyana, as many an unemployed black UG graduate will tell you.

So unemployment only affects black kids in GY carib?

FM
Originally Posted by redux:
 

, so when you start mouthing that a few speeches by Nagamootoo to Afro Audiences would move the needle, u sound like a low-rent politician who forgot what day/audience it is

 

Nagamootoo did not want to speak in front of black people because he was afraid that the PPP would raise Indian paranoia. 

 

He now proves the deepest fears of many Indians as he now jumps into bed with the enemy (the PNC).

 

Nagamootoo isn't going to be the president so he can continue to ignore blacks.  The PNC supporters fully know that he and the other AFCites will be kept under control.  It isn't their paranoia you ought to worry about.

 

The paranoia that you ought to worry about is the Indian paranioa.  Yes that same one which terrified him so much that he and Ramjattan boycotted that protest and yet Nigel Hughes and Patterson went.  Racial pandering and no way one can deny that it was.  If the AFC wanted a low profile at that event why does sending one of their best known speakers (Nigel Hughes) accomplish this.

FM
Last edited by Former Member
Originally Posted by HM_Redux:
 

So unemployment only affects black kids in GY carib?

Unemployment is HIGHER among them and many private companies are staffed full of Indians, so what do you want them to think?  Especially as they see fewer and fewer blacks the higher up they look from the security guard and clerical positions.

 

An Afro Guyanese woman, living in Antigua when asked why she liked it, explained that there she isn't made to feel as if there is something being wrong with being black.

 

If you wish to join a coalition with black people you best learn to understand their sentiments, even if you don't agree with them.

 

Do yourself a favor and read through KN one day and make note of how many blacks you see in top positions in Guyana.

FM
Last edited by Former Member
Originally Posted by HM_Redux:

Carib like you wukkin fuh de PPP? hehehehe I always knew you were a die hard racist. 

 

It is absolutely hilarious to watch you at work..............i love it....

Oh yes this brings back memories of 2011. I warned the AFC that they were ignoring the black vote, and was accuse of being a PPP.

 

Then at the last minute the AFC organizes a meeting in Albouystown and only the DJ showed up, apart from the speakers.  Even Gerhard had to admit that maybe I was right and that maybe their put too much focus on Regions 5 and 6.

 

The AFC ended up with 11% of the votes, this after boasting about how they would beat the PNC.  And they lost much of their regions 4 and 10 votes.

 

And now you start again.

 

Feel free, and just hope that I am as wrong this time, as I was right the last time.

FM

And of course I noticed that I am racist because I speak about racism against blacks.

 

You sure you want to jump into bed with APNU, because they are packed with people who think exactly that, and who will not like you if you call them racists as a result.

 

I mean you are in a coalition with people and you haven't even stopped to understand how they think!

FM

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